Author Topic: Oscar Pistorius trial commences in Pretoria, South Africa. Includes Court video.  (Read 234125 times)

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Offline Myster

I know it has to happen, but this whole trial is appalling me.

If Oscar did accidentally shoot Reeva ... and we dont know yet ... then to have to go thru the abrasive interogation that he is being subjected to is mind bogglingly cruel, imo.

It feels like the treatment that Blacks used to get when Apartheid was prevalent.

Someone that I used to work with bragged about it  8)><( and then laughed.

She was some sort of official and she used to command the black man "Come here, Boy".  Then she or her hubby would smack him hard across the face ... both sides, just so he knew his place ... before he even opened his mouth  ......................  Nazis.  Fascists.  Bullies, I hate them



The prosecution lead lawyer seemed to be using a similar but watered down version of the same  technique.  The way he addressed Oscar was disgusting imo
.
As to guilty of premeditated murder, we dont KNOW yet 

I know this case has to happen, but surely it can be done in a civil manner?

Thank God the world is watching !

Nothing wrong with that... it's his job !

What do you expect Nel to do... pussyfoot around and gently ask if Pistorius is telling the truth ?  It has to be prised out of obstructive intransigent killers, Sadie.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5VWDIlSMTMc
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline Brietta

Yes John, it does appear so, but I think he is smiling at the white haired person behind the computer screen and Oscar's talking attracted the attention of Nel and the chap behind Nel. It would be a bad thing if he was grinning at Nel, unless of course Nel was telling him he was about to ask for adjourn.

I'm with John on this one, Anna, I think his line of vision seems to be in the direction of the prosecutor who is looking directly at him.

I think it is sometimes wrong to take a fleeting expression caught in one frame in a moment of time and give it more attention than it deserves.  However,this man has spent days howling and retching in court and we are all left wondering about how genuine his distress is, including Reeva's family.


Reeva Steenkamp's mother reveals her personal hell every time she watches Oscar Pistorius in the dock

Apr 10, 2014 08:27 
By Lucy Thornton
THE mum of Reeva Steenkamp has told how she has been unable to take her eyes off Oscar Pistorius as the champion athlete has stood trial for murdering her daughter.

The heartbroken mother has sat in dignified silence for weeks while the “Blade Runner” athlete accused of murdering her daughter Reeva collapses in hysterics, vomits, retches and puts his fingers in his ears.
She has endured endless bloody pictures of the crime scene, the weapon and, horrifyingly, Reeva’s catastrophic head wound.
But it has left her haunted by one burning question – is he acting?

