Author Topic: How accurate would be Martin Smith's ID of Gerry MaCann?  (Read 30974 times)

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Offline sadie

Re: How accurate would be Martin Smith's ID of Gerry MaCann?
« Reply #105 on: March 02, 2018, 07:06:05 PM »
MS must have been pretty certain that it was Gerry to go against his children IF they all thought it wasn’t him ( which I don’t believe they did ).

Martin had just seen Gerry on TV (probably several times), and he had heard that he had been made Arguido. 

Carana, or maybe Rob, pointed out that having seen Gerry on TV  and just learned that he had been made arguido, would very likely influence his memory perception of what Smithman looked like.   The lighting was so bad that he didn't see Smithman very well anyway.


Offline Carana

Re: How accurate would be Martin Smith's ID of Gerry MaCann?
« Reply #106 on: March 02, 2018, 07:54:23 PM »
MS must have been pretty certain that it was Gerry to go against his children IF they all thought it wasn’t him ( which I don’t believe they did ).

Dunno. People react differently. If he felt it was important, particularly as it may have been some kind of flashback of seeing this guy carrying a child, who might after all have been her, he may have felt it deeply enough to report it whatever anyone else thought.

It's then up to the police, I would think, to work out what exactly could have triggered that memory, and where on the scale whatever that aspect or detail that triggered that sudden reaction was should be considered in terms of relevance in the light of circumstances, and in the light of any contradictory or non-confirming information.

It was a potentially interesting lead, but Rebelo had the presence of mind to ask for clarification...

Offline Mr Gray

Re: How accurate would be Martin Smith's ID of Gerry MaCann?
« Reply #107 on: March 02, 2018, 08:34:40 PM »
MS must have been pretty certain that it was Gerry to go against his children IF they all thought it wasn’t him ( which I don’t believe they did ).
Doesn't matter how sure he was according to the statements by both sets of investigators he was mistaken... Strange how you dismiss the ID evidence of the many people who have seen Maddie but you seem to think the one suspected... But not sure sighting of Gerry is somehow significant

Offline Robittybob1

Re: How accurate would be Martin Smith's ID of Gerry MaCann?
« Reply #108 on: March 02, 2018, 08:40:12 PM »
I think you're letting your imagination run away with you. Also, e-fits aren't 'drawn' by anyone. As two people took part and only one thought he saw Gerry McCann then your proposal about 'those they suspect' can't be true.
You missed the point, and I think I can explain it better now.  Crimestoppers allows a person to give an anonymous statement.  How can you give an anonymous e-fit?  Smiths - maybe not a hoax but struggled to give an anonymous e-fit.  It can't be Gerry for Gerry has an alibi.  So who is it.  And if it was given in an anonymous context how do they feel now that it is blown out in the open on Crimewatch?

What I'm thinking, like the purposes of Crimestoppers allowing anonymous statements, that if a person can finger the perpetrator the perpetrator could figure out who dobbed him in.  I'm thinking  the Smiths might actually know who was carrying the child, but if they admit to that that person also knows the Smiths. The whole family becomes a threat for there were 9 of them.  So it is serious business making an identification in public.
« Last Edit: March 02, 2018, 08:51:30 PM by Robittybob1 »
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Offline Carana

Re: How accurate would be Martin Smith's ID of Gerry MaCann?
« Reply #109 on: March 02, 2018, 08:45:38 PM »
You missed the point, and I think I can explain it better now.  Crimestoppers allows a person to give an anonymous statement.  How can you give an anonymous e-fit?  Smiths - maybe not a hoax but struggled to give an anonymous e-fit.  It can't be Gerry for Gerry has an alibi.  So who is it.  And if it was given in an anonymous context how does he feel now that it is blown out in the open on Crimewatch?

Not following, Rob, beyond:

Crimestoppers allows a person to give an anonymous statement.


Offline G-Unit

Re: How accurate would be Martin Smith's ID of Gerry MaCann?
« Reply #110 on: March 02, 2018, 09:07:10 PM »
Not following, Rob, beyond:

Crimestoppers allows a person to give an anonymous statement.

I love the idea of giving Crimestoppers an anonymous e-fit. @)(++(*
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Offline Robittybob1

Re: How accurate would be Martin Smith's ID of Gerry MaCann?
« Reply #111 on: March 02, 2018, 09:09:50 PM »
Not following, Rob, beyond:

Crimestoppers allows a person to give an anonymous statement.
I think you nearly got it too "Aoife:
— It was the first time she saw that man. She does not remember seeing him at any time in any location. "  So she must have seen his face to be sure she had never seen him before.  So why was she not the one to compose the e-fit?  Could that be forbidden by the family for family safety reasons?

I'm struggling to say it properly. 

But if the Smiths are in fear of the people involved are they going to let Aoife to compose an e-fit?  No IMO no.  So the family helps out with composing an e-fit, but the ones who take the risk are the ones who didn't get a good look.  So how do they do that?   IMO it is from memories of the person they know.
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Offline Robittybob1

Re: How accurate would be Martin Smith's ID of Gerry MaCann?
« Reply #112 on: March 02, 2018, 09:19:54 PM »
How many others saw Smithman?  I think that could be "no one other than the family of Smiths".
If the Smithman finds that the police are closing in on him - he might have already warned the Smiths they are in trouble no matter who dobs him in.

