Author Topic: The 'Find Madeleine Campaign' Helpful or Harmful?  (Read 53767 times)

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Offline faithlilly

Re: The 'Find Madeleine Campaign' Helpful or Harmful?
« Reply #255 on: July 15, 2019, 10:28:32 AM »
I don’t know whether to laugh or cry.

I was teasing.
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline faithlilly

Re: The 'Find Madeleine Campaign' Helpful or Harmful?
« Reply #256 on: July 15, 2019, 10:41:40 AM »
I don’t know whether to laugh or cry.

It was just a bit of teasing.
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline Robittybob1

Re: The 'Find Madeleine Campaign' Helpful or Harmful?
« Reply #257 on: July 15, 2019, 10:50:31 AM »
Suggesting the mccanns chucked maddies body in the bin is libellous... Therefore against the laws if the land and against forum rules ..We, are, all entitled to our opinions but you should realise not if that results in libel
If theories are allowed, a theory that involves in the disposal of Madeleine's body in a bin, is that allowed too?  Or do we only allow some theories but not others?

If one was to say it is a fact "they disposed of Madeleine's body in a bin" I'd have to say that is libellous because it couldn't be proven to be true based on the evidence.

Do you see the difference between libel and theory?
Moderation
John has instructed all moderators to take a very strong line with posters who constantly breach the rules of this forum.  This sniping, goading, name calling and other various forms of disruption will cease.

Offline Lace

Re: The 'Find Madeleine Campaign' Helpful or Harmful
« Reply #258 on: July 15, 2019, 11:05:55 AM »
Enid O’Dowd is a qualified accountant and is well placed to critique the setting up of the fund. Apart from bias have you any other reason to query the work of Miss O’Dowd ? Has her professionalism ever been criticised by anyone else but supporters of the McCanns ? Further lawyers only do what their clients instruct them to do....within the limits of the law. While morally questionable, the setting up of the fund was legally sound so a lawyer would see no problem with it.

The parents have no separate fund for litigation as their own accounts show. The litigation was paid for from the same fund as the ‘search’.

Firstly the twins would have, I assume, seen their parents in a distressed state since May 3rd so that excuse rings rather hollow. A photograph of Madeleine could have been sent to the pope and he could have blessed it without them going to Rome...further I’d also assume the people of Rome have televisions and as Madeleine’s disappearance was making news all over the world I’m sure they knew about her. Lastly keeping things normal for the twins would be having their parents there, especially as their sister had disappeared from their life.

What were the parents supposed to do with the money ? As they had more support from police officials than possibly any family of a missing child in history possibly set up a fund to help the families of other missing children ? Something like the foundation set up by Daniel Morcombe’s parents when he was still missing.

https://danielmorcombefoundation.com.au/keeping-kids-safe-resources/


Yes I have seen O'Dowd  criticised by people other than the McCann's.   O'Dowd got herself entangled in the case of the missing child in Ireland and the family really don't want her involved at all.  They don't like what she says and neither do they agree with her.

Yes lawyers act on the instructions of their clients,  they also advise their clients as to which avenue to take as to what is best for them,  obviously it wasn't taking up charity status.


The McCann's do have a seperate account for litigation,  may be it is there to pay off Amaral if need be.


The Pope had expressed an interest in the McCann case he wanted to meet them,  how rude if they just sent a photograph of Madeleine instead of going in person.   The twins were being looked after by family,  they were being entertained and they were given help and back up as to what to say to them when they asked questions.


The McCann's have said when Madeleine has been found,  all money in the Find Madeleine Fund will be donated to other Missing Children.

Offline Mr Gray

Re: The 'Find Madeleine Campaign' Helpful or Harmful?
« Reply #259 on: July 15, 2019, 11:19:01 AM »
If theories are allowed, a theory that involves in the disposal of Madeleine's body in a bin, is that allowed too?  Or do we only allow some theories but not others?

If one was to say it is a fact "they disposed of Madeleine's body in a bin" I'd have to say that is libellous because it couldn't be proven to be true based on the evidence.

Do you see the difference between libel and theory?

