Author Topic: Can we take the file records at face value?  (Read 20191 times)

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Offline sadie

Re: Can we take the file records at face value?
« Reply #45 on: October 26, 2016, 12:06:40 AM »
Now another little strange thing about Processos 807-808


http://mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/SERVICE_INFORMATION.htm#p3p807to808

03- Processos Vol III pages 807 to 808

The taxi driver in question was contacted by another taxi driver, an older man already retired who had been looking for him from the date of the service until the 09th when he managed to contact him, reminding him about a service trip that he made on 04-05-2007 at about 12.40 in which an individual carrying a blonde girl asked him to take them to Rua Andrade Castro no. 79, Santa Marinha, Vila Nova da Gaia.


The address has changed from Rua Andre de Castro to Rua Andrade Castro.  I have print outs of the original Processos 807-808 saying Rua Andre de Castro.   
I have print outs in Portuguese from the original files and in English

Try googling Rua Andrade Castro, Nova Vila de Gaia, if you dont believe me. NO such place.

Why has it changed?  To confuse the investigator? or what?  Any ideas SIL ?

There are several other strange things about Processos 807-808, yet to come

Offline misty

Re: Can we take the file records at face value?
« Reply #46 on: October 26, 2016, 12:37:58 AM »
Actually misty I think you have the wrong side of the alleyway.   The odd numbers are on the north side, not the south side of the alleyway .. and we are looking for number 79

Have you checked what was being built there in 2007 ?   And what other buildings there are on the same piece of land?  Could any of them be of interest in a missing child case [possibly involving paedophilia?]

I will give you a clue, the Pope visited after the building was completed.

The big white building was there in 2005. I'm looking at the block of flats behind the houses at the junction as there are around 100 street numbers unaccounted for. Google Earth seems to indicate that they are part of Rua de Andre de Castro.

Offline sadie

Re: Can we take the file records at face value?
« Reply #47 on: October 26, 2016, 01:15:17 AM »
The big white building was there in 2005. I'm looking at the block of flats behind the houses at the junction as there are around 100 street numbers unaccounted for. Google Earth seems to indicate that they are part of Rua de Andre de Castro.
Yep, the western end of Rua Andre de Costa is a blind alleyway.  By blind I mean that from neither end can you see the middle bit because it has high walls and a curve.  It is fairly narrow and quite rough to walk along.  Too narrow for a Taxi

From wall shadows I think the middle bit of the northern wall was broken down in places... probably the entrances to the houses that used to be there at one time, well before the building work began.

If you look at 2006 you will see the structure being built and recent dates show the finished building in its entirety.  A very beautiful modern building.

1)  What is it? 
2)  What is the long grey topped building on the eastern side of Rua Tenente Valadim
(Spelling?) but to the west of the large white building being built?
3)  ...and what is the red roofed building to the north of the large plot ?


Any ideas?   Google Earth street scene will help.

Offline mercury

Re: Can we take the file records at face value?
« Reply #48 on: October 26, 2016, 02:14:37 AM »
There are several other strange things about Processos 807-808, yet to come

Cant wait

Offline ShiningInLuz

Re: Can we take the file records at face value?
« Reply #49 on: October 26, 2016, 05:58:47 AM »
Now another little strange thing about Processos 807-808


http://mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/SERVICE_INFORMATION.htm#p3p807to808

03- Processos Vol III pages 807 to 808

The taxi driver in question was contacted by another taxi driver, an older man already retired who had been looking for him from the date of the service until the 09th when he managed to contact him, reminding him about a service trip that he made on 04-05-2007 at about 12.40 in which an individual carrying a blonde girl asked him to take them to Rua Andrade Castro no. 79, Santa Marinha, Vila Nova da Gaia.


The address has changed from Rua Andre de Castro to Rua Andrade Castro.  I have print outs of the original Processos 807-808 saying Rua Andre de Castro.   
I have print outs in Portuguese from the original files and in English

Try googling Rua Andrade Castro, Nova Vila de Gaia, if you dont believe me. NO such place.

Why has it changed?  To confuse the investigator? or what?  Any ideas SIL ?
Are you seriously offering this as proof of something significant?

Follow your own link.  The English translation, by Ines, says Rua Andrade Castro.  Whilst the Portimão police put Rua André de Castro.

It is a minor error in translation, made by Ines.  There is nothing of significance in this.
« Last Edit: October 26, 2016, 06:05:56 AM by ShiningInLuz »
What's up, old man?

