UK Justice Forum 🇬🇧
Disappeared and Abducted Children and Young Adults => Madeleine McCann (3) disappeared from her parent's holiday apartment at Ocean Club, Praia da Luz, Portugal on 3 May 2007. No trace of her has ever been found. => Topic started by: gilet on May 06, 2013, 11:05:19 PM
-
(http://i1296.photobucket.com/albums/ag1/gilet2013/BJnJWJICAAA-rjKjpglarge_zps6f0f5a5a.jpg)
Madeleine McCann's mum made an emotional return to Portugal yesterday to the resort where her daughter vanished.
Kate McCann wanted to say a prayer for her little girl at the Our Lady of Light church in Praia da Luz.
Full Story Page 11
-
Gutted. Poor thing.
-
(http://i1296.photobucket.com/albums/ag1/gilet2013/BJnJWJICAAA-rjKjpglarge_zps6f0f5a5a.jpg)
Madeleine McCann's mum made an emotional return to Portugal yesterday to the resort where her daughter vanished.
Kate McCann wanted to say a prayer for her little girl at the Our Lady of Light church in Praia da Luz.
Full Story Page 11
And ?
-
Gutted. Poor thing.
Didnt step a foot in Portugal to set every stone aside though for a reconstruction....ever, not even in her own c4 reconstruction......Madeleine is the only poor thing here as you put it....shameless
Agreed.
-
That sounds so sad
There is no mention of Gerry, but he must have gone too, that is much too emotional a journey for her to have made without him
-
And it is a report of a difficult and emotional period in the life of a woman whose child is still missing.
As for the reconstruction. When Amaral of someone from the PJ apologises for the disgraceful failure to do a reconstruction in May/June 2007 related to finding a missing child, then perhaps comments about the reconstruction projected for mid 2008 may become more meaningful.
And the clearly "emotional" (or should that be "passionate"?) Redblossom should remember that claiming that the McCanns ever refused to attend a reconstruction is simply incorrect. They never did that.
Kate McCann is a mother who does not know where her little girl is. When people show how lacking in empathy for such a person they are by posting as Redblossom and Faithlilly have done they are revealing to us just what kind of people they really are.
-
That sounds so sad
There is no mention of Gerry, but he must have gone too, that is much too emotional a journey for her to have made without him
Interesting that you make such a presumption with absolutely no evidence for it. There is no reason why Gerry must have gone at all. Perhaps there was a decision between the couple that Gerry would remain at home to look after the twins?
Its very interesting that some people jump to conclusions without evidence. A strange mindset revealed.
-
And it is a report of a difficult and emotional period in the life of a woman whose child is still missing.
As for the reconstruction. When Amaral of someone from the PJ apologises for the disgraceful failure to do a reconstruction in May/June 2007 related to finding a missing child, then perhaps comments about the reconstruction projected for mid 2008 may become more meaningful.
And the clearly "emotional" (or should that be "passionate"?) Redblossom should remember that claiming that the McCanns ever refused to attend a reconstruction is simply incorrect. They never did that.
Kate McCann is a mother who does not know where her little girl is. When people show how lacking in empathy for such a person they are by posting as Redblossom and Faithlilly have done they are revealing to us just what kind of people they really
What a load of sanctimonious tosh.
-
That sounds so sad
There is no mention of Gerry, but he must have gone too, that is much too emotional a journey for her to have made without him
Interesting that you make such a presumption with absolutely no evidence for it. There is no reason why Gerry must have gone at all. Perhaps there was a decision between the couple that Gerry would remain at home to look after the twins?
Its very interesting that some people jump to conclusions without evidence. A strange mindset revealed.
I am assuming Gerry went with Kate, even though he is not mentioned in the small piece on the front page because I imagine that they would need to make such a heartbreaking journey together at this time ( Madeleine's birthday ) to offer each other support and comfort
-
And it is a report of a difficult and emotional period in the life of a woman whose child is still missing.
As for the reconstruction. When Amaral of someone from the PJ apologises for the disgraceful failure to do a reconstruction in May/June 2007 related to finding a missing child, then perhaps comments about the reconstruction projected for mid 2008 may become more meaningful.
And the clearly "emotional" (or should that be "passionate"?) Redblossom should remember that claiming that the McCanns ever refused to attend a reconstruction is simply incorrect. They never did that.
Kate McCann is a mother who does not know where her little girl is. When people show how lacking in empathy for such a person they are by posting as Redblossom and Faithlilly have done they are revealing to us just what kind of people they really are.
