Why did Sheila have an INCREASED amount of Haloperidol in her system?

[mrswah]

She wasn’t seen skipping — that was June

Sheila was seen walking with the twins’ and Crispy; she was walking stiffly and slowly

That isn't what I read. Please provide a quote. Thanks.

[ISpyWithMyEye]

Where is it documented the pathologist even spoke with CC let alone told CC SC had an unusually large amount of Haloperidol. In her system?

It came from the horse’s mouth, Holly

Colin, who SPOKE with the pathologist, was told by him that Sheila had “unusually high levels” of Haloperidol in her system. Now, whether that means they were unusually high due to her asking for a reduced dose, I have no idea. But that’s what Colin says — in his book — page 48.

It’s there in black and white.

Holly, for someone who believes every word a convicted mass murderer comes out with, its very strange that you disbelieve others. That suggests to me you’re mistrusting, yet you trust and believe a proven liar, a thief, a drug dealer, and a mass murderer who to this day refuses to admit his guilt despite all the overwhelming evidence....

Strange!

[ISpyWithMyEye]

You say the pathologist told Colin. Please tell me where I can find evidence upholding your statement.

I’ve ALREADY told you!

[ISpyWithMyEye]

Anecdotal evidence isn't required in this case.

We have clear evidence from Alexander Allen about the level of Haloperidol in SC's system at tod which is consistent with a moderate dose at the extreme low end of moderate.

The levels were in the MEDIUM range, Holly

Stop copying Jeremy Bamber’s sly trick of trying to twist/distort/exaggerate/underwhelm things — it’s so obvious what you’re trying to do

The fact is, the Haloperidol in Sheila’s system was in the medium range. The pathologist told Colin it was “unusually high”. I’ve explained to you why that might have been: perhaps Sheila hadn’t been given the reduced dosage she’d asked for...

Regardless, she did indeed have the drug in her system, and it did indeed incapacitate her. She could barely SIT UP from a chair!

You are demeaning Sheila and trying to make her look like the culprit when it’s been PROVEN in a court of law that Jeremy Bamber is a an evil, vile mass murderer! Those are the words of the judge, and everyone KNOWS what he is, so for you to try and twist facts by suggesting a Sheila murdered her two children and parents’ is so, so low...

[ISpyWithMyEye]

That isn't what I read. Please provide a quote. Thanks.

I’ve said REPEATEDLY where it can be found, so I suggest you get off your butt and look.

Sheila could BARELY walk that day.

[ISpyWithMyEye]

Sheila was probably more uncoordinated on some days than others. On the afternoon before the murders, she was seen skipping along with the twins, so she was certainly able to walk at that time. She is also said to have visited a shop with June and the twins, to buy jeans for the boys.

The effects of the drug don’t change day to day...🙄

[ISpyWithMyEye]

My mother has vascular dementia and she was prescribed haloperidol at one point - it completely floored her and  in the end, I stopped giving it to her, the notes that came with the drug stated that it would take around six weeks to clear from the system. Sometimes Holly practical knowledge of something is worth it's weight in gold.

I’m sorry to hear that, Caroline — that must be awful

It’s good, though, that you’re able to explain to these unknowledgeable people just how severe Haloperidol is, and the terrible side-effects it has.

[ISpyWithMyEye]

It was measured in blood and liver:

Liver = 0.55 microgram per gram
Blood = 15 nsnograms per millilitre


http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=207.0;attach=750

Was any evidence presented at trial re SC being uncoordinated/overdosed?  I doubt it as the only person qualified to answer such would be a pharmacologist and I don't believe one was called at trial?

How could Sheila have overdosed?!

She was given monthly injections, Holly.

She hated the drug, too...as you should know considering the extreme interest you have in Jeremy Bamber and his fruitless attempts at trying to get out of prison.