Offline ShiningInLuz

Re: Can we take the file records at face value?
« Reply #50 on: October 26, 2016, 08:07:54 AM »
Yep, the western end of Rua Andre de Costa is a blind alleyway.  By blind I mean that from neither end can you see the middle bit because it has high walls and a curve.  It is fairly narrow and quite rough to walk along.  Too narrow for a Taxi

From wall shadows I think the middle bit of the northern wall was broken down in places... probably the entrances to the houses that used to be there at one time, well before the building work began.

If you look at 2006 you will see the structure being built and recent dates show the finished building in its entirety.  A very beautiful modern building.

1)  What is it? 
2)  What is the long grey topped building on the eastern side of Rua Tenente Valadim
(Spelling?) but to the west of the large white building being built?
3)  ...and what is the red roofed building to the north of the large plot ?


Any ideas?   Google Earth street scene will help.
You appear to be referring to Paróquia do Senhor da Vera Cruz, which is located at Rua Tenente Valadim 99.  Both the current entrance and the entrance used to build the church are on Tenente Valadim.

So far, all that has been achieved is that Google Earth and Google Streetview cannot be used to reliably locate Rua André da Costa 79.

Since both the Porto PJ and the Portimão PJ put it as Rua André da Costa 79, and the VNdG taxi driver should know what he is talking about, it looks like a glitch in Google to me.
What's up, old man?

Offline slartibartfast

Re: Can we take the file records at face value?
« Reply #51 on: October 26, 2016, 08:10:57 AM »
Are you seriously offering this as proof of something significant?

Follow your own link.  The English translation, by Ines, says Rua Andrade Castro.  Whilst the Portimão police put Rua André de Castro.

It is a minor error in translation, made by Ines.  There is nothing of significance in this.

I agree.
“Reasoning will never make a Man correct an ill Opinion, which by Reasoning he never acquired”.

Offline ShiningInLuz

Re: Can we take the file records at face value?
« Reply #52 on: October 26, 2016, 09:02:22 AM »
There is NO journey described in Processos 809, the original processos.

In Processos 807-808 which has a number of mistakes in it (disinformation?).  It says:


http://mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/SERVICE_INFORMATION.htm#p3p807to808

03- Processos Vol III pages 807 to 808

The taxi driver in question was contacted by another taxi driver, an older man already retired who had been looking for him from the date of the service until the 09th when he managed to contact him, reminding him about a service trip that he made on 04-05-2007 at about 12.40 in which an individual carrying a blonde girl asked him to take them to Rua Andrade Castro no. 79, Santa Marinha, Vila Nova da Gaia.


No journey described there either SIL



No description there proving that was the route taken !
   How come you thought there was in that post ?



I see no description in either Processos that confirmed that the man was picked up at VNG railway station.

And I see no evidence that he picked the passengers up at VNdG and drove them the short distance to a drop off within VNdG ... apart from the spiel in Processos 807-808, written in Portimao police station.

Cant think why you are pushing this SIL

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

ETA:  You also say,

Reply #24 on: October 23, 2016, 06:25:06 AM »
There is NO taxi drivers description of the train station that I can find.  Cite please
The line of the Portimão report immediately under the chunk you posted is "The trip he made was approximately 1.5 km and would have taken about 5 minutes."

That is a description of the journey.  It is not describing anything other than the journey.  It is simple.  It is clear.

It is consistent with VNdG.  It is not consistent with Campanhã, which would involve a longer distance and a longer journey time.

And I did not mean the taxi driver gave a description of the station.  I meant the taxi driver gave a description of the journey, a description that fits VNdG but does not fit Campanhã.

What I am not getting is why you are insisting on ruling out VNdG in favour of Campañhã?  You appear to be alleging that a Portimão PJ Inspector wilfully manipulated the taxi driver's evidence, which is a serious allegation.  You have not provided any evidence he did, nor his motivation in doing so.

And you haven't provided any reason to support why the man would stay on the train at VNdG, then continue for a further 5 minutes or so, only to need a longer and costlier taxi ride from Campanhã to Rua André de Castro.
What's up, old man?

Offline sadie

Re: Can we take the file records at face value?
« Reply #53 on: October 26, 2016, 11:47:32 PM »
You appear to be referring to Paróquia do Senhor da Vera Cruz, which is located at Rua Tenente Valadim 99.  Both the current entrance and the entrance used to build the church are on Tenente Valadim.