It's not empathy we are lacking in it's incredulity.
Clear lack of empathy.
Incredulity in what? That a child is missing? Don't be so ridiculous.
Your inability to accept the legal presumption of innocence especially after a lengthy police investigation which found no evidence of any crime by Kate is quite disgraceful. There is no excuse for your lack of empathy. It is simply your nature.
-
That sounds so sad
There is no mention of Gerry, but he must have gone too, that is much too emotional a journey for her to have made without him
Interesting that you make such a presumption with absolutely no evidence for it. There is no reason why Gerry must have gone at all. Perhaps there was a decision between the couple that Gerry would remain at home to look after the twins?
Its very interesting that some people jump to conclusions without evidence. A strange mindset revealed.
I am assuming Gerry went with Kate, even though he is not mentioned in the small piece on the front page because I imagine that they would need to make such a heartbreaking journey together at this time ( Madeleine's birthday ) to offer each other support and comfort
I always find it interesting that certain posters when discussing the case enjoy guesswork rather than waiting for actual evidence or information.
Guesswork is simply not a sensible way of reaching the truth.
Your presumption about Gerry is simply guesswork.
-
Its very interesting that some people jump to conclusions without evidence. A strange mindset revealed.
What else do you do, Gilet, when you assume "Kate McCann is a mother who does not know where her little girl is" ? You believe Mrs McCann who claims her little girl was abducted, and you do it well, but it's belief ! No evidence !
-
Please keep to topic. TY
-
Its very interesting that some people jump to conclusions without evidence. A strange mindset revealed.
What else do you do, Gilet, when you assume "Kate McCann is a mother who does not know where her little girl is" ? You believe Mrs McCann who claims her little girl was abducted, and you do it well, but it's belief ! No evidence !
Your assumption that I believe in abduction is presumptious.
I have not referred to abduction. I have referred to a child who is missing which is a fact.
I have also referred to the presumption of innocence. Again a fact in legal terms.
Kate is the mother of a missing child. In legal terms she does not know where her child is. In her words, she does not know where here child is. I am perfectly entitled to presume as a person who abides by the law (including the law of Portugal) that she is telling the truth.
When I am presented with any evidence which even begins to convince me that Kate McCann was involved in any way in the disappearance of her child (other than in the fact that she was not present at the time in the apartment itself) then I will consider changing my view about her presumed innocence. Till then I will accept the word of the Portuguese officials.
You are wholly mistaken when you claim I jump to a conclusion. In reality I do precisely the opposite. I prefer to make no judgement about her and to await evidence for her guilt. Till then I will show empathy with a woman whose child is missing. I am sorry you cannot do the same.
-
http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/view/313194/Kate-McCann-s-Portugal-return/
KATE MCCANN'S PORTUGAL RETURN
7th May 2013 By Jerry Lawton
MADELEINE McCann’s mum yesterday made an emotional return to the holiday resort where her daughter vanished.
Kate McCann, 45, flew out to Portugal three days after collapsing in tears at a public prayer service to mark the sixth anniversary of the disappearance.
One of her first visits will be to the Our Lady Of The Light church in Praia da Luz where the devout Catholic prayed daily for her daughter in the four months after she was snatched.
A friend said yesterday: “She will spend a few days in Praia da Luz. She feels close to Madeleine there.’
During the trip, Kate will be reunited with her English and Portuguese friends.
But it is not known whether the former GP will visit the Ocean Club where her daughter disappeared during their holiday in May 2007. It is believed Kate has never ventured back into apartment 5a, where Madeleine was last seen asleep in bed.
At the time Kate, husband Gerry, 44, and seven pals were dining in a nearby tapas restaurant.
The returning mum is likely to find a resort with few reminders of her daughter. But Kate has asked the public: “Please don’t forget Madeleine.’’ And during TV interviews she urged: “Take posters of her when you go on holiday.
“Please help keep her in the public eye.’’
Kate is due to fly back to the Britain in time for Madeleine’s 10th birthday on Sunday.
-
http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/view/313194/Kate-McCann-s-Portugal-return/
KATE MCCANN'S PORTUGAL RETURN
7th May 2013 By Jerry Lawton
MADELEINE McCann’s mum yesterday made an emotional return to the holiday resort where her daughter vanished.
Kate McCann, 45, flew out to Portugal three days after collapsing in tears at a public prayer service to mark the sixth anniversary of the disappearance.
One of her first visits will be to the Our Lady Of The Light church in Praia da Luz where the devout Catholic prayed daily for her daughter in the four months after she was snatched.
