The tapas group and the 'reconstitution' that was never to take place.

[Carana]

Quote from Kate's book

And so it was that on 11th December 2009 I first laid eyes on Sr Goncalo Amaral.  It was also the first time he had laid eyes on me.  It is extraordinary that he could have said and written so many awful things about a person he had never met.
End quote

Regarding your second para.  I don't believe that people who are suspicious and scared of their own police force would think it was good idea to approach them with a complaint about them.

I do sometimes wonder whether fear of the police resulted in Portugese people who may have had information about this case not coming forward because they were too scared of what might happen to them.   Smithman is one example IMO.

Or were led to believe that she's dead and the parentswhatdunnit, so no point any more....

[Benice]

Or were led to believe that she's dead and the parentswhatdunnit, so no point any more....

Indeed.  A good point Carana.

[pathfinder73]

[/b]
And if you believe that you'll believe anything IMO.      If you think Gerry was responsible for Madeleine's disappearance, do you honestly think that he would be so stupid as to behave in the manner Amaral describes at such a time?  Do you really think he would even be taking calls from his friends - let alone having a laugh with them whilst waiting for what could be a massively important phone call? 

 If he was the guilty person, then he would have to be completely mad to behave like that in front of so many of the very police officers he wanted to convince that  Madeleine had been abducted.  Common sense please!

It's far more likely IMO that the UK officers tried to relieve the tension he must have been feeling as the time ticked by - by talking to him about football.    If it happened at all.   

I suppose you also believe Amaral's description of how Kate behaved (the sofa incident) too where he talks as if he was there with her.   Or his description of her 'inappropriate' behaviour when they were called back to the police station on 4th May - he wasn't there either. 

The first time they laid eyes on oneanother was 11th December 2009 at court and as Kate says in her book about that occasion -  ''It's extraordinary he could have said and written so many awful things about a person he had never met''

So I ask again - if it was perfectly normal procedure for the Lead investigator NOT to have any contact with the McCanns, then why did he go out of his way to hide that fact - both in his book and TV interviews?  Even when he was given the opportunity to admit the true facts - he studiously avoided doing so.

Members of SY and many others were witnesses. If Kate was present that day she would have met him.

GA: And then we watch that, us Portuguese who were there and the English, we watched it in stupefaction, he was sitting there with a lollipop laughing on the phone and we were all waiting.

JP: Ah he was on the phone and sucking on a lollipop wasn't it and laughing and chatting?

GA: Yes! Completely detached from what was going on and about to happen.

JP: So that shocked you in particular?

GA: Me and the colleagues who were present.

[Benice]

Members of SY and many others were witnesses. If Kate was present that day she would have met him.

GA: And then we watch that, us Portuguese who were there and the English, we watched it in stupefaction, he was sitting there with a lollipop laughing on the phone and we were all waiting.

JP: Ah he was on the phone and sucking on a lollipop wasn't it and laughing and chatting?

GA: Yes! Completely detached from what was going on and about to happen.

JP: So that shocked you in particular?

GA: Me and the colleagues who were present.

There is no way Kate would lie in her book - knowing that Amaral could prove she lied.  That would be stupid.

Your quote is a repeat of what he claims in his book - which is littered with lies, half truths and nasty innuendo.

If you really believe that an intelligent person like Gerry McCann would be clowning around whilst waiting for what might be a crucial phone call regarding the fate of his beloved daughter  - whilst everyone else present was anxiously waiting with baited breath - then I can't hep you.

IMO if he was innocent he wouldn't behave like that -  he would be as nervous as hell.  And and if he was guilty - he most certainly would not behave like that - especially in front of the police of all people.

Common sense PF?

[Mr Gray]

There are no excuses for not attending a reconstruction, unless you have something to hide.

that is a ridiculously simplistic post and is obviously incorrect...in the real world...depending on the circumstances ...there would be several reasons for not attending a reconstruction. Something to hide would be one of them but not the only one.

[stephen25000]

that is a ridiculously simplistic post and is obviously incorrect...in the real world...depending on the circumstances ...there would be several reasons for not attending a reconstruction. Something to hide would be one of them but not the only one.

There are no excuses.

Saying you can't get time off work is cobblers, as some have done.

[pathfinder73]

There is no way Kate would lie in her book - knowing that Amaral could prove she lied.  That would be stupid.

Your quote is a repeat of what he claims in his book - which is littered with lies, half truths and nasty innuendo.

If you really believe that an intelligent person like Gerry McCann would be clowning around whilst waiting for what might be a crucial phone call regarding the fate of his beloved daughter  - whilst everyone else present was anxiously waiting with baited breath - then I can't hep you.