I don’t know what your true interest is, but I tell you this...you’ve wasted YEARS trying to prove ludicrous points that are always disproven in a flash. And you’ll waste MIRE years too, because he will NEVER be released. Ever. The only time he’ll be let out of jail is in a body bag. He will die in prison, where he belongs. And even then you won’t be able to visit his grave because the authorities will cremated him in secret, just as they did Myra Hindley, and then the ashes will be put somewhere so no-one has the misfortune of ever being near them.

He is evil to the CORE.

[ISpyWithMyEye]

Where's the evidence Haloperidol can be present in the brain in much greater concentrations than tests reveal in the blood and liver?

What would be the point in testing the blood and liver if it is at odds with the brain?

What evidence exists from professionals that SC had problems with her coordination?

Her GP said she complained of tiredness and sleepiness.
As such the dose was halved.

I note she was also prescribed Tridulan for hay fever which can bring on the side effects SC complained of.

I recall taking Tridulan for prickly heat on an 18 - 30's holiday to Tenerife during the 80's and kept falling asleep in night clubs before midnight 

Holly, Sheila was prescribed Tridulan in APRIL — that’s the usual hay fever season.

She wasn’t prescribed it in August as she obviously wasn’t suffering from Hay Fever, so we don’t need your anecdotal notes when we have her GP’s official notes.

It also says she was given Haloperidol INJECTIONS, so your suggestion of an overdose is absurd.

Furthermore, all GP’s write down brief notes when diagnosing and prescribing treatments. To make life easy and quicker, they jot down just a couple of symptoms the patient complains of, otherwise they’d be there all day writing...

It sufficed for him to just write two of Sheila’s symptoms, which in those days were small little cards. Much easier to jot down:

Tiredness/Sleepiness rather than:

Sleepiness
Tiredness
Listless
Aching muscles
Stiffness of movement
Trembling
Shakiness
Lack of coordination
Blurred vision
Dizziness
Lethargy
Tremors


GP’s aren’t writing for Greys Anatomy when jotting down why they’re prescribing drugs...

Sheila complained about all her severe symptoms, and people, including friends/family/acquaintances/neighbours/shopkeepers/strangers ALL said Sheila could barely walk on the day she was murdered.

Move on now, eh?

[Caroline]

Where's the evidence Haloperidol can be present in the brain in much greater concentrations than tests reveal in the blood and liver?

What would be the point in testing the blood and liver if it is at odds with the brain?

What evidence exists from professionals that SC had problems with her coordination?

Her GP said she complained of tiredness and sleepiness.
As such the dose was halved.

I note she was also prescribed Tridulan for hay fever which can bring on the side effects SC complained of.

I recall taking Tridulan for prickly heat on an 18 - 30's holiday to Tenerife during the 80's and kept falling asleep in night clubs before midnight 

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10360127

Persistence of haloperidol in human brain tissue.
Kornhuber J1, Schultz A, Wiltfang J, Meineke I, Gleiter CH, Zöchling R, Boissl KW, Leblhuber F, Riederer P.
Author information
Abstract
OBJECTIVE:
After discontinuation of neuroleptic drugs, their antipsychotic and antiparkinsonian effects are still present for a prolonged period. It is not known whether the extended effects of neuroleptic drugs in humans are due to the continued presence of drug in brain tissue or to long-lasting drug-induced physiologic changes. The aim of this study was to directly examine haloperidol concentrations in human brain tissue in relation to drug-free time.

METHOD:
Haloperidol concentrations were measured in five regions (temporal cortex, cingulate gyrus, caudate nucleus, dentate nucleus, corpus callosum) of the postmortem brains of 11 patients previously treated with haloperidol. Haloperidol was analyzed by means of high-performance liquid chromatography with ultraviolet detection. The half-life in brain tissue was estimated by a population kinetic analysis.

RESULTS:
Haloperidol concentrations in the human brain tissue were 10-30 times higher than optimal serum concentrations used in the treatment of schizophrenia. Haloperidol concentrations appeared to be homogeneously distributed across different brain areas within a single patient. There was no apparent relation between duration of treatment and mean haloperidol concentration. Higher doses of haloperidol seemed to be related to higher concentrations in brain tissue. The elimination half-life from brain tissue was calculated to be 6.8 days.