A friend said yesterday: “She will spend a few days in Praia da Luz. She feels close to Madeleine there.’
During the trip, Kate will be reunited with her English and Portuguese friends.
But it is not known whether the former GP will visit the Ocean Club where her daughter disappeared during their holiday in May 2007. It is believed Kate has never ventured back into apartment 5a, where Madeleine was last seen asleep in bed.
At the time Kate, husband Gerry, 44, and seven pals were dining in a nearby tapas restaurant.
The returning mum is likely to find a resort with few reminders of her daughter. But Kate has asked the public: “Please don’t forget Madeleine.’’ And during TV interviews she urged: “Take posters of her when you go on holiday.
“Please help keep her in the public eye.’’
Kate is due to fly back to the Britain in time for Madeleine’s 10th birthday on Sunday.
I wonder does Icabodcrane still think his guess as to Gerry's presence in Portugal is correct? It may be, but its equally possible that he is at home with the twins. I prefer to make no judgements about things without evidence. Others like Icabodcrane apparently prefer guesswork.
-
http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/view/313194/Kate-McCann-s-Portugal-return/
KATE MCCANN'S PORTUGAL RETURN
7th May 2013 By Jerry Lawton
MADELEINE McCann’s mum yesterday made an emotional return to the holiday resort where her daughter vanished.
Kate McCann, 45, flew out to Portugal three days after collapsing in tears at a public prayer service to mark the sixth anniversary of the disappearance.
One of her first visits will be to the Our Lady Of The Light church in Praia da Luz where the devout Catholic prayed daily for her daughter in the four months after she was snatched.
A friend said yesterday: “She will spend a few days in Praia da Luz. She feels close to Madeleine there.’
During the trip, Kate will be reunited with her English and Portuguese friends.
But it is not known whether the former GP will visit the Ocean Club where her daughter disappeared during their holiday in May 2007. It is believed Kate has never ventured back into apartment 5a, where Madeleine was last seen asleep in bed.
At the time Kate, husband Gerry, 44, and seven pals were dining in a nearby tapas restaurant.
The returning mum is likely to find a resort with few reminders of her daughter. But Kate has asked the public: “Please don’t forget Madeleine.’’ And during TV interviews she urged: “Take posters of her when you go on holiday.
“Please help keep her in the public eye.’’
Kate is due to fly back to the Britain in time for Madeleine’s 10th birthday on Sunday.
I wonder does Icabodcrane still think his guess as to Gerry's presence in Portugal is correct? It may be, but its equally possible that he is at home with the twins. I prefer to make no judgements about things without evidence. Others like Icabodcrane apparently prefer guesswork.
Sounds like Gerry isn't there to me
-
http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/view/313194/Kate-McCann-s-Portugal-return/
KATE MCCANN'S PORTUGAL RETURN
7th May 2013 By Jerry Lawton
MADELEINE McCann’s mum yesterday made an emotional return to the holiday resort where her daughter vanished.
Kate McCann, 45, flew out to Portugal three days after collapsing in tears at a public prayer service to mark the sixth anniversary of the disappearance.
One of her first visits will be to the Our Lady Of The Light church in Praia da Luz where the devout Catholic prayed daily for her daughter in the four months after she was snatched.
A friend said yesterday: “She will spend a few days in Praia da Luz. She feels close to Madeleine there.’
During the trip, Kate will be reunited with her English and Portuguese friends.
But it is not known whether the former GP will visit the Ocean Club where her daughter disappeared during their holiday in May 2007. It is believed Kate has never ventured back into apartment 5a, where Madeleine was last seen asleep in bed.
At the time Kate, husband Gerry, 44, and seven pals were dining in a nearby tapas restaurant.
The returning mum is likely to find a resort with few reminders of her daughter. But Kate has asked the public: “Please don’t forget Madeleine.’’ And during TV interviews she urged: “Take posters of her when you go on holiday.
“Please help keep her in the public eye.’’
Kate is due to fly back to the Britain in time for Madeleine’s 10th birthday on Sunday.
I wonder does Icabodcrane still think his guess as to Gerry's presence in Portugal is correct? It may be, but its equally possible that he is at home with the twins. I prefer to make no judgements about things without evidence. Others like Icabodcrane apparently prefer guesswork.
Sounds like Gerry isn't there to me
So?
Is it a problem for you? Its their business.
-
http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/view/313194/Kate-McCann-s-Portugal-return/
KATE MCCANN'S PORTUGAL RETURN
7th May 2013 By Jerry Lawton
MADELEINE McCann’s mum yesterday made an emotional return to the holiday resort where her daughter vanished.