June has exclusively revealed to the Mirror how she studies Pistorius's every move in a bid to find the truth.
She admitted: “It was a big thing for me to go to the trial in the first place and face up to what is going on.
“It’s very traumatic when certain things come up. This is my child – and I must listen to the graphic detail.
“I look at Oscar the whole time, to see how he is coping, how he is behaving. I’m obsessed with looking at him, it’s just instinctive, I can’t explain it.
“I keep thinking, ‘let me see how he’s taking this’. He has been very dramatic, the vomiting and crying.”
She added: “I think he’s just about keeping himself together. I don’t know whether he’s acting.
"Most of the time he’s on his cell phone or looking down at papers or writing notes.”
Talking about that very public apology from the Paralympics champion, June said: “It left me unmoved. I knew it was coming.
"My lawyers had prepared me for it.
“I cried for the first time, ‘Yes’, but not because he apologised, because of the suffering and agony that my darling daughter went through and because I will never have her again.”
She admitted it has been an ordeal hearing the gruesome details of Reeva’s death, as expert after expert discusses blood spatter, flesh-tearing bullets and whether or not she was capable of screaming before she died.
As the trial has gone on, she said, Pistorius’s family have slowly started to make overtures to her.
His sister Aimee handed her a note to say how “sorry” the family is for her loss and inviting her to “reach out” to them for support.
But June, 67 dismissed the approach, saying: “It won’t bring my daughter back.”
She added: “We just want to know the truth.”
June, who never met 29-year-old Reeva’s celebrity boyfriend, wears a picture of her model and law graduate daughter on her lapel in court.
She has previously criticised Pistorius for failing to acknowledge her on the first day of the trial.
She said: “He did eventually look at me. My presence unnerves him, I’m sure of it. He’s answerable to me.
"He looked at me and said, ‘Good morning, Mrs Steenkamp’.
"I never answered, I just nodded my head.
“It was for him to see me, nothing to do with what I’m seeing and what I’m feeling, do you understand?
"I don’t know the man. All I know is what he’s done.
“He must see me there in the court, he must feel my eyes boring into him, I think it makes a lot of difference.
“I do look at him too much, maybe. I like to see how he is reacting.
I can see him very clearly, even without my glasses – he’s the only one I can see, he’s right in front of me.”
June winced as she recalled one particular picture during the trial that “wiped her out”.
She cannot bring herself to describe it, but said: “It was just horrendous, I will see that picture for the rest of my life.
"Until the day I die, I promise you.”
As the world watches her every move, June is hurting. She is just not showing it – in complete contrast to Pistorius.
She explained: “I keep it all in and when I get back to the hotel it all comes out and I break down.
“I start crying out, crying all the tears and pain I’ve held inside in court. I feel very vulnerable.
"The whole world is watching you and you don’t want people to see you when you’re in pain.
“I don’t want to be crying in public. I’m a private person. I like to keep my feelings to myself.
“I’m being strong for Reeva, I have to be there. It’s hard for me to do it, but I’m representing my child.
“I’m there for her, as much as it’s hell for me, I know that I have to be there, I’m compelled to be there.”
June often attends court with Reeva’s cousin Kim, who was very close to her daughter.
She said: “Kim looks after me like I’m her mother.”
But June has had to endure the daily nightmare without husband Barry, 69, who has been too ill to travel the 700 miles to Pretoria from their home in Port Elizabeth.
But now the devoted dad has vowed to risk his life to be at his wife’s side.
He said: “I’ve had a stroke and they advised me not to fly, but I want to go. I want to be in court.
"June doesn’t want me to, but I’m making my own plans to get there.”
June fears the stress of the trial could kill her husband, a professional race horse trainer – even though she understands why he wants to make the trip.
She admitted they both share a deep feeling of helplessness at the the thought of their daughter’s final agony.
“That’s all I think about when I’m on my own,” she said.
“It haunts me... we couldn’t help her, we couldn’t do anything.
“I imagine how she must have been in terror and pain and suffering, devastated by what was going on.
"I relive that scene in the bathroom and it’s changed me so much, made me harder.”
She added: “My daughter is dead. He killed her.
"He shot her till she was dead in that toilet, in that bathroom, so how am I ever going to feel better about it?
 “She was the most wonderful, beautiful person, inside and out, and she was everything to Barry and me – our lives are destroyed.
"At the moment I’m just surviving , trying to make it through each day, I pray a lot and don’t feel God has let me down.
"If you live with God you take the good with the bad. What am I praying for? Strength.
“I’m representing Reeva at the trial, People want to see me there.
"Also suddenly I’ve just got strength from somewhere and the will to be there every day, because it’s not easy.”
June insisted: “I don’t care what happens to Oscar, I don’t even care if he goes free.
"All I know is that he has to stand up to what he’s done and – if he has to – pay for it.
“What difference is it going to make to me if he goes to prison for 25 years or is allowed to walk free?
"No one can tell me how I should feel, and those are my feelings.
“I’m not a person who wants to punish him. I want my daughter back, but it’s never going to happen.”
Barry added: “I don’t need revenge, just the truth.”
But June said of their daughter’s killer: “He has an aggressive persona, he’s used to having people adore him, so it must be pretty different for him now.
“He’s been spoilt by other people, that’s why he struts around and looks superior.
"He’s gone from hero to devil."
http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/uk-world-news/oscar-pistorius-trial-reeva-steenkamps-3395105

"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline Myster

I'm with John on this one, Anna, I think his line of vision seems to be in the direction of the prosecutor who is looking directly at him.

I think it is sometimes wrong to take a fleeting expression caught in one frame in a moment of time and give it more attention than it deserves.  However,this man has spent days howling and retching in court and we are all left wondering about how genuine his distress is, including Reeva's family.


Nel could have been distracted by noises at the courtroom door, somebody's mobile ringtone going off, or his i-pad was answering back.   It's happened before.
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline Brietta

Nel could have been distracted by noises at the courtroom door, somebody's mobile ringtone going off, or his i-pad was answering back.   It's happened before.

Possibly, and it is not clear if he is reacting to such a distraction or addressing Oscar Pretorius.

Do you have an explanation for what is undoubtedly a wide smile on OP's face?
However, without knowing what the context is, we can only speculate about what is passing through his mind and it is of no importance anyway.

The court will decide on the evidence being presented, not interpretation of one still frame and at the moment the focus has passed from OP to what happened to Reeva and what he says occurred in the bathroom and to objects in the crime scene.
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline Myster

I was only going on what had happened on a different day, when Nel's own i-pad started to make unusual talk back noises. One of the defence teams' mobile phones rang yesterday too, which lightened the sombre courtroom atmosphere for a short time, so there was some subdued laughter.
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline sadie

With greatest respect to you Sadie, it is my opinion that OP has been given free rein to defend himself by the court.
He has, of course, tried to paint himself in the best possible light as is his right and has spent a lot of time to do so.
 
It is now his turn to be interrogated thoroughly, and to have his actions and the statements he has made investigated in the minutest detail.
That is the duty owed by the prosecution to Reeva Steenkamp who suffered a horrendous death at his hands.   

I accept that Brietta and I accept that he has to be questioned.  Today wasn't so bad but yesterdays questioning need not have been so brutal.

It seems that almost certainly he is guilty of killing someone and in a reckless manner, and if so, he deserves a good jail sentence. 

But that prosecuting counsel need not have been so brutal at the beginning. 

Sorry Tim, but as I said before, it reminded me of the way that people I knew, who had dealt with black Africans by smacking them hard across the face before they started dealing with the situation.... deliberately hurting and demeaning them

No need for it.  Nazi / Fascist type behaviour. 

