Gerry and Jez chat while Jane walks by. Seconds later she spots Tannerman!

[Gadfly1.3]

It has been comprehensively demonstrated on this thread through maps, statements, cross-referencing that:

Witnesses Jeremy Wilkins and Jane Tanner both saw Gerry McCann close to the apartment gate.

Everything is cited. 

I repeat:

Witnesses Jeremy Wilkins and Jane Tanner both saw Gerry McCann close to the apartment gate.

And a summary of the cites.

On one side:
Jeremy Wilkins X2 statements.
Jane Tanner X2 statements.
Jane Tanner in the Channel Four Madeleine Was Here
Map from Wilkins.
Map from Tanner.

On the other:
Mr Gerry McCann

--

[jassi]

Well, that's cleared that up - as far as I'm concerned   

I'm sure others will argue until they're apoplectic purple that only Gerry is correct   

[pathfinder73]

As he approached the corner of the McCanns apartment, he saw Gerry appear from the area of the gate. He crossed the road and engaged in general conversation with Gerry. At this time they were stood with Gerry's back to the building near to the gate and Jeremy facing him. Rua Dr Agostino was about 10-15 meters to his right and the pathway leading to the front of the apartment blocks about 5 meters to his left.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/JEREMY_BRIGET.htm

So Jeremy Wilkins was on the same side of the street as block 5 when chatting and he was standing 16 feet north of the passageway.

And Eddie was very interested in the garden and balcony area only feet away from their chat. MG wanted to go back to do further investigation as it was dark at the time.

"The recovery of several pieces of the branches of the climbing plant in the garden (for later check of possible blood traces on them) and with the recovery of possible fibres on the garden wall next to the climbing plant."

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/5A_EDDIE-KEELA.htm

[Brietta]

It has been comprehensively demonstrated on this thread through maps, statements, cross-referencing that:

Witnesses Jeremy Wilkins and Jane Tanner both saw Gerry McCann close to the apartment gate.

Everything is cited. 

I repeat:

Witnesses Jeremy Wilkins and Jane Tanner both saw Gerry McCann close to the apartment gate.

And a summary of the cities.

On one side:
Jeremy Wilkins X2 statements.
Jane Tanner X2 statements.
Jane Tanner in the Channel Four Madeleine Was Here
Map from Wilkins.
Map from Tanner.

On the other:
Mr Gerry McCann

--

What on earth would be extraordinary about seeing the occupant of the apartment returning to his place at the dining table appearing to have left via the patio door, down the stair and through the gate?

If truth be told I doubt anyone is particularly interested in their meeting and where they met apart from those who have questioned Jane Tanner being able to flip flop past past them without being seen.

In many of the photographs I have seen of the street it seems to have been a particularly popular area for people to park their vehicles.
I would have thought it impossible to evaluate what could have been seen by the two conversationalists without being aware of where parked vehicles were located ... and we know from a witness statement there were vehicles parked there on the third.

My opinion is that they met in the approximate area indicated in Jeremy Wilkins sketch which is at the entrance to the lane ... other people are free to think they were standing in conversation wherever they like ... it didn't seem to worry either the Amaral or Rebelo investigations which checked it out.

It seems to be of little importance to the present Scotland Yard and Policia Judiciaria investigations who after reviewing all the information started looking for an abductor.
Which rather suggests they have found evidence which supports them taking that tack however important it may be where the victim's father, himself a victim and an independent witness were standing when Jane Tanner passed them and saw the man carrying a child coming from the direction of the apartments and carrying a child. 

[Gadfly1.3]

Jane Tanner passed them and saw the man carrying a child coming from the direction of the apartments and carrying a child.

The man you describe Brietta -- has been ruled out by SY as an innocent father.  If you need any help with this - I've put the cites on previous pages.  Thus...

Miss Tanner's value to the investigation is that she saw:
1) Mr Wilkins & Mr McCann chatting near the apartment gate.

You ask: "What on earth would be extraordinary about seeing the occupant of the apartment returning to his place at the dining table appearing to have left via the patio door, down the stair and through the gate?"  --  and by doing so, you ultimately acknowledge Gerry's path that night.

Thank you for adapting to the evidence.  All we know is Mr McCann came out the apartment next to the garden via the steps, bumped into Mr Wilkins, and chatted with him -- something that was further verified by Jane Tanner.

Gerry simply misremembered where he was -- that can happen after a drink or two.  So now, I'm sure even Mr McCann would even accept that he probably was next to the garden gate during the chat with Mr Wilkins -- especially if two of his friends place him there.