Kate McCann, 45, flew out to Portugal three days after collapsing in tears at a public prayer service to mark the sixth anniversary of the disappearance.
One of her first visits will be to the Our Lady Of The Light church in Praia da Luz where the devout Catholic prayed daily for her daughter in the four months after she was snatched.
A friend said yesterday: “She will spend a few days in Praia da Luz. She feels close to Madeleine there.’
During the trip, Kate will be reunited with her English and Portuguese friends.
But it is not known whether the former GP will visit the Ocean Club where her daughter disappeared during their holiday in May 2007. It is believed Kate has never ventured back into apartment 5a, where Madeleine was last seen asleep in bed.
At the time Kate, husband Gerry, 44, and seven pals were dining in a nearby tapas restaurant.
The returning mum is likely to find a resort with few reminders of her daughter. But Kate has asked the public: “Please don’t forget Madeleine.’’ And during TV interviews she urged: “Take posters of her when you go on holiday.
“Please help keep her in the public eye.’’
Kate is due to fly back to the Britain in time for Madeleine’s 10th birthday on Sunday.
I wonder does Icabodcrane still think his guess as to Gerry's presence in Portugal is correct? It may be, but its equally possible that he is at home with the twins. I prefer to make no judgements about things without evidence. Others like Icabodcrane apparently prefer guesswork.
Sounds like Gerry isn't there to me
And?
I just think it makes it all the sadder, that's all
Sat there in that little church on her own ... don't you think that's sad ?
-
http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/view/313194/Kate-McCann-s-Portugal-return/
KATE MCCANN'S PORTUGAL RETURN
7th May 2013 By Jerry Lawton
MADELEINE McCann’s mum yesterday made an emotional return to the holiday resort where her daughter vanished.
Kate McCann, 45, flew out to Portugal three days after collapsing in tears at a public prayer service to mark the sixth anniversary of the disappearance.
One of her first visits will be to the Our Lady Of The Light church in Praia da Luz where the devout Catholic prayed daily for her daughter in the four months after she was snatched.
A friend said yesterday: “She will spend a few days in Praia da Luz. She feels close to Madeleine there.’
During the trip, Kate will be reunited with her English and Portuguese friends.
But it is not known whether the former GP will visit the Ocean Club where her daughter disappeared during their holiday in May 2007. It is believed Kate has never ventured back into apartment 5a, where Madeleine was last seen asleep in bed.
At the time Kate, husband Gerry, 44, and seven pals were dining in a nearby tapas restaurant.
The returning mum is likely to find a resort with few reminders of her daughter. But Kate has asked the public: “Please don’t forget Madeleine.’’ And during TV interviews she urged: “Take posters of her when you go on holiday.
“Please help keep her in the public eye.’’
Kate is due to fly back to the Britain in time for Madeleine’s 10th birthday on Sunday.
I wonder does Icabodcrane still think his guess as to Gerry's presence in Portugal is correct? It may be, but its equally possible that he is at home with the twins. I prefer to make no judgements about things without evidence. Others like Icabodcrane apparently prefer guesswork.
Sounds like Gerry isn't there to me
Agreed. In my view always best to wait for information rather than making hasty guesses.
There are lots of places he could be. Portugal, Rothley looking after the twins, Glasgow for a few days R&R, on a conference in the Bahamas, in London at an international nuclear meeting, in Rome chatting to the Pope, in Moscow chatting to Putin even. Without some kind of information as to his whereabouts then its pretty futile guessing.
Its always revealing when people make guesses with nothing concrete to base their guesses on. It must be something else on which the guess was based.
-
http://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/view/313194/Kate-McCann-s-Portugal-return/
KATE MCCANN'S PORTUGAL RETURN
7th May 2013 By Jerry Lawton
MADELEINE McCann’s mum yesterday made an emotional return to the holiday resort where her daughter vanished.
Kate McCann, 45, flew out to Portugal three days after collapsing in tears at a public prayer service to mark the sixth anniversary of the disappearance.
One of her first visits will be to the Our Lady Of The Light church in Praia da Luz where the devout Catholic prayed daily for her daughter in the four months after she was snatched.
A friend said yesterday: “She will spend a few days in Praia da Luz. She feels close to Madeleine there.’
During the trip, Kate will be reunited with her English and Portuguese friends.
But it is not known whether the former GP will visit the Ocean Club where her daughter disappeared during their holiday in May 2007. It is believed Kate has never ventured back into apartment 5a, where Madeleine was last seen asleep in bed.
