Wandering Off Topic

[Vertigo Swirl]

10pm alarm isn't supported by many witnesses. Most say 'around 10pm' though some say as early as 9.30. PDL is so small that 5 minutes either way could be the difference between Gerry being the man seen by the Smith family or not. Let us not forget that Martin Smith's wife agreed with him although she declined to give a second statement but unless you think that Martin Smith had a reason to lie then his claim should be taken at face value.

So how long does it take to walk from the Tapas to Apartment 5A, pick up a body, walk to the point where the Smiths saw the man, walk beyond that point, find a suitable bin and walk back to the Tapas restaurant?  When in the evening did Gerry inform the others of Madeleine?s death - before he went body occulting or afterwards? How do you think that conversation played out?  How come there is not a single witness claiming Gerry left the table twice that night, not even Dianne Webster?  When did Gerry actually get time to eat his meal (which we know he did)?  Just a few more questions for you to ignore.

[Joe Blogs]

So are we saying that if it was Gerry that the Smiths saw, then Gerry got rid of Maddies body once the alarm was raised ?

[Vertigo Swirl]

So are we saying that if it was Gerry that the Smiths saw, then Gerry got rid of Maddies body once the alarm was raised ?

Joe, you seem to be having some trouble grasping what's being discussed here.  "We" are not saying anything of the sort, there is not a consensus view.  McCann denigrators on here are saying Gerry disposed of the body before the alarm was raised but disagree about what time that happened, and those of us with a bit more in the way of critical thinking are saying that it's highly unlikely, if not downright impossible that Gerry was Smithman at all for the reasons I have already explicitly stated on this thread.  It's worth repeating that those who believe Gerry was Smithman base that belief on one man's claim made four months after the event that the man he saw for a couple of seconds in a darkened street MIGHT have been Gerry McCann.   Bizarrely McCann sceptics are much more certain than Smith was and are apparently 100% convinced that his evidence means Gerry threw Madeleine's body in a bin.  It's a bit mad really.

[Vertigo Swirl]

Here's another question for you all to ponder - if this mythical bin was only a short walk away from the apartment, why was it necessary to take the huge risk of walking through town with a dead body to get to it?  If it's a bin he could reach on foot, how does that shift the blame away from Gerry onto a would be abductor?   Faith believes Gerry deliberately chose a bin as a disposal site believing the body would soon be discovered and that they would be able to eventually give Madeleine a proper burial.  But she also believes Gerry had to put her in a bin a few minutes walk away from the apartment because she was pumped full of drugs the McCanns had given her.  Does any of this make even the remotest sense?  Make it make sense please!!!

[Joe Blogs]

Joe, you seem to be having some trouble grasping what's being discussed here.  "We" are not saying anything of the sort, there is not a consensus view.  McCann denigrators on here are saying Gerry disposed of the body before the alarm was raised but disagree about what time that happened, and those of us with a bit more in the way of critical thinking are saying that it's highly unlikely, if not downright impossible that Gerry was Smithman at all for the reasons I have already explicitly stated on this thread.  It's worth repeating that those who believe Gerry was Smithman base that belief on one man's claim made four months after the event that the man he saw for a couple of seconds in a darkened street MIGHT have been Gerry McCann.   Bizarrely McCann sceptics are much more certain than Smith was and are apparently 100% convinced that his evidence means Gerry threw Madeleine's body in a bin.  It's a bit mad really.

But how could Gerry have disposed of the body earlier if the Smithman sighting was at 10.00, Vertigo?
Is the time of this sighting written in stone?

[Vertigo Swirl]

But how could Gerry have disposed of the body earlier if the Smithman sighting was at 10.00, Vertigo?
Is the time of this sighting writtrn in stone?

Yes the timing is written on a tablet of stone which has been erected at the exact spot in Pdl of the sighting, now a renowned tourist hot spot.
Please don't be asking ME to justify this nonsense, interrogate Faithlilly and Spam about it.  I did not say in my post that you responded to that Gerry disposed of the body earlier than the Smithman sighting, you do seem to be a bit confused by the whole thing.

[Joe Blogs]

Yes the timing is written on a tablet of stone which has been erected at the exact spot in Pdl of the sighting, now a renowned tourist hot spot.
Please don't be asking ME to justify this nonsense, interrogate Faithlilly and Spam about it.  I did not say in my post that you responded to that Gerry disposed of the body earlier than the Smithman sighting, you do seem to be a bit confused by the whole thing.

OK, thanks, Vertigo! I will go through everyone's scenario and give my opinion later!

[Lace]

May I ask what time was the alarm raised, and what time was the Smith sighting?

The Smith's sighting was 10 o'clock.  The alarm was raised around 10 o'clock.  Gerry was in the Tapas Bar when the alarm was raised,  There is no way Gerry was Smithman.  He would not have been able to act normally laughing and joking at dinner.  This is the reaction when they realised Madeleine was missing  -


"...but this was the first time I'd actually really seen or heard Gerry, he was on the phone to, errm... a member of his family, errm... curled up, really, on the floor, just outside the sliding patio door, just sobbing uncontrollably and in between sobs just saying 'They've', you know, 'Someone's taken her' or 'Somebody's blo*dy got her', you know, 'She's gone' and absolutely, errm... you know, you know, for such a strong man to see him on the floor broken, he was... he was incapable of even standing up, he was just lying on the floor and just repeating himself, there was so little he could, you know, there was just nothing else in there."

