The Murders At White House Farm by Carol Ann Lee

[Holly Goodhead]

Holl, presupposing the 2 new books tell us what we already know, will you still tilt at lost windmills?

Will you ever explain why Bamber planned the murders?

Will you explain why the gun was free of prints?

Will you explain how Sheila was free of blood splatter on her legs?

I could go on, but I can't be arsed. If Sheila fought with Ralph in the kitchen, she would have been a mess. Covered in blood. And bruises. And gun residue.

I totally rest my case.

Can you explain please how  senior police officers at the soc, along with the police surgeon, all with years of experience all missed the obvious if it's as straight forward as you believe?

[Holly Goodhead]

If bamber is so guilty why the campaign for years for his innocence...wouldn't they have given upby now

The only person in the world who knows for sure whether or not JB is guilty is JB.  I'm prepared to accept he might be guilty as charged.  But what I'm not prepared to accept is that it's obvious he's guilty, there's no risk of a MoJ, and anyone who thinks otherwise is an idiot. 

Sadly the case has attracted some oddballs with dodgy pasts eg Michael Teskowski and bogus lawyer Giovanni DeStefano, now behind bars, along with emotionally unstable women.  This obviously hasn't helped JB's case.

[Holly Goodhead]

Btw I'm not one of the emotionally unstable women     Although I'm sure some might disagree!

[puglove]

Can you explain please how  senior police officers at the soc, along with the police surgeon, all with years of experience all missed the obvious if it's as straight forward as you believe?

Yes I can, Holl, thanks for asking - and a LOT more convincingly than you can explain why there is sweet Felicity Arkwright of evidence on Sheila and the gun!   


(And that's why Bamber is eating his Sunday spam fritter with Mick Philpott's hand on his leg.      )

[Daisy]

The only person in the world who knows for sure whether or not JB is guilty is JB.  I'm prepared to accept he might be guilty as charged.  But what I'm not prepared to accept is that it's obvious he's guilty, there's no risk of a MoJ, and anyone who thinks otherwise is an idiot. 

Sadly the case has attracted some oddballs with dodgy pasts eg Michael Teskowski and bogus lawyer Giovanni DeStefano, now behind bars, along with emotionally unstable women.  This obviously hasn't helped JB's case.

Can you name any of these emotionally unstable women Holly?  Jeremy spoke to me about some of his female friends and many were academics.  I know a couple of them including Aunt Agatha and I would never describe them as emotionally unstable.  Maybe you are party to information that I am not even though you never spoken to or met Jeremy.

[John]

Can you explain please how  senior police officers at the soc, along with the police surgeon, all with years of experience all missed the obvious if it's as straight forward as you believe?

The police surgeon had only the autopsy information and a little background information at his disposal in 1985 whereas the investigating officer had it all.  The argument that a doctor should have known better simply doesn't hold water.

[John]

The only person in the world who knows for sure whether or not JB is guilty is JB.  I'm prepared to accept he might be guilty as charged.  But what I'm not prepared to accept is that it's obvious he's guilty, there's no risk of a MoJ, and anyone who thinks otherwise is an idiot. 

Sadly the case has attracted some oddballs with dodgy pasts eg Michael Teskowski and bogus lawyer Giovanni DeStefano, now behind bars, along with emotionally unstable women.  This obviously hasn't helped JB's case.

The evidence is all there which convicted Jeremy Bamber, the chances of a moj having occurred are extremely low IMHO.

[Holly Goodhead]

Can you name any of these emotionally unstable women Holly?  Jeremy spoke to me about some of his female friends and many were academics.  I know a couple of them including Aunt Agatha and I would never describe them as emotionally unstable.  Maybe you are party to information that I am not even though you never spoken to or met Jeremy.

Hello Daisy lovely to see you posting again 

Yes there was a Sabina Butt mentioned in Roger Wilkes' book along with others can't recall their names now but its all in Roger Wilkes' book.  I found it quite amusing but I'm sure it wasn't for JB.  It involved an intimate exchange of letters ending up in the tabloids amongst other things.  Plus I think a phantom pregnancy?   Have you read Wilkes?  If not I would recommend. 

No I've never met or spoken with JB.  My contact with JB has been limited to a handful of letters over a long time period. 

[Holly Goodhead]

Yes I can, Holl, thanks for asking - and a LOT more convincingly than you can explain why there is sweet Felicity Arkwright of evidence on Sheila and the gun!   


(And that's why Bamber is eating his Sunday spam fritter with Mick Philpott's hand on his leg.      )

Puglove in less than 2 weeks time PH's book will be available for public consumption.  Apparently he is going to show anyone who cares to read his book that JB is guilty 100% and put the case to bed once and for all!  Apparently he has the 'smoking gun'.  You will then be able to humiliate and ridicule me like never before

[John]

Puglove in less than 2 weeks time PH's book will be available for public consumption.  Apparently he is going to show anyone who cares to read his book that JB is guilty 100% and put the case to bed once and for all!  Apparently he has the 'smoking gun'.  You will then be able to humiliate and ridicule me like never before

If I wanted bullshit all I need do is walk out the back door into the field.