At the time Kate, husband Gerry, 44, and seven pals were dining in a nearby tapas restaurant.
The returning mum is likely to find a resort with few reminders of her daughter. But Kate has asked the public: “Please don’t forget Madeleine.’’ And during TV interviews she urged: “Take posters of her when you go on holiday.
“Please help keep her in the public eye.’’
Kate is due to fly back to the Britain in time for Madeleine’s 10th birthday on Sunday.
I wonder does Icabodcrane still think his guess as to Gerry's presence in Portugal is correct? It may be, but its equally possible that he is at home with the twins. I prefer to make no judgements about things without evidence. Others like Icabodcrane apparently prefer guesswork.
Sounds like Gerry isn't there to me
And?
I just think it makes it all the sadder, that's all
Sat there in that little church on her own ... don't you think that's sad ?
It is extraordinarily sad to witness. I find it remarkable that others don't see that sadness.
But though it may resemble a Diana moment (Agra), there is no evidence it is any such thing. It could be something as simple as maintaining a normality for the twins behind the possible lone trip of Kate (if that is what it is). Or it could be one of many other things.
But whatever the reason, it is very sad that any mother should ever feel the pain of a missing child whether alone or with her partner.
-
To think, the [ censored word ]s peddled the lie, many times, that the McCanns would never return to PDL, for fear of being arrested.
Another lie smashed
-
Its very interesting that some people jump to conclusions without evidence. A strange mindset revealed.
What else do you do, Gilet, when you assume "Kate McCann is a mother who does not know where her little girl is" ? You believe Mrs McCann who claims her little girl was abducted, and you do it well, but it's belief ! No evidence !
Your assumption that I believe in abduction is presumptious.
I have not referred to abduction. I have referred to a child who is missing which is a fact.
I have also referred to the presumption of innocence. Again a fact in legal terms.
Kate is the mother of a missing child. In legal terms she does not know where her child is. In her words, she does not know where here child is. I am perfectly entitled to presume as a person who abides by the law (including the law of Portugal) that she is telling the truth.
When I am presented with any evidence which even begins to convince me that Kate McCann was involved in any way in the disappearance of her child (other than in the fact that she was not present at the time in the apartment itself) then I will consider changing my view about her presumed innocence. Till then I will accept the word of the Portuguese officials.
You are wholly mistaken when you claim I jump to a conclusion. In reality I do precisely the opposite. I prefer to make no judgement about her and to await evidence for her guilt. Till then I will show empathy with a woman whose child is missing. I am sorry you cannot do the same.
Gilet, showing empathy is really nice, but your assuming Mrs McCann "does not know where her child is" is questionable : it isn't a fact, it's a belief.
You're of course free to believe whatever you like and to claim it ! But add "in my opinion", that would be fair.
Nothing to do with the presumption of innocence : the McCanns were not charged, they are not charged and I bet they'll never be charged and they know it. This is not their issue.
-
the McCanns were not charged, they are not charged and I bet they'll never be charged and they know it
You know it when you know that they have not committed any offence
-
.
Gilet, showing empathy is really nice, but your assuming Mrs McCann "does not know where her child is" is questionable : it isn't a fact, it's a belief.
You're of course free to believe whatever you like and to claim it ! But add "in my opinion", that would be fair.
Nothing to do with the presumption of innocence : the McCanns were not charged, they are not charged and I bet they'll never be charged and they know it. This is not their issue.
My 'belief' as you call it has everything to do with presumption of innocence. I have stated this earlier and you appear to have missed it, but it is precisely because they have never been charged, because the Portuguese in the archival report found no evidence whatsoever of any crime by them that I presume (as we are expected to do in a civilised society) their innocence.
I have no belief in what Kate McCann says though. My position is that I am unwilling to act as judge. I accept till there is evidence which shows otherwise the presumed innocence which I have referred to.
That does not mean that I know it is true or even that I believe it is true. Merely that I have no evidence to suggest otherwise. And because I have no evidence to suggest otherwise I am in the position of presuming innocence.
Your contesting of my position suggests that you possibly do not accept this presumption of innocence. Would I be right? If so, on what grounds, using what evidence, are you considering Kate McCann to be a liar?
It is not simply my opinion that Kate McCann does not know where her child is. It is the collective opinion of the civilised society in which I live (known as presumption of innocence) and it would also appear to be the opinion of the senior court official in Portugal who signed off the archival report in which it was stated that there is no evidence of any crime by Kate McCann.