[Joe Blogs]

The Smith's sighting was 10 o'clock.  The alarm was raised around 10 o'clock.  Gerry was in the Tapas Bar when the alarm was raised,  There is no way Gerry was Smithman.  He would not have been able to act normally laughing and joking at dinner.  This is the reaction when they realised Madeleine was missing  -


"...but this was the first time I'd actually really seen or heard Gerry, he was on the phone to, errm... a member of his family, errm... curled up, really, on the floor, just outside the sliding patio door, just sobbing uncontrollably and in between sobs just saying 'They've', you know, 'Someone's taken her' or 'Somebody's blo*dy got her', you know, 'She's gone' and absolutely, errm... you know, you know, for such a strong man to see him on the floor broken, he was... he was incapable of even standing up, he was just lying on the floor and just repeating himself, there was so little he could, you know, there was just nothing else in there."

Thanks Lace! So you're in the Vertigo, Eleoner camp then!

[Vertigo Swirl]

The Smith's sighting was 10 o'clock.  The alarm was raised around 10 o'clock.  Gerry was in the Tapas Bar when the alarm was raised,  There is no way Gerry was Smithman.  He would not have been able to act normally laughing and joking at dinner.  This is the reaction when they realised Madeleine was missing  -


"...but this was the first time I'd actually really seen or heard Gerry, he was on the phone to, errm... a member of his family, errm... curled up, really, on the floor, just outside the sliding patio door, just sobbing uncontrollably and in between sobs just saying 'They've', you know, 'Someone's taken her' or 'Somebody's blo*dy got her', you know, 'She's gone' and absolutely, errm... you know, you know, for such a strong man to see him on the floor broken, he was... he was incapable of even standing up, he was just lying on the floor and just repeating himself, there was so little he could, you know, there was just nothing else in there."

Of course, Gerry could just be a really great actor as well as a top heart doctor.  I mean this is what we have to believe - that he was able to appear totally relaxed and smiling with Jez Wilkins (having just discovered the body of his dead child lying below the patio), returned to the table to wolf down his hearty steak dinner and quaff a few more bevvies whilst everyone else at the table appeared to be behaving perfectly normal too (obviously he hadn't broken the news to his wife or the rest of the table at that point), then slips off again unnoticed by Dianne Webster (the only member of the group totally not in on the cover up) to sprint back to the apartment, scoop up the dead body and then walk calmly but purposefully through the town with it in his arms, past 9 witnesses, finds a suitable bin that he hope the body will soon be discovered in, and then marches back to the Tapas table when seconds later Kate goes back to the apartment and discovers her daughter missing.  I guess when they all rush over to the apartment except for Dianne it's at that point Gerry tells them all that he's chucked her in a bin and they must all stage an abduction and lie for him unless they all want to go to prison for leaving their kids unattended too.  Then he re-enacts a total breakdown before them as they all watch on bemused.   Yes, highly plausible chain of events I'm sure.

[Lace]

Then admitted they left the children unattended!!  So what was the real reason for the friends to cover it up? Nothing at all.  They just love a conspiracy.

[Lace]

Thanks Lace! So you're in the Vertigo, Eleoner camp then!

I definitely am.  There's absolutely no way the McCann's were guilty of a cover up.

[Vertigo Swirl]

Then admitted they left the children unattended!!  So what was the real reason for the friends to cover it up? Nothing at all.  They just love a conspiracy.

Well you see that?s when the conspiracy theorists have to resort to other shadowy insinuations such as drugs and child sex abuse, despite the fact that there is zero evidence that any of the McCann children were abused or regularly sedated by their parents, or that all their mates were into this sort of stuff too.

[Joe Blogs]

Well you see that?s when the conspiracy theorists have to resort to other shadowy insinuations such as drugs and child sex abuse, despite the fact that there is zero evidence that any of the McCann children were abused or regularly sedated by their parents, or that all their mates were into this sort of stuff too.

So when the alarm was raised at 10.00 Maddie was a mere 500yards away then?
Where did mr & mrs Smith go after seeing Maddie and her abductor? Presumably straight back to their lodgings for the night, else they would have heard about Maddie going missing and reported what they had seen?
Were the Smiths heading back towards the McCanns apartment or going in the opposite direction when they saw Maddie? Where were they staying in relation to the McCanns, was their lodgings near by?
When did the Smiths find out that Maddie had disappeared?

[Vertigo Swirl]

So when the alarm was raised at 10.00 Maddie was a mere 500yards away then?
Where did mr & mrs Smith go after seeing Maddie and her abductor? Presumably straight back to their lodgings for the night, else they would have heard about Maddie going missing and reported what they had seen?
Were the Smiths heading back towards the McCanns apartment or going in the opposite direction when they saw Maddie? Where were they staying in relation to the McCanns, was their lodgings near by?
When did the Smiths find out that Maddie had disappeared?

No, when the alarm was raised no one knows how far away Madeleine was at that point, where are you getting 500 yards from?
The Smiths (there were 9 of them in total) found out a child had gone missing when they got up the next day, thought the child they saw might have been Madeleine but they did not report their sighting until three weeks later, after they had returned to Ireland.  This is negligent behaviour IMO.  Where they were staying I have no idea but they were walking in the direction of the Ocean Club in the opposite direction to Smithman who was walking towards the beach.