[Holly Goodhead]

The police surgeon had only the autopsy information and a little background information at his disposal in 1985 whereas the investigating officer had it all.  The argument that a doctor should have known better simply doesn't hold water.

The police surgeon, Dr Ian Craig, witnessed all victims in situ and obviously observed the soc too.  A police surgeon is trained and experienced in dealing with such victims/soc are they not?  Chief Supt Harris accompanied Dr Craig when he certified the deaths at soc.  Here we have a highly trained and experienced police officer and a highly trained and experienced medical professional.  Am I going to run with DS Jones, who according to the pathologist could offer nothing of evidential value, over Dr Craig and Chief Sup Harris?  No I am not.  We don't have to all share the same views do we?  It makes no difference what we think, say or do the only people capable of changing JB's fate are three appeal court judges who will require substantial NEW evidence.

[John]

The police surgeon, Dr Ian Craig, witnessed all victims in situ and obviously observed the soc too.  A police surgeon is trained and experienced in dealing with such victims/soc are they not?  Chief Supt Harris accompanied Dr Craig when he certified the deaths at soc.  Here we have a highly trained and experienced police officer and a highly trained and experienced medical professional.  Am I going to run with DS Jones, who according to the pathologist could offer nothing of evidential value, over Dr Craig and Chief Sup Harris?  No I am not.  We don't have to all share the same views do we?  It makes no difference what we think, say or do the only people capable of changing JB's fate are three appeal court judges who will require substantial NEW evidence.

Did those two gentlemen you mentioned spend any time with the killer and his lover?  NO

Did Stan Jones spend any time with the killer and his lover?  YES

QED

[Holly Goodhead]

Did those two gentlemen you mentioned spend any time with the killer and his lover?  NO

Did Stan Jones spend any time with the killer and his lover?  YES

QED

As evidenced by the video Adam posted, DS Jones wan't able to provide anything of evidential value.  It was all based on JB's facial expressions, a supposed chuckle, his attitude during interviews etc, etc.  He even said he knew JB was guilty but in the next breath said he had to pray something turned up to prove him right.  In other words he thought he was guilty but had nothing concrete to go on until of course he secured JM's testimony and the silencer turned up!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bcTvqLk0MWU&feature=youtu.be&t=26m29s

Dr Vanezis' report confirms the same:

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=206.0;attach=740

[John]

As evidenced by the video Adam posted, DS Jones wan't able to provide anything of evidential value.  It was all based on JB's facial expressions, a supposed chuckle, his attitude during interviews etc, etc.  He even said he knew JB was guilty but in the next breath said he had to pray something turned up to prove him right.  In other words he thought he was guilty but had nothing concrete to go on until of course he secured JM's testimony and the silencer turned up!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bcTvqLk0MWU&feature=youtu.be&t=26m29s

Dr Vanezis' report confirms the same:

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=206.0;attach=740

That's what separates a good copper from a Muppet.  Jones knew from day 1 that all was not as it should have been.  Excellent police work on his behalf.

[Daisy]

Hello Daisy lovely to see you posting again 

Yes there was a Sabina Butt mentioned in Roger Wilkes' book along with others can't recall their names now but its all in Roger Wilkes' book.  I found it quite amusing but I'm sure it wasn't for JB.  It involved an intimate exchange of letters ending up in the tabloids amongst other things.  Plus I think a phantom pregnancy?   Have you read Wilkes?  If not I would recommend. 

No I've never met or spoken with JB.  My contact with JB has been limited to a handful of letters over a long time period.

Thank you Holly.

I thought you were referring to recent women.  No I haven't read Roger's book.  If I didn't know Jeremy then I would read it but I think it is outdated now.  I have hundreds of documents which have superceded anything in his book so it doesn't really interest me.  It is no secret that Jeremy has always had an eye for the ladies and this hasn't changed over the years.  He is certainly a charismatic man and it amazes me that he is never depressed or miserable.  It was difficult to imagine he was speaking to me from a prison.  This may be his way of coping and having hope or of course it could be for another reason.

I have read Colin's book which didn't so much focus on the murders but on his relationship with the family.  I found it quite upsetting, especially when I saw the pictures the twins had drawn.  A psychologist said they had been deeply disturbed.  I also couldn't understand how Jeremy could have acted with total disrespect at the funerals.

As you say, the only person who truly knows if he is innocent is Jeremy himself and who are we to judge one way or the other when none of us were present on that evening.