[pathfinder73]

Oh no Gerry would have to be right and other two wrong as Jane found out in their reconstruction. Not all was lost, listen to the football comment from Jane and about Gerry being gone a long time before she even left the table. What goes around comes around 

[G-Unit]

Pegasus.

Why are you supporting a lie?

You have said yourself that Jane Tanner is an honest witness.  On video previously posted by Brietta, you saw her recoil from Gerry when he got it wrong and was rather rude. 

From a position where she was fairly close to the gate, YOU (and we all) saw her walk down the hill a few strides to the alleyway corner.  She was upset and she very deliberately walked to the corner where the chat happened. 

YOU saw Jane Tanner indicate very definitely where Gerry and Jez were talking ... and that was near that alleyway corner.  The alleyway corner was about  6 metres away from the gate ... and yes, in general terms, 6 metres is fairly close ...

... BUT in this instance where Gadfly is insisting that Gerry and Jez were chatting by the gate as opposed to on the alleyway corner, it is a lie


It is not like you, Pegasus, to blatently put out disinformation like this, altho there have been odd other instances.

Care to explain why you are allowing Gadfly to twist your ear?  ... or are you both following the same agenda?  We experienced readers of this forum can all guess what that dishonest agenda is.



Why are you supporting the disinformation of Gadfly?

Accusing Gadfly of lying is wrong. Numerous cites have been provided showing that Gerry and Jez conversed near the gate. Here are just two for you;

2115: JT leaves table, and sees GM talking with fellow resident ("Jez" Wilkins) outside the patio gate of 5A. The two were standing just up the hill from the gate towards Rua A. da Silva Road. She did not speak to GM as she passed.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/TIME_LINE_3_MAY_07.htm

At this time they were stood with Gerry's back to the building near to the gate and Jeremy facing him. Rua Dr Agostino was about 10-15 meters to his right and the pathway leading to the front of the apartment blocks about 5 meters to his left.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/JEREMY_BRIGET.htm

If you maintain that Gadfly is lying you need to explain why Jane Tanner and Gerry McCann both agreed with the timeline information produced by the group and why Jeremy said what he said above.

[sadie]

1.  I am sorry Gadfly if you have felt my wrath but to state as fact,  that Gerry and Jez chatted at the gate is sooo wrong.  There is a small amount of stuff that suggests the gate, but it is heavily outweighed by other evidence.
 
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/9of8-ecf89375.gif  Jez wilkins map.   [Clearly out of scale but it will suffice]
 
On this map, Jez unequivocally pinpoints his and Gerry’s position as being exactly on the corner of the alleyway.  There is no going away from the fact that he has shown where they were standing.  Please do no deny that.
 
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[sadie]

1.  I am sorry Gadfly if you have felt my wrath but to state as fact,  that Gerry and Jez chatted at the gate is sooo wrong.  There is a small amount of stuff that suggests the gate, but it is heavily outweighed by other evidence.
 
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/9of8-ecf89375.gif  Jez wilkins map.   [Clearly out of scale but it will suffice]
 
On this map, Jez unequivocally pinpoints his and Gerry’s position as being exactly on the corner of the alleyway.  There is no going away from the fact that he has shown where they were standing.  Please do no deny that.
 
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2.  Furthermore in the following report Jez says that they met at the end of the alleyway
 
http://www.mccannfiles.com/id327.html under Jeremy Wilkins ... scroll down
 
Maddie: The Secret Witness, 16 September 2007
  Maddie: The Secret Witness News of the World (no longer available online)

TV boss holds vital clue to mystery

-snip-
Next time they may be quizzed in the UK by British police assisting their EU counterparts on the inquiry.

Wilkins' crucial encounter with Gerry took place at 9.10pm on the main street outside the apartments next to the McCanns'—and at the entrance to a narrow alleyway that runs past the back of them.
-snip-

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[sadie]

3.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/P1/01_VOLUME_Ia_Page_50.jpg  Jane Tanners map .  [Clearly out of scale with a huge back garden to 5A and a tiny apartment (which is the shaded in portion), but  will suffice]
 
On this map, Jane marks her OWN position, which is adjacent to 5A gate .... and way further down the road she shows where Gerry and Jez were chatting.  They were near the corner of the alleyway NOT at the side gate.
 
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[sadie]

4.
Briettas post above from Gerrys perspective.  Thank you Brietta.  This clearly states the positions as Gerrty saw them



Have a dental appointment and other commitments .  May not be able to get back to elaborate on this today, but ther is a fair bit to comment on.
 