IMO if he was innocent he wouldn't behave like that -  he would be as nervous as hell.  And and if he was guilty - he most certainly would not behave like that - especially in front of the police of all people.

Common sense PF?

Kate wasn't there only Gerry. If he lied about it you would have heard it about it. Many witnesses were there. It's no surprise anybody would have suspected them on the 4th after those deleted phone calls,  tampering and contradictions in statements. The PJ were very lenient with them in the early days. They've changed their approach now - look at the recent Mikaeel Kular case. No messing around the mother last person to see him was straight in the station and interrogated.

[sadie]

There are no excuses.

Saying you can't get time off work is cobblers, as some have done.

Depends on your work schedule.  Some senior occupations are committed in a way that Teachers are not.

... and possibly on the fear that they, the Tapas members, might be fitted up.


They would know of all the injustices in the Cipriano case ... and warned about the PJ and the PT so called Justice System, which often seems biased.

They would know about the injustices in the Michael Cook case.  Gun thrust in his mouth, hung upside down from a window and his soles beaten.  Went to Court in a totally unclean state having been denied proper toilet facilities.  Alibi evidence and other evidence ignored in Court.
They would know about these injustices and atrocities.

Likewise they had experienced disinformation put out about them, like being swingers , liars etc


They also would have guessed that the reconstruction was going to be twisted to produce false evidence against them and their friends Kate and Gerry.   The writing was on the wall.  It was NOT about FINDING MADELEINE,
... but about trying to produce and twist evidence about Kate and Gerry and maybe themselves in order to make them fit "the Bill".   


Another case erm "solved" .  Another notch on Amarals gun ?


For Gawds sake, why would they be so mad to even think of going back for a reconstruction ?

[pathfinder73]

Depends on your work schedule.  Some senior occupations are committed in a way that Teachers are not.

... and possibly on the fear that they, the Tapas members, might be fitted up.


They would know of all the injustices in the Cipriano case ... and warned about the PJ and the PT so called Justice System, which often seems biased.

They would know about the injustices in the Michael Cook vase.  Gun thrust in his mouth, hung upside down from a window and his soles beaten.  Went to Court in a totally unclean state having been denied proper toilet facilities.  Alibi evidence and other evidence ignored in Court.
They would know about these injustices and atrocities.

Likewise they had experienced disinformation put out about them, like being swingers , liars etc


They also would have guessed that the recostruction was going to be twisted to produce false evidence against them and their friends Kate and Gerry.

The writing was on the wall.  It was NOT about FINDING MADELEINE,
... but about trying to produce and twist evidence about Kate and Gerry and maybe themselves in order to make them fit "the Bill".   


Another case erm "solved" .  Another notch on Amarals gun !


For Gawds sake, why would they be so mad to even think of going back for a reconstruction ?

Amaral didn't tamper with the crime scene.

Amaral didn't delete phone calls.

Amaral didn't get a new second mobile.

Amaral didn't contradict and change his statements.

Amaral didn't phone Sky or a priest.

Amaral didn't ask for Gordon Brown's help.

Amaral didn't bark at the McCanns clothes.

Amaral didn't leave the car boot open.

Amaral didn't say the unidentified man was Gerry McCann.

[Mr Gray]

Amaral didn't tamper with the crime scene.

Amaral didn't delete phone calls.

Amaral didn't get a new second mobile.

Amaral didn't contradict and change his statements.

Amaral didn't phone Sky or a priest.

Amaral didn't ask for Gordon Brown's help.

Amaral didn't bark at the McCanns clothes.

Amaral didn't leave the car boot open.

Amaral didn't say the unidentified man was Gerry McCann.

amaral has been found guilty of a criminal offence in court...the McCanns haven't

[mercury]

Depends on your work schedule.  Some senior occupations are committed in a way that Teachers are not.

... and possibly on the fear that they, the Tapas members, might be fitted up.


They would know of all the injustices in the Cipriano case ... and warned about the PJ and the PT so called Justice System, which often seems biased.

They would know about the injustices in the Michael Cook vase.  Gun thrust in his mouth, hung upside down from a window and his soles beaten.  Went to Court in a totally unclean state having been denied proper toilet facilities.  Alibi evidence and other evidence ignored in Court.
They would know about these injustices and atrocities.

Likewise they had experienced disinformation put out about them, like being swingers , liars etc


They also would have guessed that the recostruction was going to be twisted to produce false evidence against them and their friends Kate and Gerry.

The writing was on the wall.  It was NOT about FINDING MADELEINE,
... but about trying to produce and twist evidence about Kate and Gerry and maybe themselves in order to make them fit "the Bill".   