My position is not simply 'nice' as you call it but it is the legal position which we should all take when there is no evidence against a person. It is also the position which those who can share empathy with a parent of a missing child would naturally take. Clearly you are not such a person.
-
To think, the h.....s peddled the lie, many times, that the McCanns would never return to PDL, for fear of being arrested.
Another lie smashed
Indeed.
Quote from Kate's book
"To this day I still return quietly to Luz from time to time to feel Madeleine close to me''
-
.
Gilet, showing empathy is really nice, but your assuming Mrs McCann "does not know where her child is" is questionable : it isn't a fact, it's a belief.
You're of course free to believe whatever you like and to claim it ! But add "in my opinion", that would be fair.
Nothing to do with the presumption of innocence : the McCanns were not charged, they are not charged and I bet they'll never be charged and they know it. This is not their issue.
My 'belief' as you call it has everything to do with presumption of innocence. I have stated this earlier and you appear to have missed it, but it is precisely because they have never been charged, because the Portuguese in the archival report found no evidence whatsoever of any crime by them that I presume (as we are expected to do in a civilised society) their innocence.
I have no belief in what Kate McCann says though. My position is that I am unwilling to act as judge. I accept till there is evidence which shows otherwise the presumed innocence which I have referred to.
That does not mean that I know it is true or even that I believe it is true. Merely that I have no evidence to suggest otherwise. And because I have no evidence to suggest otherwise I am in the position of presuming innocence.
Your contesting of my position suggests that you possibly do not accept this presumption of innocence. Would I be right? If so, on what grounds, using what evidence, are you considering Kate McCann to be a liar?
It is not simply my opinion that Kate McCann does not know where her child is. It is the collective opinion of the civilised society in which I live (known as presumption of innocence) and it would also appear to be the opinion of the senior court official in Portugal who signed off the archival report in which it was stated that there is no evidence of any crime by Kate McCann.
My position is not simply 'nice' as you call it but it is the legal position which we should all take when there is no evidence against a person. It is also the position which those who can share empathy with a parent of a missing child would naturally take. Clearly you are not such a person.
Gilet, were you coherent - and as I never claimed this -, you'd believe I'm innocent of "considering Mrs McCann to be a liar" ;)
About compassion and as you're "unwilling to act as a judge", do take care of not judging yourself ;)
-
I found Gilet's post most coherent
Should Anne Guedes ever find herself being lambasted by a sub standard police force, informed by the Salazar regime - who leak 'info' left right and centre to smear her name
I'll be standing by - watching and sniggering
-
I found Gilet's post most coherent
Should Anne Guedes ever find herself being lambasted by a sub standard police force, informed by the Salazar regime - who leak 'info' left right and centre to smear her name
I'll be standing by - watching and sniggering
I won't. I shall be getting very worried about what they might be doing to her. Her shouting that she's Innocent won't do her any good at all. Especially if she is Innocent.
-
I found Gilet's post most coherent
Should Anne Guedes ever find herself being lambasted by a sub standard police force, informed by the Salazar regime - who leak 'info' left right and centre to smear her name
I'll be standing by - watching and sniggering
I won't. I shall be getting very worried about what they might be doing to her. Her shouting that she's Innocent won't do her any good at all. Especially if she is Innocent.
That makes you a better person than me
-
I found Gilet's post most coherent
Should Anne Guedes ever find herself being lambasted by a sub standard police force, informed by the Salazar regime - who leak 'info' left right and centre to smear her name
I'll be standing by - watching and sniggering
I won't. I shall be getting very worried about what they might be doing to her. Her shouting that she's Innocent won't do her any good at all. Especially if she is Innocent.
That makes you a better person than me
Not really, because I don't think you actually mean it. Unless it was true, of course. Which would elicit an entirely different reaction from me.
-
We should really be a little sympathetic to the [ censored word ]s as there is always the chance that they might recover from the dreadful mindset that they have that is inhuman and uncaring, and come across to the humanitarian side- they have Brenda and BonnieBraes as potential role models.
-
I can do sincere rather than polemic - which is sometimes called for
No, to clarify the issue - I don't wish ill on Anne or anyone
-
There is a difference between entertaining the delicious thought of someone suffering who deserves it, and actually wishing it upon them. As probably the most accepting of human foibles here (people who know me will know of my attitude to criminality including the most horrific kinds) I still engage in a little schadenfreude or imagining [ censored word ]s in the same situation- I am only human!
-
It reminds me that I actually was dragged by 3/4 policemen into a police car many many years ago and spent half of a day into a kind of a cabin with a guard in front of the opening (obviously they didn't know what to do with me).