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[stephen25000]

3.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/P1/01_VOLUME_Ia_Page_50.jpg  Jane Tanners map .  [Clearly out of scale with a huge back garden to 5A and a tiny apartment (which is the shaded in portion), but  will suffice]
 
On this map, Jane marks her OWN position, which is adjacent to 5A gate .... and way further down the road she shows where Gerry and Jez were chatting.  They were near the corner of the alleyway NOT at the side gate.
 
##############################################

You are assuming Sadie as per usual that the witnesses told the truth.

[Brietta]

The man you describe Brietta -- has been ruled out by SY as an innocent father.  If you need any help with this - I've put the cites on previous pages.  Thus...

Miss Tanner's value to the investigation is that she saw:
1) Mr Wilkins & Mr McCann chatting near the apartment gate.

You ask: "What on earth would be extraordinary about seeing the occupant of the apartment returning to his place at the dining table appearing to have left via the patio door, down the stair and through the gate?"  --  and by doing so, you ultimately acknowledge Gerry's path that night.

Thank you for adapting to the evidence.  All we know is Mr McCann came out the apartment next to the garden via the steps, bumped into Mr Wilkins, and chatted with him -- something that was further verified by Jane Tanner.

Gerry simply misremembered where he was -- that can happen after a drink or two.  So now, I'm sure even Mr McCann would even accept that he probably was next to the garden gate during the chat with Mr Wilkins -- especially if two of his friends place him there.

If he was next to the garden gate when holding a conversation with Jeremy Wilkins ... how exactly did he get there?

Jeremy Wilkins did not see him exiting the gate ... he assumed that he had.

He saw him walking in the direction of the tapas.  He crossed the road to speak with him ~ during which time Gerry who had also seen him slowed and moved towards him which is possibly why he 'remembered' crossing the road.

So after being seen on his way towards the tapas walking away from the gate ... the only way he could have got back to it would have been to retrace his steps to get back to it.
Did Jeremy fail to notice him walking backwards??

Given another minute either way ... it is possible that Jeremy Wilkins could have been in the position of being able to give a fuller description of the man seen by Jane Tanner.
Their conversation was brief.  Had they just waved and continued each to his destination without stopping it is almost certain he would have met the man seen by Jane Tanner face to face.

[sadie]

5.
 
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atfDV7imHHY
 

Jane Tanner showing the exact spot where Gerry and Jez were chatting at 10.04.  I suggest that you start at 9.10.
 
Gerry goes on to show what he remembers and it is quite possible that they met in the middle of the road, but with the dangers of that, they moved back to/wards the safety of the pavement by the alleyway.  Jez was still in the road (kerb) according to reports, but Gerry was on the kerbstone edge.   Presumably Jez and the pushchair were protected there by parked cars and he stood in a gap chatting to Gerry
 

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[Gadfly1.3]

1.  I am sorry Gadfly if you have felt my wrath but to state as fact,  that Gerry and Jez chatted at the gate is sooo wrong.  There is a small amount of stuff that suggests the gate, but it is heavily outweighed by other evidence.
 
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/9of8-ecf89375.gif  Jez wilkins map.   [Clearly out of scale but it will suffice]
 
On this map, Jez unequivocally pinpoints his and Gerry’s position as being exactly on the corner of the alleyway.  There is no going away from the fact that he has shown where they were standing.  Please do no deny that.
 
####################

I apologise to everyone if I continue to restate my findings on this particular thread, but I believe that for the casual observer, it is worth doing.

Miss Tanner's value to the investigation is that she saw Mr Wilkins & Mr McCann chatting near the apartment gate.

All of that is cited, regardless of what Sadie says.  The cites included:

Jeremy Wilkins X2 statements.
Jane Tanner X2 statements.
Jane Tanner in the Channel Four Madeleine Was Here
Map from Wilkins.
Map from Tanner.

(In terms of credibility, Tanner & Wilkins are acquaintances of Mr MrCann).

I urge all casual observers, and the open-minded, to search out all of those resources that can be found on the pages prior to this one (be patient and wade through it).

With regard to Sadie - apart from the fact she didn't apologise for the factually incorrect terms ('liar', 'propaganda', 'insinuation', and 'disinformation'), she noted that she is sorry that I felt her 'wrath'.  I'll let her continue with that line, quoting the maxim of Napoleon Bonaparte that my favourite university professor used to remind me about when debating: to 'never interrupt your enemy when he is making a mistake.'