Another case erm "solved" .  Another notch on Amarals gun !


For Gawds sake, why would they be so mad to even think of going back for a reconstruction ?

They ended up worse for wear though by refusing. Looked like colluding/guilty all by themselves.All your talk of being fitted up/arrested/tortured is risible. They will have had UK police plus diplomatic perusal at all times.

[insider]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-559675/Portuguese-police-accuse-McCanns-spokesman-Clarence-Mitchell-lying-teeth.html

Portuguese police accuse McCanns' spokesman Clarence Mitchell of 'lying through his teeth'

By VANESSA ALLEN

Last updated at 00:50 16 April 2008


Detectives investigating the disappearance of Madeleine McCann have branded her parents' spokesman "a manipulative liar".

The head of the Portuguese police federation, Carlos Anjos, accused Clarence Mitchell of engineering a fight with officers to sabotage a reconstruction of the disappearance.

Police statements made by Kate and Gerry McCann were leaked to the media last week as they travelled to Brussels to promote a campaign for a child alert system.

The statements revealed Maddie was left crying the night before she vanished on May 3.

At the time, Mr Mitchell accused police of masterminding the leak to overshadow the visit.

But Mr Anjos told the respected Portuguese newspaper Jornal de Noticias: 'He is a liar and a Machiavellian.

"Mr Mitchell wants to discredit the Policia Judiciaria and invent excuses so the McCanns do not come to Portugal to participate in the reconstruction of the night she disappeared.

"He lies with as many teeth as he has in his mouth. Finally we know what side truth is on."

[Angelo222]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-559675/Portuguese-police-accuse-McCanns-spokesman-Clarence-Mitchell-lying-teeth.html

Portuguese police accuse McCanns' spokesman Clarence Mitchell of 'lying through his teeth'

By VANESSA ALLEN

Last updated at 00:50 16 April 2008


Detectives investigating the disappearance of Madeleine McCann have branded her parents' spokesman "a manipulative liar".

The head of the Portuguese police federation, Carlos Anjos, accused Clarence Mitchell of engineering a fight with officers to sabotage a reconstruction of the disappearance.

Police statements made by Kate and Gerry McCann were leaked to the media last week as they travelled to Brussels to promote a campaign for a child alert system.

The statements revealed Maddie was left crying the night before she vanished on May 3.

At the time, Mr Mitchell accused police of masterminding the leak to overshadow the visit.

But Mr Anjos told the respected Portuguese newspaper Jornal de Noticias: 'He is a liar and a Machiavellian.

"Mr Mitchell wants to discredit the Policia Judiciaria and invent excuses so the McCanns do not come to Portugal to participate in the reconstruction of the night she disappeared.

"He lies with as many teeth as he has in his mouth. Finally we know what side truth is on."

I hadn't seen that particular article before but if it shows one thing it proves that the Portuguese police were aware that obstacles were being purposely put in the way of a reconstruction taking place involving the tapas group.  Moreover, he was right.

[insider]

I hadn't seen that particular article before but if it shows one thing it proves that the Portuguese police were aware that obstacles were being purposely put in the way of a reconstruction taking place involving the tapas group.  Moreover, he was right.

little wonder they were suspicious

[Mr Gray]

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-559675/Portuguese-police-accuse-McCanns-spokesman-Clarence-Mitchell-lying-teeth.html

Portuguese police accuse McCanns' spokesman Clarence Mitchell of 'lying through his teeth'

By VANESSA ALLEN

Last updated at 00:50 16 April 2008


Detectives investigating the disappearance of Madeleine McCann have branded her parents' spokesman "a manipulative liar".

The head of the Portuguese police federation, Carlos Anjos, accused Clarence Mitchell of engineering a fight with officers to sabotage a reconstruction of the disappearance.

Police statements made by Kate and Gerry McCann were leaked to the media last week as they travelled to Brussels to promote a campaign for a child alert system.

The statements revealed Maddie was left crying the night before she vanished on May 3.

At the time, Mr Mitchell accused police of masterminding the leak to overshadow the visit.

But Mr Anjos told the respected Portuguese newspaper Jornal de Noticias: 'He is a liar and a Machiavellian.

"Mr Mitchell wants to discredit the Policia Judiciaria and invent excuses so the McCanns do not come to Portugal to participate in the reconstruction of the night she disappeared.

"He lies with as many teeth as he has in his mouth. Finally we know what side truth is on."

Was this before amaral received a criminal conviction for lying...the PJ do not need anyone to discredit them...they are more than capable of doing it themselves