Author Topic: Pick any sentence from Kate's book.  (Read 122953 times)

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Offline G-Unit

Re: Pick any sentence from Kate's book.
« Reply #570 on: September 28, 2016, 08:33:08 PM »
So do you think the McCanns never slept at all in the Payne's apartment?

No. They went to 4G first and when Emma Knight left at about 4.30am they went to the Paynes rather than be alone.
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Offline Robittybob1

Re: Pick any sentence from Kate's book.
« Reply #571 on: September 28, 2016, 08:36:52 PM »
No. They went to 4G first and when Emma Knight left at about 4.30am they went to the Paynes rather than be alone.
So they slept at the Payne's that morning of the 4th, even if it was only a couple of hours.
It must be like sleeping in a warzone.  Would a person be able to sleep under the stress?
Page 105 Gerry managed to drift off for less than an hour.  Kate never slept. 
« Last Edit: September 28, 2016, 08:45:32 PM by Robittybob1 »
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Offline John

Re: Pick any sentence from Kate's book.
« Reply #572 on: September 28, 2016, 08:42:10 PM »
So they slept at the Payne's that morning of the 4th, even if it was only a couple of hours.

Correct.  The police required 5a to be vacated in order to take photographs.
A malicious prosecution for a crime which never existed. An exposé of egregious malfeasance by public officials.
Indeed, the truth never changes with the passage of time.

Offline Robittybob1

Re: Pick any sentence from Kate's book.
« Reply #573 on: September 28, 2016, 09:05:33 PM »
Correct.  The police required 5a to be vacated in order to take photographs.
And to preserve what evidence would be left in the crime scene.
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Offline G-Unit

Re: Pick any sentence from Kate's book.
« Reply #574 on: September 28, 2016, 10:19:06 PM »
The police statement doesn't make it clear that they (the police) locked up an empty apartment and left, nor that the McCanns no longer had access to 5a does it?  As for twin juggling, I'm sure that's illegal.    What do you think it all means....? &%+((£

I can think of no reason why Fiona and Kate are giving the impression that the twins went straight to 5H when they left 5A, but they are.

Looking at the statements it's not possible that the twins went straight from 5A to 5H though.

Jane said they were gone at 3am when she was interviewed. That makes sense because they weren't in the photos, taken before 4am when the PJ left.

They were not in 5H because Dianne said no-one left between the twins arriving and Kate and Gerry going out together at dawn.

Kate and Gerry were out separately at 4am, though, they were seen.

It's clear the twins went to 4G and were moved to 5H after Emma left.

Everyone agrees that the PJ cleared everyone out of the apartment before they left. 'Preserved' in this case means preserving the crime scene because some forensic work had to be left until daylight.

He then states that upon leaving the apartment was locked, leaving the space preserved for the GNR elements that were stationed next to the apartment.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/VITOR_MARTINS.htm

4078    ”Yeah. So after the twins had been brought up did Fiona and Dave stay in the apartment with you?”
 Reply    ”Yeah well at that point Kate and Gerry came up as well and err because the Police had decided to close off the apartment, bit late in the day but you know, they came up and what we did we got the, there was mattresses on the spare beds in the room where Lily was sleeping so we got them and put them on the floor in the lounge beside the twins so that they could rest, if not sleep, err but by this time it must have been about half past four, five o’ clock in the morning.”
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/DIANE-WEBSTER-2.htm

PJ had arrived, erm, the plain clothes detectives, I think there was a couple of them and they'd been in the apartment and obviously they, at that point, had said they needed to close off the apartment or move the twins. Erm, so I'd suggested putting the twins up in our apartment, erm, Emma, who was there, had arranged some of the MARK WARNER Nannies to get some extra cots and more bedding, erm, and we set up the cots in our living room and a bed for Kate and Gerry as well, not that they used it, but, erm, and then I think, I think they were Policemen, I can't remember who carried up Sean and Amelie. Erm, and we sat on the sofa, me and Kate with the twins asleep on us for a while, erm, and they didn't wake up and, again, that was quite strange, even in the transfer and, and being handled by people that weren't their parents, they didn't, they didn't wake up. Erm, and we settled them down and made a bed up for Kate and Gerry and I think it was around sort of half four'ish we decided we should all try and just get, get a rest, because everyone else had gone, you know, it was just, again, it was that feeling of helplessness really, everyone had gone, erm, you know, what are we supposed to do'.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/FIONA-PAYNE-ROGATORY.htm

I remember the police asking everyone to leave the apartment. I received a call from John informing me that he had arranged for another apartment for the McCanns. I went to reception and helped Lyndsey to move the two cots to the new apartment

The McCanns went to the new apartment and I remember seeing Kate and Mrs Payne seated on the sofa, each holding one of the twins. I left the new apartment at 04.30 in the morning after instructions from John Hill. I was the last to leave, the police had already left, but I left my number saying that I was available for anything that might be needed.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/EMMA-LOUISE.htm
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Offline sadie

Re: Pick any sentence from Kate's book.
« Reply #575 on: September 28, 2016, 11:01:00 PM »
By writing things in a certain order in her book Kate suggests to the reader they happened in that order, but they didn't. The twins weren't in the photos of 5A, so they had gone before the PJ left, although the impression is given that they were still there.