My crime : a policeman ordered me to move (I was speaking with people who were being expelled from their home), I replied that in a democracy to have the right to stay in the public space as far as you behave peacefully. They didn't like it.
I wasn't beaten and was out at the end of the day thanks to a MP my husband met by chance. I was told "we beg your pardon, we didn't know who you were", I hesitated, I felt like screaming but I kept quiet.
-
It reminds me that I actually was dragged by 3/4 policemen into a police car many many years ago and spent half of a day into a kind of a cabin with a guard in front of the opening (obviously they didn't know what to do with me).
My crime : a policeman ordered me to move (I was speaking with people who were being expelled from their home), I replied that in a democracy to have the right to stay in the public space as far as you behave peacefully. They didn't like it.
I wasn't beaten and was out at the end of the day thanks to a MP my husband met by chance. I was told "we beg your pardon, we didn't know who you were", I hesitated, I felt like screaming but I kept quiet.
Do you accept that the Portuguese Police do tend to have an out-dated method of interview and statement gathering that would not pass muster in many countries?
-
It reminds me that I actually was dragged by 3/4 policemen into a police car many many years ago and spent half of a day into a kind of a cabin with a guard in front of the opening (obviously they didn't know what to do with me).
My crime : a policeman ordered me to move (I was speaking with people who were being expelled from their home), I replied that in a democracy to have the right to stay in the public space as far as you behave peacefully. They didn't like it.
I wasn't beaten and was out at the end of the day thanks to a MP my husband met by chance. I was told "we beg your pardon, we didn't know who you were", I hesitated, I felt like screaming but I kept quiet.
which country did that happen in?
-
which country did that happen in?
It happened in Lisbon, in a half popular/half prosperous part of the city, in part because I was a foreigner. You mistrust strangers snooping around after 40 years of dictatorship. It takes time to dissipate fear.
It almost happened to me in France 45 years ago and as well I was in the public space. I wasn't doing nothing special, I was just on the "dangerous" side of the barricade.
-
which country did that happen in?
It happened in Lisbon, in a half popular/half prosperous part of the city, in part because I was a foreigner. You mistrust strangers snooping around after 40 years of dictatorship. It takes time to dissipate fear.
It almost happened to me in France 45 years ago and as well I was in the public space. I wasn't doing nothing special, I was just on the "dangerous" side of the barricade.
It also takes a couple of generations for the mindset of the police to change- as we seem to be seeing in the way they have approached the McCanns and others. The last minute arguido decision goes to their honesty really.
-
which country did that happen in?
It happened in Lisbon, in a half popular/half prosperous part of the city, in part because I was a foreigner. You mistrust strangers snooping around after 40 years of dictatorship. It takes time to dissipate fear.
It almost happened to me in France 45 years ago and as well I was in the public space. I wasn't doing nothing special, I was just on the "dangerous" side of the barricade.
It also takes a couple of generations for the mindset of the police to change- as we seem to be seeing in the way they have approached the McCanns and others. The last minute arguido decision goes to their honesty really.
How so ? What they did was perfectly legal and ethical as the law stood at that time.
-
which country did that happen in?
It happened in Lisbon, in a half popular/half prosperous part of the city, in part because I was a foreigner. You mistrust strangers snooping around after 40 years of dictatorship. It takes time to dissipate fear.
It almost happened to me in France 45 years ago and as well I was in the public space. I wasn't doing nothing special, I was just on the "dangerous" side of the barricade.
It also takes a couple of generations for the mindset of the police to change- as we seem to be seeing in the way they have approached the McCanns and others. The last minute arguido decision goes to their honesty really.
How so ? What they did was perfectly legal and ethical as the law stood at that time.
Just. It goes to mindset- we can't fit them up tomorrow, the law will stop us, so we will make the arguido today and accuse them. If we wait until tomorrow, we will not have reasonable suspicion and we know that, so we must act while we have no reasonable suspicion.
Law bending.
-
Lets put them out of their misery.
"It is a private trip alone, away from the spotlight, and a time for quiet reflection. She still has a lot of friends there.”
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/madeleine-mccann-mum-kate-returns-1873124#ixzz2ScFJViqA
If Kate had taken the twins, the h....s would have moaned, she had taken them out of School.
What they seem to forget is they have relatives living nearby.
She went yesterday, and will probably be home tomorrow.
At least they aren't locked in a bedroom, in case the cat gets in. @)(++(*
-
Lets put them out of their misery.
