Author Topic: JB's next CCRC submission/CoA hearing...  (Read 25127 times)

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Offline puglove

Re: JB's next CCRC submission/CoA hearing...
« Reply #90 on: January 21, 2018, 08:14:15 AM »
Excellent post pugs!

Thanks Caro!

(But I should have said OVERestimated.   ?8)@)-) )
Jeremy Bamber kicked Mike Tesko in the fanny.

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: JB's next CCRC submission/CoA hearing...
« Reply #91 on: January 21, 2018, 01:02:38 PM »
I didn't say VDM didn't have qualifications, I'm sure he has lots of experience but he didn't investigate the Bamber case whereas Fletcher did.

If VDM provides expert opinion for DPP/COA/CCRC then yes he will need to be case specific but I thought we were discussing his level of experience and qualifications compared with Fletcher's?  And whether or not Fletcher had the credentials to provide reliable expert testimony at JB's trial?  

I will start a new thread on this next week and extract sections from a book authored by VDM which contradict Fletcher's testimony.  Eg Fletcher told the court it was "almost certain" blood would deposit in/on rifle barrel/silencer from SC's contact gsw.  Whereas VDM examined numerous firearms involved in contact gunshot wounds and found a significant % (can't recall the fig off the top of my head will check next week but approx 50%) didn't present with blood in/on barrels.  One could argue the conditions with SC gave rise to 'drawback' but all the literature, not just from VDM, shows this isn't the case:

- A silencer lowers the PSI making drawback ?  Would like to say more but can't at this stage.  

- Drawback is mostly observed with large calibre firearms and high velocity ammo neither of which were used in this case.

- Drawback is mostly observed with gsw's to the head.  NC sustained a gsw to the head but his blood groupings were not found in the silencer.  

Anyway I don't think I need to try and convince you about the silencer as I think I'm right in saying you believe it was fabricated?  All of Fletcher's testimony is capable of being obliterated from the face of planet earth which is most definitely round! 
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: JB's next CCRC submission/CoA hearing...
« Reply #92 on: January 21, 2018, 01:47:50 PM »
Holl, I know that you've done your homework, visited a gun shop, fannied around with some bullets....but have you tried to aim and shoot the gun in question? Bearing in mind that Sheila had never handled that gun before? I've said before that BT has the exact same gun (he has many guns), he gave me a go to shoot at the magpies that raid the swallow nests in the stables. He might as well have given me a giant parsnip. It's not a big gun, but it's heavy, unbalanced and unwieldy, by the time I'd got it into position the magpies had died of old age.

Whoever shot the Bamber family had used a gun before.... they obviously underestimated the power of it, but they could hold it steady, point it, fire it and...most importantly, reload it.

The purpose of the visit to the gun shop was just to check out the cartridges.  Back to our friend Fletcher,  he said when he loaded them they produced a black discolouration to his hands and had a greasy feel.  This contradicted the manufactures key features doc so I decided to check them out for myself and found:

- loading the cartridges into the mag was easier than replacing a battery into a tv remote.  There was nothing remotely difficult about the task.  It's intuitive and only possible to load them the correct way.  IMO even a complete novice to the task would have to suffer severe learning difficulties to find any difficulty.  

- my hands were perfectly clean to the naked eye.  There was no discolouration or greasy feel or odour.  

You may recall Myster suggested maybe the manufactures changed the way they were made.  I emailed Eley and was told no changes.  

The only firearm I've ever fired was my brother's air rifle.  He set up some targets in the garden for us to shoot.  I don't recall thinking it was heavy or unwieldy and I'm pretty small fully grown: 5' 3.5" 8st 7llbs.    I just kept thinking what if it backfires!   Most of the top female golfers in the world are from SE Asia ie petite and boy can they hit the ball!  

The rifle is the exact same length as my golf clubs.  I looked up the weight of the Anshutz (I'll check it again next week as I can't recall the exact figs now) but it isn't heavy in relation to other objects SC must have handled including the twins.  SC was a single mother living in London and relying on her own steam to get out and about.  She was used to carrying and handling childcare paraphernalia eg twin buggy, heavy shopping: food, drink, house cleaning, toiletries and of course lifting and carrying the twins.  

If you consider other mass shootings involving family members in private dwellings eg Bain and Defeo the perps were experienced with firearms and shot more adults with similar low powered firearms to the rifle used at WHF using far fewer cartridges.  The soc at WHF was IMO compatible with an inexperienced shooter.  Of course the counter argument to this is that JB went for overkill to make it appear amateurish and frenzied.  
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: JB's next CCRC submission/CoA hearing...
« Reply #93 on: January 22, 2018, 01:48:46 PM »
Here's the tech spec for the rifle:

Total weight: 3.1kg/7 llbs rounded up

Total length: 109cm/43" rounded up

http://jga.anschuetz-sport.com/index.php5?produktID=313&menu=106&sprache=1&produktShow=detail&PHPSESSID=77f29b217478cf5d82b7c0201cc4e627
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: JB's next CCRC submission/CoA hearing...
« Reply #94 on: January 22, 2018, 02:22:30 PM »
Here's the tech spec for the rifle:

Total weight: 3.1kg/7 llbs rounded up

Total length: 109cm/43" rounded up

http://jga.anschuetz-sport.com/index.php5?produktID=313&menu=106&sprache=1&produktShow=detail&PHPSESSID=77f29b217478cf5d82b7c0201cc4e627

Some items that SC must have handled heavier than the rifle:

- Twin baby buggy - almost 4 times the weight of the rifle

https://www.johnlewis.com/baby-jogger-city-mini-twin-pushchair-crimson-grey/p1125659