So far, all that has been achieved is that Google Earth and Google Streetview cannot be used to reliably locate Rua André da Costa 79.

Since both the Porto PJ and the Portimão PJ put it as Rua André da Costa 79, and the VNdG taxi driver should know what he is talking about, it looks like a glitch in Google to me.
No, it wasn't a glitch SIL.

Please dont forget that I have HARD COPIES of 807-808 taken several years ago, both the original in Portuguese and the English translation

In both it says that the taxi went to 79 Rua Andre de Costa.  No mention of Rua Andade Cost (until after I raised the subject a couple of times on forums)

WHY has it been changed ?  Changed to a road that DOES NOT exist ... There has to be a reason.

Furthermore WHO added a ? (question mark) to the number 79 on another copy I have ?


There has to be a reason.  Someone is covering something up IMO

Changing the address to a non existent one  can only be designed to put the searcher / investigator off the scent.

Offline sadie

Re: Can we take the file records at face value?
« Reply #54 on: October 27, 2016, 01:13:03 AM »
You appear to be referring to Paróquia do Senhor da Vera Cruz, which is located at Rua Tenente Valadim 99.  Both the current entrance and the entrance used to build the church are on Tenente Valadim.

So far, all that has been achieved is that Google Earth and Google Streetview cannot be used to reliably locate Rua André da Costa 79.

Since both the Porto PJ and the Portimão PJ put it as Rua André da Costa 79, and the VNdG taxi driver should know what he is talking about, it looks like a glitch in Google to me.
It was not known as that until recently.  Why has it been changed ?

As the GE image is no longer recognisable as to the place it was in 2010, I can no longer ask you to research everything.

A great job of blanking out and altering the image has taken place on GE street scene.

The huge Creche on the same plot of land (which previously, prior to demolition, included number 79) is no longer shown on Google Earth Street scene.  This fine creche proudly announced itself to the world as "Colegio Creche Nossa Senhora da Bonanca" and it stretched 77 metres on the Rua Tenente de Valadin side of the plot of land.

The massive colourful advertisement painted on the end of the building is gone

Everything that was pristine sparkling white is now filthy .... in 6 years in a non industrial town, with clean winds that have come all the way across the atlantic?  The brand new R.C. Church that I knew of as "Igreja Paroquial do Candal" was like icing sugar, it was so white.  Now it is filthy.  This church was built right where number 79 used to be before it was knocked down imo ... using logic.

Also on the same piece of land, but at its northern end is a RC school.

So if the man carrying the little sleeping girl was "going to number 79" it appears he was going to a part built church, a school or a creche ... and going there along a blind alleyway thru which vehicles could not pass.  So hidden in "plain sight"


We are all very aware that relative to the general population, a disproportionate number of priests, teachers and creche workers are paedos.

I always look carefully at RC Churches (it seems that RC are worse than most, maybe because of the RC policy of moving priests on,( sometimes promoting them out of trouble ), if they have sinned ... and reportedly they sin again.  I also look at creches, childrens homes, boarding schools and establishments for the profundly deaf and dumb and for abandoned children etc.

Let me make it clear, most of these are fine places and I herald them for the work they do ... but a significant number have historically been proven to be dens of abuse and paedophilia.


Now that all these changes have happened, along with the peculiar illegal changes to 807-808, will it help convince SY and the Porto PJ that something odd was going on here ?.

Well done to the guys who made these changes ... they've dropped themselves in it again !


SY got the old images, not the fake images.

[Edited to clarify]


 @)(++(*

Offline slartibartfast

Re: Can we take the file records at face value?
« Reply #55 on: October 27, 2016, 08:04:45 AM »
No, it wasn't a glitch SIL.

Please dont forget that I have HARD COPIES of 807-808 taken several years ago, both the original in Portuguese and the English translation

In both it says that the taxi went to 79 Rua Andre de Costa.  No mention of Rua Andade Cost (until after I raised the subject a couple of times on forums)

WHY has it been changed ?  Changed to a road that DOES NOT exist ... There has to be a reason.

Furthermore WHO added a ? (question mark) to the number 79 on another copy I have ?


There has to be a reason.  Someone is covering something up IMO

Changing the address to a non existent one  can only be designed to put the searcher / investigator off the scent.