The PJ locked the apartment and left the GNR guarding it, so no-one was left in there. Emma Knight's evidence makes no mention of cots being placed in 5H.

It is possible, however that the twins were moved twice. Once to the new apartment, perhaps with Fiona staying with them, and then to 5H later after Emma left.

This fits with Jane Tanners evidence that Kate and the twins were gone from 5A at 3am when she spoke to the PJ, with Emma's that they went to the new apartment. and with Dianne's, that they arrived in 5H quite a while after they left 5A. It also explains why Gerry and Kate carried them out of 5A, but David and Fiona carried them into 5H, according to Dianne.

Eventually, at about 3am, I managed to get hold of Michelle’s partner, Jon Corner, on his mobile. ‘No one’s
listening!’ I wept. ‘Nothing’s happening!’ The next thing I knew, the PJ officers were heading for the front door.......And with that they were gone, leaving us to our own devices....We probably could have stayed in our apartment, but who would have wanted to? Looking back, it’s inexplicable, of course, that we should ever have
been left in what was now a crime scene....Mark Warner had prepared another flat for us on the first floor of an
adjacent block, but Gerry and I were in no condition to be on our own. We couldn’t look after ourselves,
let alone the twins. So the staff put up two extra cots in Fiona and David’s apartment and we carried a sleepy Sean and Amelie into their sitting room.
[Madeleine]

A request was made to the OC services director for the family to be re-allocated and accordingly the babies were taken out of the room, so that the site could be searched.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/VITOR_MARTINS.htm

At a certain time, after the arrival of the PJ elements, the parents removed the twins from the beds in which they were still sleeping and took them to the first floor flat. At the request of Kate she (the witness) to remove their puppets drink and a blanket that she took to the first floor flat. Only the mattresses remained.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/SILVIA_BATISTA.htm

I received a call from John informing me that he had arranged for another apartment for the McCanns. I went to reception and helped Lyndsey to move the two cots to the new apartment

The McCanns went to the new apartment and I remember seeing Kate and Mrs Payne seated on the sofa, each holding one of the twins. I left the new apartment at 04.30 in the morning after instructions from John Hill. I was the last to leave, the police had already left, but I left my number saying that I was available for anything that might be needed.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/EMMA-LOUISE.htm

I think Russell came with me and there was Sylvie who was the translator.  I can’t remember which, there was some, there was a PJ chap was sitting on the, by the table.  And there was Gerry who was standing by the, the bedroom door”.....“That was at three o’clock in the morning after she’d disappeared, yeah”
4078    “And where was Kate?”
 I don’t know at that point, she wasn’t, she wasn’t in the, she wasn’t there.  I don’t know whether, I think they had taken the twins out of the room by that stage, so I don’t know whether she was up in Dave and Fi’s room”.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/JANE_TANNER_RIGATORY.htm

”Yeah. So after the twins had been brought up did Fiona and Dave stay in the apartment with you?”
 Reply    ”Yeah well at that point Kate and Gerry came up as well and err because the Police had decided to close off the apartment, bit late in the day but you know, they came up and what we did we got the, there was mattresses on the spare beds in the room where Lily was sleeping so we got them and put them on the floor in the lounge beside the twins so that they could rest, if not sleep, err but by this time it must have been about half past four, five o’ clock in the morning.”
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/DIANE-WEBSTER-2.htm

He then states that upon leaving the apartment was locked, leaving the space preserved for the GNR elements that were stationed next to the apartment.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/VITOR_MARTINS.htm


QUOTE:
At a certain time, after the arrival of the PJ elements, the parents removed the twins from the beds in which they were still sleeping and took them to the first floor flat. At the request of Kate she (the witness) to remove their puppets drink and a blanket that she took to the first floor flat. Only the mattresses remained.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/SILVIA_BATISTA.htm 
END QUOTE

Would this be Madeleines pink blanket?


PS If this has been noticed before, please delete this post

Offline G-Unit

Re: Pick any sentence from Kate's book.
« Reply #576 on: September 28, 2016, 11:28:44 PM »

QUOTE:
At a certain time, after the arrival of the PJ elements, the parents removed the twins from the beds in which they were still sleeping and took them to the first floor flat. At the request of Kate she (the witness) to remove their puppets drink and a blanket that she took to the first floor flat. Only the mattresses remained.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/SILVIA_BATISTA.htm 
END QUOTE

Would this be Madeleines pink blanket?