Offline Wonderfulspam

I accept that Brietta and I accept that he has to be questioned.  Today wasn't so bad but yesterdays questioning need not have been so brutal.

It seems that almost certainly he is guilty of killing someone and in a reckless manner, and if so, he deserves a good jail sentence. 

But that prosecuting counsel need not have been so brutal at the beginning. 

Sorry Tim, but as I said before, it reminded me of the way that people I knew, who had dealt with black Africans by smacking them hard across the face before they started dealing with the situation.... deliberately hurting and demeaning them

No need for it.  Nazi / Fascist type behaviour.

What's so bad about the Nazis or fascism for that matter?

What really bothers me for example is, it's ok for the Scots to vote for the SNP but when I vote BNP, go to EDL rallies & goose step around in a Luftwafte uniform, people call me racist.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2014, 09:23:52 AM by Wonderfulspam »
Christian Brueckner Fan Club

Offline Anna

Friday 11th april 2014
session 1

adjourned 12 noon until Monday 14th april
« Last Edit: April 11, 2014, 12:02:59 PM by Anna »
“You should not honour men more than truth.”
― Plato

Offline colombosstogey

I accept that Brietta and I accept that he has to be questioned.  Today wasn't so bad but yesterdays questioning need not have been so brutal.

It seems that almost certainly he is guilty of killing someone and in a reckless manner, and if so, he deserves a good jail sentence. 

But that prosecuting counsel need not have been so brutal at the beginning. 

Sorry Tim, but as I said before, it reminded me of the way that people I knew, who had dealt with black Africans by smacking them hard across the face before they started dealing with the situation.... deliberately hurting and demeaning them

No need for it.  Nazi / Fascist type behaviour.

And yet it goes on openely everywhere especially in the states and even now in the UK.

I didnt see anything of concern.

This guy was trying to rattle Pistorius thats his job. Why would he pussy foot around him..?

Offline Mr Moderator

Pistorius told the court today that Reeva never screamed and that he was silent so as not to alert the so-called intruder yet several witnesses heard her scream and before the final shots.  He must think the judge is a total buffoon if he believes for a nanosecond that he can get away with that one.
« Last Edit: April 11, 2014, 02:57:08 PM by Mr Moderator »

Offline Brietta

Initially I thought Oscar Pretorius’s version of events was being accepted by default.

I think the prosecutor is doing a great job in the way he is weaving each small piece of evidence together to establish what did and what did not happen that night.
It had been impressed on us so often that the police had tampered with the crime scene, I for one believed it, but no more. 

The dogged determination of Mr Nel regarding getting answers to the question he was asking and not the one rehearsed is making things clearer.  From the positioning of the fans to the duvet on the floor with Reeva’s denims on top and forensic questioning about the alarm system he established that OP’s narrative was impossible. 

He left Pretorius with no room for manoeuvre with his description of Reeva Steenkamp standing directly behind the door pleading with him before he shot four times using ammunition he knew would cause devastating injury. 

Apparently OP will not be allowed to discuss the case with anyone including counsel while he remains under cross examination so IMO he is going to have a really bad weekend thinking what is waiting for him on Monday. 
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline Myster

Now that Nel has got his opponent on the ropes, he decided to finish early to let Pistorius seriously consider his position over the weekend. I'm expecting a knockout blow, i.e. a confession early next week.
It's one of them cases, in'it... one of them f*ckin' cases.

Offline Tim Invictus

Pistorius told the court today that Reeva never screamed and that he was silent so as not to alert the so-called intruder yet several witnesses heard her scream and before the final shots.  He must think the judge is a total buffoon if he believes for a nanosecond that he can get away with that one.

Pistorius is saying Reeva didn't scream because he is going to introduce 'evidence' later, thru 'experts', confirming he actually screams like a girl when he is panicking. That's also why he said he was shouting and screaming as he went down the passage to the bathroom!

It makes him sound ridiculous because Reeva would have responded to him but he has to say it to counteract all the neighbours who testified to hearing a woman's screams before the shots! Oscar is really between a rock and a hard place on this point and that is the best story he can come up with; however ludicrous it sounds!

Gerrie Nel is quite brilliant in my opinion!

Offline Andrea

Not had chance to follow this trial to be honest. Tim, what do you think the likely outcome will be?

Offline Anna

The usual excuse that he can’t remember and/or the police moved everything in the room. There wasn’t time to think
                     He said she didn’t scream and if she was screaming he wouldn’t have heard her, because his ears were ringing from the first shot.
                    He also said he told her (quietly, because he didn’t want the intruder to hear) to go down and call the police because he said, he thought she was in bed. He then said he ran down the hall shouting and screaming?.
                   Its pitch dark in the bedroom when the curtains are closed, he says. Then said he could see the outline of the Jeans/duvet by a little light on his amplifier ,  which he said he had covered with jeans,
                 Her Jeans were on top of duvet on the floor, which means the duvet wasn’t on the bed when he left the room because he removed the jeans to expose the little Led light so he could see enough to get out
 but he couldn’t see his partner?
 He found his gun OK in the dark!
He was in a right muddle today

In fact so am I! The above doesn’t make sense at all does it?


“You should not honour men more than truth.”
― Plato