Whose translation did you send?
“Reasoning will never make a Man correct an ill Opinion, which by Reasoning he never acquired”.

Offline ShiningInLuz

Re: Can we take the file records at face value?
« Reply #56 on: October 28, 2016, 07:21:53 AM »
No, it wasn't a glitch SIL.

Please dont forget that I have HARD COPIES of 807-808 taken several years ago, both the original in Portuguese and the English translation

In both it says that the taxi went to 79 Rua Andre de Costa.  No mention of Rua Andade Cost (until after I raised the subject a couple of times on forums)

WHY has it been changed ?  Changed to a road that DOES NOT exist ... There has to be a reason.

Furthermore WHO added a ? (question mark) to the number 79 on another copy I have ?


There has to be a reason.  Someone is covering something up IMO

Changing the address to a non existent one  can only be designed to put the searcher / investigator off the scent.
Sadie, do yourself a favour and READ THE LINK YOU HAVE PROVIDED.  Pamalam has the originals in Portuguese.  The two statements in Portuguese BOTH read Rua André da Costa, as EVERYONE can see, so there is no issue with them.

The English translation by Ines reads Rua Andrade Costa.  That is a simple mistranslation.

There are several simple mistranslations in the files.  That's all they are.  Minor errors that in subsequent years get blown out of proportion as people get picky about the fact the English versions do not match the Portuguese versions 100%.

A simple mistranslation does not equal a conspiracy, especially as Pamalam has put the Portuguese originals up so they can be checked.
What's up, old man?

Offline slartibartfast

Re: Can we take the file records at face value?
« Reply #57 on: October 28, 2016, 08:22:06 AM »
Sadie, do yourself a favour and READ THE LINK YOU HAVE PROVIDED.  Pamalam has the originals in Portuguese.  The two statements in Portuguese BOTH read Rua André da Costa, as EVERYONE can see, so there is no issue with them.

The English translation by Ines reads Rua Andrade Costa.  That is a simple mistranslation.

There are several simple mistranslations in the files.  That's all they are.  Minor errors that in subsequent years get blown out of proportion as people get picky about the fact the English versions do not match the Portuguese versions 100%.

A simple mistranslation does not equal a conspiracy, especially as Pamalam has put the Portuguese originals up so they can be checked.

It's the selective reliance on or rejection of statement errors/mistranslations that is hypocritical.
“Reasoning will never make a Man correct an ill Opinion, which by Reasoning he never acquired”.

Offline sadie

Re: Can we take the file records at face value?
« Reply #58 on: October 28, 2016, 10:20:43 PM »
Sadie, do yourself a favour and READ THE LINK YOU HAVE PROVIDED.  Pamalam has the originals in Portuguese.  The two statements in Portuguese BOTH read Rua André da Costa, as EVERYONE can see, so there is no issue with them.

The English translation by Ines reads Rua Andrade Costa.  That is a simple mistranslation.

There are several simple mistranslations in the files.  That's all they are.  Minor errors that in subsequent years get blown out of proportion as people get picky about the fact the English versions do not match the Portuguese versions 100%.

A simple mistranslation does not equal a conspiracy, especially as Pamalam has put the Portuguese originals up so they can be checked.

I agree the Portuguese original says Rua Andre de Costa. 

When Ines first translated 807-808 she got the name of the drop off road correct.  I have an early copy by Ines that does NOT say Rua Andrade Costa.  It correctly says Rua Andre de Costa and that agrees with the Portuguese original.

Who has changed it to a road that doesn't exist called Rua Andrade Casta?   And why?



To prevent people going there and looking?

Obviously something(s) very interesting there regarding the abduction of Madeleine

Offline ShiningInLuz

Re: Can we take the file records at face value?
« Reply #59 on: October 28, 2016, 11:42:57 PM »
I agree the Portuguese original says Rua Andre de Costa. 

When Ines first translated 807-808 she got the name of the drop off road correct.  I have an early copy by Ines that does NOT say Rua Andrade Costa.  It correctly says Rua Andre de Costa and that agrees with the Portuguese original.

Who has changed it to a road that doesn't exist called Rua Andrade Casta?   And why?

To prevent people going there and looking?

Obviously something(s) very interesting there regarding the abduction of Madeleine
Then kindly post this early correct translation by Ines and we're done.  Somebody is fiddling with the records.

Or don't post this early translation by Ines and we are done.  Nobody is fiddling with the records.

Over to you.
What's up, old man?