Libel is not allowed according to Angelo... Doesn't matter if you call it a theory... It's, still libel
« Last Edit: July 15, 2019, 11:25:03 AM by Robittybob1 »

Offline faithlilly

Re: The 'Find Madeleine Campaign' Helpful or Harmful
« Reply #260 on: July 15, 2019, 11:22:47 AM »

Yes I have seen O'Dowd  criticised by people other than the McCann's.   O'Dowd got herself entangled in the case of the missing child in Ireland and the family really don't want her involved at all.  They don't like what she says and neither do they agree with her.

Yes lawyers act on the instructions of their clients,  they also advise their clients as to which avenue to take as to what is best for them,  obviously it wasn't taking up charity status.


The McCann's do have a seperate account for litigation,  may be it is there to pay off Amaral if need be.


The Pope had expressed an interest in the McCann case he wanted to meet them,  how rude if they just sent a photograph of Madeleine instead of going in person.   The twins were being looked after by family,  they were being entertained and they were given help and back up as to what to say to them when they asked questions.


The McCann's have said when Madeleine has been found,  all money in the Find Madeleine Fund will be donated to other Missing Children.

Firstly Enid O’Dowd is an accountant...I think you are thinking of Gemma O’Doherty who proved that Martin Smith hadn’t changed his story re Smithman as claimed by the BBC.

Yes lawyers advise their clients on what avenue to take however their clients don’t have to take their advice.

If the parents have a private fund for litigation why is the cost of litigation mentioned in the fund accounts ? It’s time for a cite I think.

The Pope expressed an interest ? I’m sure he didn’t expect the parents of a missing child to hot tail it to Rome to meet him. It wasn’t even a private audience. As I said I attended a more intimate audience.

If they knew Madeleine wouldn’t be found that’s hardly generous. They don’t need the money for a search now so why not donate some of it now ?
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline Robittybob1

Re: The 'Find Madeleine Campaign' Helpful or Harmful?
« Reply #261 on: July 15, 2019, 11:28:43 AM »
Libel is not allowed according to Angelo... Doesn't matter if you call it a theory... It's, still libel
I will post what Angelo said again:  "Theories and opinion have always been permitted. Anything which might constitute a libel is not."

So when does a theory or opinion constitute libel?  He doesn't explain the finer detail.
Moderation
John has instructed all moderators to take a very strong line with posters who constantly breach the rules of this forum.  This sniping, goading, name calling and other various forms of disruption will cease.

Offline Mr Gray

Re: The 'Find Madeleine Campaign' Helpful or Harmful?
« Reply #262 on: July 15, 2019, 11:30:28 AM »
I will post what Angelo said again:  "Theories and opinion have always been permitted. Anything which might constitute a libel is not."

So when does a theory or opinion constitute libel?  He doesn't explain the finer detail.

If a theory suggests criminal activity it's libellous... Opinion can also be libellous
« Last Edit: July 15, 2019, 11:33:29 AM by Davel »

Offline Miss Taken Identity

Re: The 'Find Madeleine Campaign' Helpful or Harmful?
« Reply #263 on: July 15, 2019, 11:36:43 AM »
If theories are allowed, a theory that involves in the disposal of Madeleine's body in a bin, is that allowed too?  Or do we only allow some theories but not others?

If one was to say it is a fact "they disposed of Madeleine's body in a bin" I'd have to say that is libellous because it couldn't be proven to be true based on the evidence.

Do you see the difference between libel and theory?



I think John and Admin need to have a chat about this. In the not so distant past anything critisising the McCANNS  was swiped and libel was the accusation. If someone types in the mother did it ans here is how she did it Xyz.. that would be libel. If someone typed in I don't believe  MBM was abducted and the parents are hiding something that is not libel because usng the term I believe is insunuating a theory  is it not?

And we are also warned off about talking what may have happened  to her if she were abducted- full posts were swiped because some supporting mods didn't like it.  We are alowed to chat about the kindley couple who stole her and are giving her a nice life!

back on topic.

The police and the home office and investigative journalists (along with the sleazy paps) were searching and trying to find out what happened. large sums of money was offered to get information!