CONCLUSIONS:
The results may have implications for clinical treatment decisions and the design of clinical research protocols. Patients exposed to haloperidol cannot be considered to be free of residual effects of the drug for a number of weeks after withdrawal.

[mrswah]

I’ve said REPEATEDLY where it can be found, so I suggest you get off your butt and look.

Sheila could BARELY walk that day.

I take the point that I should have provided the quote!

Several witnesses saw Sheila in the days before the murders. Barbara Wilson's son implies she was walking normally, and so does Len Foakes. Michael Horsnell, decorating the exterior of Vaulty, mentions Sheila walking rigidly. There is also mention of Sheila taking the twins to the rape field to see Jeremy (Barbara Wilson), and no mention of her barely being able to walk. (pp591-614 CAL's book).

Please remember the forum rules and be polite, even if you don't like what some of us have to say. It is called mature discussion.

[ISpyWithMyEye]

OK, I apologise for being rude. That was unnecessary of me and I’m sorry.

Like most people I have my flaws, and one of them is intolerance. I admit that. But I’m asked repeatedly for evidence, links, quotes from the same few people, and they are more au fait with the case than I am! I’ve read thousands of words on the case, including reading books & official documents, and I don’t have a photographic memory — so I can’t immediately fetch the source up.

What I can say is, I do not lie as I’ve absolutely no need to, and if I’ve read something I retain that information but don’t always remember exactly where I read it.

As for Sheila’s walking that day, it was noted by various independent witnesses that she was walking like a zombie: slowly, stiffly, and with only the bottom half of her legs moving. It must have been extreme for people to remark on it.

In the grand scheme of things it’s irrelevant in a way: everyone knows Sheila was too weak, listless and shaky to even apply her lipstick properly, and everyone knows it would have been impossible for her to have beaten Nevill to a pulp, fought off both June and Nevill at the same time (which appears happened by the bedroom door, and then shoot them all dead — including herself.

Forensics, scientists, ballistics, police, doctors, pathologists, witnesses — a whole host of people have said she could not have murdered her family. She didn’t want to; had no reason to; and was physically and mentally incapable of doing so. She adored her children, adored her dad, and certainly didn’t want to die.

I feel so sorry for Sheila in so many ways. Not only was she subjected to her mother’s cold, domineering demands, but she had to listen to her religious ramblings too. Even after death Jeremy made sure her name was dragged through the mud. Remember, not only did he kill her and her children, he tried to defame her by offering The Sun nude photos of her: are they the actions of a grief-stricken brother?

Aside from that, I think Holly should remove Sheila’s medical notes that she posted earlier. There’s confidential, embarrassing things in there that Sheila wouldn’t want people to know. Lots of women get thrush, and many women giving birth can develop problems in that region, but to put it on the WWW is horrible. Remember, Sheila’s biological mother is still alive, as is her biological uncle...it’s extremely distasteful to show strangers Sheila’s medical notes.

[mrswah]

OK, I apologise for being rude. That was unnecessary of me and I’m sorry.

Like most people I have my flaws, and one of them is intolerance. I admit that. But I’m asked repeatedly for evidence, links, quotes from the same few people, and they are more au fait with the case than I am! I’ve read thousands of words on the case, including reading books & official documents, and I don’t have a photographic memory — so I can’t immediately fetch the source up.

What I can say is, I do not lie as I’ve absolutely no need to, and if I’ve read something I retain that information but don’t always remember exactly where I read it.

As for Sheila’s walking that day, it was noted by various independent witnesses that she was walking like a zombie: slowly, stiffly, and with only the bottom half of her legs moving. It must have been extreme for people to remark on it.

In the grand scheme of things it’s irrelevant in a way: everyone knows Sheila was too weak, listless and shaky to even apply her lipstick properly, and everyone knows it would have been impossible for her to have beaten Nevill to a pulp, fought off both June and Nevill at the same time (which appears happened by the bedroom door, and then shoot them all did — including herself.