PS If this has been noticed before, please delete this post

A good idea, Sadie but Madeleine's blanket was on her bed in the PJ photos which were taken after the twins were removed.
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Offline G-Unit

Re: Pick any sentence from Kate's book.
« Reply #577 on: September 29, 2016, 09:57:24 PM »
DCS Bob Small;

As our main liaison with the British police, Bob was not privy to the investigation details. This was for our protection, he told us, as sharing knowledge we would otherwise not have had could potentially compromise us. [Madeleine]

After the dog searches, however;

It did emerge, however, that Bob had concerns of his own. He explained that the British police regarded the use of sniffer dogs as intelligence rather than evidence, and he was perplexed at the apparent fixation of the PJ on the idea that Madeleine had died in the apartment. He told Gerry he thought they’d get a shock when the forensic
results came back. [Madeleine]

I wonder why he thought that? As he had no knowledge of the details of the investigation how could he offer an opinion on the forensic results?

It was Bob Small who notified the PJ that the McCanns had decided to leave Portugal. Upon which;

We’d waited almost four weeks for these interviews and it was obvious they had been hastily arranged once Bob Small notified the PJ that we would be leaving the country. Otherwise, why now? As far as we knew, they didn’t have the forensic results back yet. [Madeleine]

Were the McCanns expecting to be told when the forensic results came back? By whom?

After they were informed they were going to be interviewed in September;

Gerry rang DCS Bob Small, who was astounded by this latest development. He promised to make some phone calls. Bob was finally able to get hold of Luís Neves, who was reportedly out of the country. Luís claimed not to know anything about it. [Madeleine]

I wonder why Bob Small was astounded? As he wasn't privy to the investigation details he had no idea what was happening, so no reason to be astounded, surely?

After their first interviews and their conversation with their lawyer Gerry;

rang Bob Small and, in a voice laced with panic, explained what was going on. Bob was shocked. He wasn’t aware of any forensic results, he told us, and certainly none suggesting what had just been shared with us. He tried his best to reassure Gerry. ‘Just tell them the truth. It’ll be OK,’ he insisted. Perhaps he was trying to convince himself.
[Madeleine]

Once again Bob Small is suggesting that he is privy to investigation details; in particular the forensic results from the FSS. Not only that, he is sharing what he knows with people who are suspected by another police force. No wonder Kate believed the British police were on their side.
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Offline sadie

Re: Pick any sentence from Kate's book.
« Reply #578 on: September 30, 2016, 12:37:10 AM »
A good idea, Sadie but Madeleine's blanket was on her bed in the PJ photos which were taken after the twins were removed.

Cheers Gunit  8((()*/

Offline Robittybob1

Re: Pick any sentence from Kate's book.
« Reply #579 on: September 30, 2016, 12:40:29 AM »
Cheers Gunit  8((()*/
The blankets would have been the ones around the children as they slept in their cots.
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Offline Brietta

Re: Pick any sentence from Kate's book.
« Reply #580 on: September 30, 2016, 09:53:10 PM »
The blankets would have been the ones around the children as they slept in their cots.

The logical course of action would have been to lift the children wrapped in their own bedding.
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

Offline mercury

Re: Pick any sentence from Kate's book.
« Reply #581 on: October 01, 2016, 09:26:54 PM »
chose a sentence to show the truth wasnt told?

Ok

Kate wrote she had no worries about a child dropping off the balcony like her frind the oaynes might had had. cos they were on the ground floor

.....true? Half true? False? You chose alfie

Offline Mr Gray

Re: Pick any sentence from Kate's book.
« Reply #582 on: October 01, 2016, 09:41:22 PM »
chose a sentence to show the truth wasnt told?

Ok

Kate wrote she had no worries about a child dropping off the balcony like her frind the oaynes might had had. cos they were on the ground floor

.....true? Half true? False? You chose alfie

a precise quote in context would enable an informed opimion.....your paraphrasing doesnt

Offline mercury

Re: Pick any sentence from Kate's book.
« Reply #583 on: October 01, 2016, 09:45:29 PM »
a precise quote in context would enable an informed opimion.....your paraphrasing doesnt

How big a context do you need?

Offline G-Unit

Re: Pick any sentence from Kate's book.
« Reply #584 on: October 01, 2016, 09:50:08 PM »
chose a sentence to show the truth wasnt told?

Ok

Kate wrote she had no worries about a child dropping off the balcony like her frind the oaynes might had had. cos they were on the ground floor

.....true? Half true? False? You chose alfie

That was a strange statement;

Though I envied David and Fiona their sea view, being on the ground floor meant we didn’t have to worry about the children’s safety on a balcony. [Madeleine]

Had she noticed the drop? The steps? Clearly not, or she wouldn't have left the children unattended with the patio doors unlocked. Did they play out there unsupervised that week being as there was nothing to worry about? I can honestly say I get the impression she knew nothing about guarding small children. Hand on heart, I don't get it.
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