- A large box of washing powder - over twice as heavy as the rifle.  Bearing in mind SC wasn't a car driver.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Professional-Ariel-Colour-245-Washes/dp/B012H3Y8Q4

- Ironing board - over twice as heavy as rifle

https://www.johnlewis.com/brabantia-titan-oval-ironing-board-135-x-45cm/p166796

- Averaqe weight of new born twin - nearly twice as heavy as rifle

https://www.thebump.com/a/average-birth-weight-for-multiples

Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Myster

Re: JB's next CCRC submission/CoA hearing...
« Reply #95 on: January 26, 2018, 11:03:44 AM »
The purpose of the visit to the gun shop was just to check out the cartridges.  Back to our friend Fletcher,  he said when he loaded them they produced a black discolouration to his hands and had a greasy feel.  This contradicted the manufactures key features doc so I decided to check them out for myself and found:

- loading the cartridges into the mag was easier than replacing a battery into a tv remote.  There was nothing remotely difficult about the task.  It's intuitive and only possible to load them the correct way.  IMO even a complete novice to the task would have to suffer severe learning difficulties to find any difficulty. 

- my hands were perfectly clean to the naked eye.  There was no discolouration or greasy feel or odour. 

You may recall Myster suggested maybe the manufactures changed the way they were made.  I emailed Eley and was told no changes.

The only firearm I've ever fired was my brother's air rifle.  He set up some targets in the garden for us to shoot.  I don't recall thinking it was heavy or unwieldy and I'm pretty small fully grown: 5' 3.5" 8st 7llbs.    I just kept thinking what if it backfires!   Most of the top female golfers in the world are from SE Asia ie petite and boy can they hit the ball! 

The rifle is the exact same length as my golf clubs.  I looked up the weight of the Anshutz (I'll check it again next week as I can't recall the exact figs now) but it isn't heavy in relation to other objects SC must have handled including the twins.  SC was a single mother living in London and relying on her own steam to get out and about.  She was used to carrying and handling childcare paraphernalia eg twin buggy, heavy shopping: food, drink, house cleaning, toiletries and of course lifting and carrying the twins. 

If you consider other mass shootings involving family members in private dwellings eg Bain and Defeo the perps were experienced with firearms and shot more adults with similar low powered firearms to the rifle used at WHF using far fewer cartridges.  The soc at WHF was IMO compatible with an inexperienced shooter.  Of course the counter argument to this is that JB went for overkill to make it appear amateurish and frenzied. 

If you're desperate you could email CAL to confirm that MF told her that the bullets were coated with beeswax (which gives/gave off a distinctive smell) rather than paraffin wax.
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: JB's next CCRC submission/CoA hearing...
« Reply #96 on: January 26, 2018, 04:57:18 PM »
If you're desperate you could email CAL to confirm that MF told her that the bullets were coated with beeswax (which gives/gave off a distinctive smell) rather than paraffin wax.

 (ty6e[

In Fletchers testimony he states that loading the cartridges into the mag caused black discolouration to his hands.  As you know this is at complete odds with my own experiences at the gun shop.  I think the way forward is for a forensic scientist to load the exact same cartridges into the exact same mag and see what the result is.  There's so much of Fletcher's testimony that simply doesn't ring true.  I will post it up on the relevant thread when I have time.  Maybe I lack objectivity when reading it but I can't help thinking all the way through he wasn't there as an objective expert witness but someone who was for whatever reason(s) desperate to assist the prosecution in securing a conviction.  I will provide some examples when I have time. 
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Myster

Re: JB's next CCRC submission/CoA hearing...
« Reply #97 on: January 27, 2018, 11:23:18 AM »
(ty6e[

In Fletchers testimony he states that loading the cartridges into the mag caused black discolouration to his hands.  As you know this is at complete odds with my own experiences at the gun shop.  I think the way forward is for a forensic scientist to load the exact same cartridges into the exact same mag and see what the result is.  There's so much of Fletcher's testimony that simply doesn't ring true.  I will post it up on the relevant thread when I have time.  Maybe I lack objectivity when reading it but I can't help thinking all the way through he wasn't there as an objective expert witness but someone who was for whatever reason(s) desperate to assist the prosecution in securing a conviction.  I will provide some examples when I have time.

 (ty6e[ ... still flogging a dead horse, I see!

The bullets and brass casings used at WHF might have been covered in more lead dust than those you experienced recently and the manufacturing process could have changed significantly since '85, with less contamination.  Similarly, the spring in the original magazine might have been stronger than the one which you tried to load.
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: JB's next CCRC submission/CoA hearing...
« Reply #98 on: January 27, 2018, 01:31:53 PM »
(ty6e[ ... still flogging a dead horse, I see!

The bullets and brass casings used at WHF might have been covered in more lead dust than those you experienced recently and the manufacturing process could have changed significantly since '85, with less contamination.  Similarly, the spring in the original magazine might have been stronger than the one which you tried to load.

More like 1 4 Arthur!

I'm pleased you raised these points as I was going to bring them up next week.  I'm out and about at the mo on my phone so can't post up extracts of Fletcher's testimony but to give you an idea:

- It seems the cartridges produced at trial had holes in to empty the contents and make safe.  Surely unless they were thoroughly rinsed thru and dried the contents would cling to the sides and contaminate the hands.  Had a coffee in my local Waitrose cafe this morning.  I noticed the chocolate powder shaker for cappuccino had powder clinging to the sides and top.  In fact it even contaminated the lid of my latte. 

- It also appears the magazine used at trial was the one from WHF which had clearly been bashed around on 7th Aug hence the broken stock.  Not only this but Fletcher admitted dropping the rifle and mag from height to see if he could cause a discharge by jarring!  Maybe this accounts for my experience at the gun shop ie it wad easy as the mag was undamaged. 




Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?