Wandering Off Topic

[Vertigo Swirl]

This didn't happen.  Gunit has no evidence that it did.  Everything has always been pukka.  But she will go on saying otherwise in the vain hope that some fools will believe her.  Although God knows why.

The McCanns are innocent and after fifteen years you might think that this is obvious.

Conspiracists don’t do the obvious, the logical or the plausible I’m afraid.

[G-Unit]

Please supply evidence that the police were specifically instructed not to consider any other options but abduction.  Is a remit an order that must not be disobeyed on pain of disciplinary action?  If so please provide evidence of such.

Which police? Every single one who worked on OG or the senior officers who decided how to achieve the investigative aims?

Those aims were set out in OG's remit. I would imagine consequences would follow if other aims were substituted.

[Vertigo Swirl]

Which police? Every single one who worked on OG or the senior officers who decided how to achieve the investigative aims?

Those aims were set out in OG's remit. I would imagine consequences would follow if other aims were substituted.

Which police?  All of those involved in Op Grange of course!  What difference does it make which police?  What imaginary consequences do you think there would have been if one of the team came across evidence that strongly suggested Madeleine was not abducted?   Do tell.

[Vertigo Swirl]

Which police? Every single one who worked on OG or the senior officers who decided how to achieve the investigative aims?

Those aims were set out in OG's remit. I would imagine consequences would follow if other aims were substituted.

What was the main aim of Operation Grange?   To prove she was abducted?  Because that seems to be your opinion.  In my opinion Operation Grange was set up to investigate what happened to Madeleine in the hope of finding her or her remains and bringing those responsible for her disappearance to justice.

[Wonderfulspam]

Have you heard of the celestial teapot argument? 
You make the assertion, you supply the evidence, that's how it works.   You have intimated that the police were constrained by the High Ups from properly investigating the case - now show your evidence.

Well, there's never been any evidence Maddie was abducted, yet that's what Grange are investigating apparently. There must be some reason for them following that particular line of enquiry. Maybe the MET will reveal their own working one day. Or perhaps Wolters will reveal the concrete evidence. Much now shouldn't it longer be.

[G-Unit]

Which police?  All of those involved in Op Grange of course!  What difference does it make which police?  What imaginary consequences do you think there would have been if one of the team came across evidence that strongly suggested Madeleine was not abducted?   Do tell.

You seem sadly uninformed as to how organisations work. I expect the rank and file knew the goals of the investigation and they would be allocated tasks which those in charge wanted carried out. If an individual found something which didn't fit, he or she would raise the matter with his or her superior. It would then cease to be his or her concern. If they pushed for an answer no doubt they would be assured that it had been communicated to those higher up the chain.

[Vertigo Swirl]

You seem sadly uninformed as to how organisations work. I expect the rank and file knew the goals of the investigation and they would be allocated tasks which those in charge wanted carried out. If an individual found something which didn't fit, he or she would raise the matter with his or her superior. It would then cease to be his or her concern. If they pushed for an answer no doubt they would be assured that it had been communicated to those higher up the chain.

. You really have swallowed the Konspiraloon Kool-Aid haven’t you?  Oh dear.  So as I wrote before you seem convinced Op Grange was set up with the sole purpose of proving an abduction.  £13 million to do that because…?

[sadie]

Well, there's never been any evidence Maddie was abducted, yet that's what Grange are investigating apparently. There must be some reason for them following that particular line of enquiry. Maybe the MET will reveal their own working one day. Or perhaps Wolters will reveal the concrete evidence. Much now shouldn't it longer be.

Oh yes there has.   Compelling facts that you are not party to.

[G-Unit]

. You really have swallowed the Konspiraloon Kool-Aid haven’t you?  Oh dear.  So as I wrote before you seem convinced Op Grange was set up with the sole purpose of proving an abduction.  £13 million to do that because…?

I see no conspiracies, that's your mantra. As I said, you seem to have no idea how hierarchical organisations work.

The only crime OG were investigating was abduction so there was no possibility of proving anything else, was there.

[Eleanor]

I see no conspiracies, that's your mantra. As I said, you seem to have no idea how hierarchical organisations work.

The only crime OG were investigating was abduction so there was no possibility of proving anything else, was there.

There was never anything to prove in that direction.  That had all been done and dusted, not least by The PJ.  It is all now only in the minds of the nastier faction of humanity.

It must be really tiring and depressing when failure is inevitable.

[Vertigo Swirl]

I see no conspiracies, that's your mantra. As I said, you seem to have no idea how hierarchical organisations work.

The only crime OG were investigating was abduction so there was no possibility of proving anything else, was there.

If you can't see how what you are proposing suggests a conspiracy to conceal and cover up at the highest level then I really can't help you, but so often I find that conspiracists are beyond help.

[Eleanor]

If you can't see how what you are proposing suggests a conspiracy to conceal and cover up at the highest level then I really can't help you, but so often I find that conspiracists are beyond help.

I can hardly believe that this is still going on after fifteen years.  It's a dead duck that went rancid a very long time ago.  It must be hell to live with the smell.

[G-Unit]

If you can't see how what you are proposing suggests a conspiracy to conceal and cover up at the highest level then I really can't help you, but so often I find that conspiracists are beyond help.

I don't need your help. thank you. If those setting up and running OG believe in the stranger abduction theory then there's no need for a conspiracy.

[Vertigo Swirl]

I don't need your help. thank you. If those setting up and running OG believe in the stranger abduction theory then there's no need for a conspiracy.

There is, if all the evidence points away from the abduction theory, and let's face it that's what you believe isn't it?  That all the evidence in the files suggests that abduction is the least likely theory?  So, you would have to try and rationalise to yourself why the professionals, ie those tasked with interpreting the evidence have come to a view contrary to your own.  Now, you seem to have decided that the McCanns were so amazingly persuasive as to some how convince all those professionals and high-ups who make these decisions that Madeleine was abducted. So persuasive were the McCanns that all these people's collective critical faculties had completely deserted them, making them utterly blind to the evidence staring them in the face.  So if it's not a conspiracy it's this, which let's face it is utterly bonkers. 

[G-Unit]

There is, if all the evidence points away from the abduction theory, and let's face it that's what you believe isn't it?  That all the evidence in the files suggests that abduction is the least likely theory?  So, you would have to try and rationalise to yourself why the professionals, ie those tasked with interpreting the evidence have come to a view contrary to your own.  Now, you seem to have decided that the McCanns were so amazingly persuasive as to some how convince all those professionals and high-ups who make these decisions that Madeleine was abducted. So persuasive were the McCanns that all these people's collective critical faculties had completely deserted them, making them utterly blind to the evidence staring them in the face.  So if it's not a conspiracy it's this, which let's face it is utterly bonkers.

Just a couple of points. The decision makers probably got their information where most people got it; the MSM. I don't suppose anyone examined the PJ files in detail. The MSM were busy telling everyone about poor heartbroken Kate and Gerry and the bumbling, inadequate PJ. The evidence doesn't stare anyone in the face, it takes a lot of work to find the anomolies and uncertainties in the files.