Forensics, scientists, ballistics, police, doctors, pathologists, witnesses — a while host of people have said she could not have murdered her family. She didn’t want to; had no reason to; and was physically and mentally incapable of doing so. She adored her children, adored her dad, and certainly didn’t want to die.

I feel so sorry for Sheila in so many ways. Not only was she subjected to her mother’s cold, domineering demands, but she had to listen to her religious ramblings too. Even after death Jeremy made sure her name was dragged through the mud. Remember, not only did he kill her and her children, he tried to defame her by offering The Sun nude photos of her: are they the actions of a grief-stricken brother?

Aside from that, I think Holly should remove Sheila’s medical notes that she posted earlier. There’s confidential, embarrassing things in there that Sheila wouldn’t want people to know. Lots of women get thrush, and many women giving birth can develop problems in that region, but to put it on the WWW is horrible. Remember, Sheila’s biological mother is still alive, as is her biological uncle...it’s extremely distasteful to show strangers Sheila’s medical notes.

Apology accepted, and thank you.

I'm not very "au fait" with the case either, and I'm on here to learn , more than for any other reason. You will find that there are several people posting on here who are extremely well informed, and who have been studying the case for years.  I followed it at the time it happened (I lived in Essex then, and so it was of local as well as national  interest), but stopped after the trial, so knew nothing about the appeals. I read CAL's book (after reading her excellent book on Myra Hindley), then watched the TV series, so my interest has re-kindled!

[Vertigo Swirl]

OK, I apologise for being rude. That was unnecessary of me and I’m sorry.

Like most people I have my flaws, and one of them is intolerance. I admit that. But I’m asked repeatedly for evidence, links, quotes from the same few people, and they are more au fait with the case than I am! I’ve read thousands of words on the case, including reading books & official documents, and I don’t have a photographic memory — so I can’t immediately fetch the source up.

What I can say is, I do not lie as I’ve absolutely no need to, and if I’ve read something I retain that information but don’t always remember exactly where I read it.

As for Sheila’s walking that day, it was noted by various independent witnesses that she was walking like a zombie: slowly, stiffly, and with only the bottom half of her legs moving. It must have been extreme for people to remark on it.

In the grand scheme of things it’s irrelevant in a way: everyone knows Sheila was too weak, listless and shaky to even apply her lipstick properly, and everyone knows it would have been impossible for her to have beaten Nevill to a pulp, fought off both June and Nevill at the same time (which appears happened by the bedroom door, and then shoot them all did — including herself.

Forensics, scientists, ballistics, police, doctors, pathologists, witnesses — a while host of people have said she could not have murdered her family. She didn’t want to; had no reason to; and was physically and mentally incapable of doing so. She adored her children, adored her dad, and certainly didn’t want to die.

I feel so sorry for Sheila in so many ways. Not only was she subjected to her mother’s cold, domineering demands, but she had to listen to her religious ramblings too. Even after death Jeremy made sure her name was dragged through the mud. Remember, not only did he kill her and her children, he tried to defame her by offering The Sun nude photos of her: are they the actions of a grief-stricken brother?

Aside from that, I think Holly should remove Sheila’s medical notes that she posted earlier. There’s confidential, embarrassing things in there that Sheila wouldn’t want people to know. Lots of women get thrush, and many women giving birth can develop problems in that region, but to put it on the WWW is horrible. Remember, Sheila’s biological mother is still alive, as is her biological uncle...it’s extremely distasteful to show strangers Sheila’s medical notes.

I was shocked and disturbed to come across close up pictures of her dead body on here, was that really necessary either? 

[puglove]

I was shocked and disturbed to come across close up pictures of her dead body on here, was that really necessary either?

Any disturbing images of Sheila, June or Nevill are visible because of Mike Tesko. Long story, but basically he's a sad, desperate, needy little man, likes to shock, desperately needs attention. He is enabled by a man who calls himself "NGB." Who should know better. Two dodgy blokes who should stop milking the tragic deaths of a lovely family  Massive shame.