"It is a private trip alone, away from the spotlight, and a time for quiet reflection. She still has a lot of friends there.”
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/world-news/madeleine-mccann-mum-kate-returns-1873124#ixzz2ScFJViqA
If Kate had taken the twins, the h....s would have moaned, she had taken them out of School.
What they seem to forget is they have relatives living nearby.
She went yesterday, and will probably be home tomorrow.
At least they aren't locked in a bedroom, in case the cat gets in. @)(++(*
Norty. And I don't think The McCanns have got a cat. However, I could be wrong about that.
-
which country did that happen in?
It happened in Lisbon, in a half popular/half prosperous part of the city, in part because I was a foreigner. You mistrust strangers snooping around after 40 years of dictatorship. It takes time to dissipate fear.
It almost happened to me in France 45 years ago and as well I was in the public space. I wasn't doing nothing special, I was just on the "dangerous" side of the barricade.
Thanks for sharing that, Anne. Interesting.
When (roughly) did the Lisbon incident happen?
Some time later than the French one?
-
which country did that happen in?
It happened in Lisbon, in a half popular/half prosperous part of the city, in part because I was a foreigner. You mistrust strangers snooping around after 40 years of dictatorship. It takes time to dissipate fear.
It almost happened to me in France 45 years ago and as well I was in the public space. I wasn't doing nothing special, I was just on the "dangerous" side of the barricade.
Thanks for sharing that, Anne. Interesting.
When (roughly) did the Lisbon incident happen?
Some time later than the French one?
Hi Carana, it might have been in 1983, 15 years after May 1968.
-
which country did that happen in?
It happened in Lisbon, in a half popular/half prosperous part of the city, in part because I was a foreigner. You mistrust strangers snooping around after 40 years of dictatorship. It takes time to dissipate fear.
It almost happened to me in France 45 years ago and as well I was in the public space. I wasn't doing nothing special, I was just on the "dangerous" side of the barricade.
Thanks for sharing that, Anne. Interesting.
When (roughly) did the Lisbon incident happen?
Some time later than the French one?
Hi Carana, it might have been in 1983, 15 years after May 1968.
Ok. So the Lisbon incident wasn't that long (relatively speaking) after the end of the dictatorship.
Portugal seems to have worked quite hard to change their legal codes, but in your honest opinion, has the police system been adapted throughout the country to reflect a more modern approach? If so, do you think modern policing methods are actually practised throughout the country?
Another question: do you think (or not) that members of the public (ordinary citizens or even illegal ones) may still be a bit scared of the police?
-
which country did that happen in?
It happened in Lisbon, in a half popular/half prosperous part of the city, in part because I was a foreigner. You mistrust strangers snooping around after 40 years of dictatorship. It takes time to dissipate fear.
It almost happened to me in France 45 years ago and as well I was in the public space. I wasn't doing nothing special, I was just on the "dangerous" side of the barricade.
Thanks for sharing that, Anne. Interesting.
When (roughly) did the Lisbon incident happen?
Some time later than the French one?
Hi Carana, it might have been in 1983, 15 years after May 1968.
Ok. So the Lisbon incident wasn't that long (relatively speaking) after the end of the dictatorship.
Portugal seems to have worked quite hard to change their legal codes, but in your honest opinion, has the police system been adapted throughout the country to reflect a more modern approach? If so, do you think modern policing methods are actually practised throughout the country?
Another question: do you think (or not) that members of the public (ordinary citizens or even illegal ones) may still be a bit scared of the police?
I'll try to illustrate, Carana.
I visited Portugal for the first time in 1976. I travelled by train and was amazed by the difference in manners between the Spanish guard and the Portuguese one (the train in Spain would stop very often in the night, people would step in with vegetables and hens... ).
I remember visiting the monastery where Pedro and Ines (the "Dead Queen") are buried. A man was closing the door, we were too late. A Portuguese friend of mine started to speak to him, I observed the man lowering his head slowly and finally opening the door. I was so ashamed. I wondered whether this explained 40 years of dictatorship or 40 years of dictatorship explained this. Probably both.
The other night, my daughter heard a noise in my building when she was leaving back home. We looked and saw through the staircase a tiger striped blanket with a form under it. My daughter couldn't but jump over it. Who could be this form ? And what if this form woke suddenly up ? I called the police. Two PSP guys arrived. We heard them speak very gently. My daughter said "gosh it's a French woman". And it was. Nothing happened to the woman, she was just asked to leave. I was (a bit) ashamed (it seems I spend my life being ashamed...).