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk/6649951.stm.


and what about the NOW newspaper CHARITY money-given to the McCanns on behalf of the readers  when it closed down? I think there is a link in one of the earlier threads.
'Never underestimate the power of stupid people'... George Carlin

Offline Robittybob1

Re: The 'Find Madeleine Campaign' Helpful or Harmful?
« Reply #264 on: July 15, 2019, 11:37:22 AM »
If a theory suggests criminal activity it's libellous... Opinion can also be libellous
Can you tell me where you got that from?
Moderation
John has instructed all moderators to take a very strong line with posters who constantly breach the rules of this forum.  This sniping, goading, name calling and other various forms of disruption will cease.

Offline Mr Gray

Re: The 'Find Madeleine Campaign' Helpful or Harmful?
« Reply #265 on: July 15, 2019, 11:40:23 AM »
Can you tell me where you got that from?

It's English law.. You can't simply say... According to my theory... Or it's my opinion... It's still libellous

That's why amarals theory isn't published in the uk

Offline Robittybob1

Re: The 'Find Madeleine Campaign' Helpful or Harmful?
« Reply #266 on: July 15, 2019, 11:50:14 AM »
From this Law site  https://www.minclaw.com/legal-resource-center/what-is-defamation/can-opinion-defamatory/

"Can An Opinion Be Defamatory?

Labeling a statement an opinion does not automatically make it an opinion or make it safe from the possibility of it being defamatory. If a reader or listener could reasonably understand that the communication as stating a fact that could be verified, the communication will not be considered an opinion, especially if it is sufficiently derogatory to hurt the subject’s reputation. Also, a communication that is presented in the form of an opinion may be considered defamatory if it implies that the opinion is based on defamatory facts that have not been disclosed.

In other words, the fact that a statement is one’s opinion does not necessarily make one immune from a defamation lawsuit."
 
It seems to depend on whether the opinion is untenable because it is not based on verifiable facts. ".... as stating a fact that could be verified ...."

That is interesting.  Not sure if that is English law or the USA.

Moderation
John has instructed all moderators to take a very strong line with posters who constantly breach the rules of this forum.  This sniping, goading, name calling and other various forms of disruption will cease.

Offline Mr Gray

Re: The 'Find Madeleine Campaign' Helpful or Harmful?
« Reply #267 on: July 15, 2019, 11:52:03 AM »
From this Law site  https://www.minclaw.com/legal-resource-center/what-is-defamation/can-opinion-defamatory/

"Can An Opinion Be Defamatory?

Labeling a statement an opinion does not automatically make it an opinion or make it safe from the possibility of it being defamatory. If a reader or listener could reasonably understand that the communication as stating a fact that could be verified, the communication will not be considered an opinion, especially if it is sufficiently derogatory to hurt the subject’s reputation. Also, a communication that is presented in the form of an opinion may be considered defamatory if it implies that the opinion is based on defamatory facts that have not been disclosed.

In other words, the fact that a statement is one’s opinion does not necessarily make one immune from a defamation lawsuit."
 
It seems to depend on whether the opinion is untenable because it is not based on verifiable facts. ".... as stating a fact that could be verified ...."

That is interesting.  Not sure if that is English law or the USA.

It's US... Try this

It's my opinion that Martin Grime needs to make sure his dogs, are more thoroughly tested

Offline Robittybob1

Re: The 'Find Madeleine Campaign' Helpful or Harmful?
« Reply #268 on: July 15, 2019, 11:54:16 AM »
It's US... Try this

It's my opinion that Martin Grime needs to make sure his dogs, are more thoroughly tested
As if you are the expert in training cadaver dogs!
Moderation
John has instructed all moderators to take a very strong line with posters who constantly breach the rules of this forum.  This sniping, goading, name calling and other various forms of disruption will cease.

Offline Mr Gray

Re: The 'Find Madeleine Campaign' Helpful or Harmful?
« Reply #269 on: July 15, 2019, 11:55:28 AM »
As if you are the expert in training cadaver dogs!

What difference does that make... I thought opinions were ok