The Science Of Sleep - Does It Offer A Better Explanation Than Sedation?

[faithlilly]

No it doesn’t, it just suggests that they were normal parents who didn’t want to risk the possibility of waking their children in the night.  It’s what most parents do, whether their kids are light sleepers or not.

The rest of the tapas group must have been abnormal then because I believe they used their front doors.

[Brietta]

The rest of the tapas group must have been abnormal then because I believe they used their front doors.

Depends on the layout of the apartment and where the children were sleeping.  The layout of 5B was definitely different from 5A because it only had one bedroom and the presumption is that the layout of 5D was different again to accommodate more people.
Because it was the end apartment the front door of 5A was outside the block and the doors of 5B and 5D inside the block.

So horses for courses with different families making choices which suited them.

[faithlilly]

Depends on the layout of the apartment and where the children were sleeping.  The layout of 5B was definitely different from 5A because it only had one bedroom and the presumption is that the layout of 5D was different again to accommodate more people.
Because it was the end apartment the front door of 5A was outside the block and the doors of 5B and 5D inside the block.

So horses for courses with different families making choices which suited them.

But definitely not bothered about waking the children when entering the apartment like ‘normal ‘ parents.

[Holly Goodhead]

"The fact the McCanns are medical doctors would not necessarily mean they had an awareness or knowledge of the science of sleep. "

As parents they know their childs sleeping patters no need for a science degree on their sleep patterns.

They knew their children were waking up their -daughter told them the night before apparently- they claimed they didn't want to put a light on in case they woke the kids or use  a certain door as the noise may wake them so if we are to go by their observational knowledge they kids were light sleepers!

It's nothing to do with parents understanding their children's sleeping patterns. 

KM and others were surprised the twins slept through all the commotion in 5A and being moved to the Payne's apartment.  Many then suggested the twins and possibly MM had been sedated (by an abductor).

As I understand it Amaral's theory is that the McCanns dosed up the twins and MM on Calpol to prevent them from waking.

I've explained how stages 3 and 4 of sleep cycles we all go through are difficult to wake from.  This can be evidenced by observing the twins leaving their return flight to UK.

I would not expect KM or GM with their backgrounds in medicine to have any understanding of this.  Anesthetics is a completely different field to the science of sleep.   

 

[Vertigo Swirl]

But definitely not bothered about waking the children when entering the apartment like ‘normal ‘ parents.

Really?  Is that a fact? 

[Holly Goodhead]

No it doesn’t, it just suggests that they were normal parents who didn’t want to risk the possibility of waking their children in the night.  It’s what most parents do, whether their kids are light sleepers or not.

I think the McCanns were far from 'normal' with regards to their "childcare arrangements".  I am as certain as I can be of anything that most parents do not leave 3 children under the age of 4 in an unlocked holiday apartment while they dine out at a restaurant where they can't possibly observe the unlocked entrance let alone know what is kicking off inside. 

Why did the McCanns decide to check via the unlocked patio door and not the locked front door like the Oldfields and JT/ROB?

Why, on arrival, did the McCanns move the 2 cots from the bedroom overlooking the pool and and place them in the front bedroom?  Would it not have been better to leave the cots in the bedroom overlooking the pool and then to carry out the checks via the locked front door? 

Had the apartment been locked would the outcome have been different?   

[Vertigo Swirl]

I think the McCanns were far from 'normal' with regards to their "childcare arrangements".  I am as certain as I can be of anything that most parents do not leave 3 children under the age of 4 in an unlocked holiday apartment while they dine out at a restaurant where they can't possibly observe the unlocked entrance let alone know what is kicking off inside. 

Why did the McCanns decide to check via the unlocked patio door and not the locked front door like the Oldfields and JT/ROB?

Why, on arrival, did the McCanns move the 2 cots from the bedroom overlooking the pool and and place them in the front bedroom?  Would it not have been better to leave the cots in the bedroom overlooking the pool and then to carry out the checks via the locked front door? 

Had the apartment been locked would the outcome have been different?

Are you suggesting that child abduction was a very real and likely possibility then?

[faithlilly]

Really?  Is that a fact?

It would appear so.

[Vertigo Swirl]

It would appear so.

So not a fact then.

[faithlilly]

So not a fact then.

Okay....you can have my attention....just for a little while though.

Did the rest of the tapas group who checked use their front doors?

[Vertigo Swirl]

Okay....you can have my attention....just for a little while though.

Did the rest of the tapas group who checked use their front doors?

No idea, you tell me.

[faithlilly]

No idea, you tell me.

Don’t tell me you are going to play the ‘do you have a cite game’. I think it’s common knowledge that the McCanns, being the only ‘normal’ parents, left their children vulnerable in an unsecured apartment so they didn’t wake them by going through the locked door.

[Vertigo Swirl]

Don’t tell me you are going to play the ‘do you have a cite game’. I think it’s common knowledge that the McCanns, being the only ‘normal’ parents, left their children vulnerable in an unsecured apartment so they didn’t wake them by going through the locked door.

I didn’t ask for a cite, I asked you to tell me.  You have declined to do so.

Why do you think the children were more vulnerable than the others?  Why should leaving the door unlocked make them any more vulnerable?  Please explain.

[Miss Taken Identity]

It's nothing to do with parents understanding their children's sleeping patterns. 

KM and others were surprised the twins slept through all the commotion in 5A and being moved to the Payne's apartment.  Many then suggested the twins and possibly MM had been sedated (by an abductor).

As I understand it Amaral's theory is that the McCanns dosed up the twins and MM on Calpol to prevent them from waking.

I've explained how stages 3 and 4 of sleep cycles we all go through are difficult to wake from.  This can be evidenced by observing the twins leaving their return flight to UK.

I would not expect KM or GM with their backgrounds in medicine to have any understanding of this.  Anesthetics is a completely different field to the science of sleep.

I disagree Holly,

The parents are more aware of their childs sleep patterns than a scientific research taken under clinical conditions.
No one can really read minds when people are sleeping regardless of their scientific background.
There are various reasons for falling into a deep sleep at certain times of the night. We can't take one child sleeping being carried off a flight as evidence of the child being a deep sleeper.  We are not privvy to the activity or lack of sleep pre flight home.

So why were they surprised ?  they were surprised because they knew their children were light sleepers. offering a scientific explanation just isn't relevent here.

Anesthetics is very relevent here because the mother suspected her children were drugged- she would have a better idea than most lay person- so why not demand the children be taken to hospital in case their life was in danger?

You see here is where I have a problem. they claim to be loving parents and yet they leave their babies alone every night, one is claimed to have been abducted via a window, the mother runs out of the apartment to alert the others, doesn't contact police immediatly but does a quick search?????,Mother suspects the other two children have been drugged and does nothing. When told cadaver dogs alerted to a scent rather than bcome upset that it may be their daughters via the abductor/s they dissmiss out of hand and laugh it off?

[faithlilly]

I didn’t ask for a cite, I asked you to tell me.  You have declined to do so.

Why do you think the children were more vulnerable than the others?  Why should leaving the door unlocked make them any more vulnerable?  Please explain.

After you tell me if you think that the rest of tapas were ‘abnormal’ parents for locking their front doors ?