That is an experience I had myself.  I knew these people were drug dealers, and they knew I didn't like them.  They send me a warning if they get caught I would be punished.  They got caught, not because of anything I did, but they came after me all the same.
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Offline Alice Purjorick

Re: How accurate would be Martin Smith's ID of Gerry MaCann?
« Reply #113 on: March 02, 2018, 09:24:26 PM »
I think you nearly got it too "Aoife:
— It was the first time she saw that man. She does not remember seeing him at any time in any location. "  So she must have seen his face to be sure she had never seen him before.  So why was she not the one to compose the e-fit?  Could that be forbidden by the family for family safety reasons?

I'm struggling to say it properly. 

But if the Smiths are in fear of the people involved are they going to let Aoife to compose an e-fit?  No IMO no.  So the family helps out with composing an e-fit, but the ones who take the risk are the ones who didn't get a good look.  So how do they do that?   IMO it is from memories of the person they know.

So which agency do you suppose held still for that contravention of police procedures?
"Navigating the difference between weird but normal grief and truly suspicious behaviour is the key for any detective worth his salt.". ….Sarah Bailey

Offline Robittybob1

Re: How accurate would be Martin Smith's ID of Gerry MaCann?
« Reply #114 on: March 02, 2018, 09:29:14 PM »
So which agency do you suppose held still for that contravention of police procedures?
I thought it was well known that these were made by PIs.  I lose track as to who it was, but was it Oakley International?
They shared the e-fits with the police forces but then after that everyone held on to them for the next 5 years.
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Offline sadie

Re: How accurate would be Martin Smith's ID of Gerry MaCann?
« Reply #115 on: March 03, 2018, 12:50:18 AM »
I think you nearly got it too "Aoife:
— It was the first time she saw that man. She does not remember seeing him at any time in any location. "  So she must have seen his face to be sure she had never seen him before.  So why was she not the one to compose the e-fit?  Could that be forbidden by the family for family safety reasons?

I'm struggling to say it properly. 

But if the Smiths are in fear of the people involved are they going to let Aoife to compose an e-fit?  No IMO no.  So the family helps out with composing an e-fit, but the ones who take the risk are the ones who didn't get a good look.  So how do they do that?   IMO it is from memories of the person they know.
Interesting thought Rob.

Sorry that you had the drug dealers come after you.  I am expectingt the same to happen to me, if I am correct with my big theory, but The Police have some names, so hopefully that will prevent it

Offline Robittybob1

Re: How accurate would be Martin Smith's ID of Gerry MaCann?
« Reply #116 on: March 03, 2018, 04:37:56 AM »
Interesting thought Rob.

Sorry that you had the drug dealers come after you.  I am expectingt the same to happen to me, if I am correct with my big theory, but The Police have some names, so hopefully that will prevent it
It was war as far as I was concerned.  I was lucky not murder some of them.
One of them drove alongside my vehicle on a motorbike, and it looked like he had a sawn-off shotgun tucked under his long coat, so a swerved toward him  making him dodge me.
« Last Edit: March 03, 2018, 05:00:05 AM by Robittybob1 »
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Offline sadie

Re: How accurate would be Martin Smith's ID of Gerry MaCann?
« Reply #117 on: March 03, 2018, 06:35:15 AM »
It was war as far as I was concerned.  I was lucky not murder some of them.
One of them drove alongside my vehicle on a motorbike, and it looked like he had a sawn-off shotgun tucked under his long coat, so a swerved toward him  making him dodge me.
Aw, that must have been terrifying,

In 2010, driving north on the M5 we were shot at from a passing car.  We were about a mile or so short of the Bromsgrove junction.

It was darkish dusk, the motorway was extremely quiet and this strange car raced past us, swerving sharply in front of us.   I noticed something odd that appeared to be sticking out of the nearside window.  It could have been a hand with a gun or it could have been an oversized mirror, like lorries and car pulling wide caravans have.  initially I thought it might be a big mirror but too dark to tell at that distance and with brake lights on as he slowed down and straightened up.

Suddenly we knew that we had been hit and knew that it wasn't a stone,  Maybe there was a flash as the gun discharged but I cant remember now.  But we knew that we had been shot at.  I immediately scanned the motorway banks, but there was nowhere to hide,  The bullet came from the car.  The car zoomed off again.

The car was painted a very odd brown paper colour: had the colour been made by mixing oddments of left over car paint, I wonder ?  It had a masive home made boot fitted too.  This was easily big enough to hold a man with gun

The black bullet hit the bumper just above the front nearside wheel.  From its position it seems that it was aimed at the tyre.  its purpose, it seems, was to turn us over as the tyre burst at 70mph.  Probably hopefully to kill us.

It has not escaped me, that in their rush to get traffic moving again, a little black piece of distorted black bullet would not be noticed amongst the shredded black front tyre.

Tis a dangerous thing to cross these criminals.  Take care Rob


The Police came out to examine the bullet entrance hole and confirmed that it was bullet.  A police report was filed.

Offline Robittybob1

Re: How accurate would be Martin Smith's ID of Gerry MaCann?
« Reply #118 on: March 03, 2018, 06:55:59 AM »
Aw, that must have been terrifying,

In 2019, driving north on the M5 we were shot at from a passing car.  We were about a mile or so short of the Bromsgrove junction.
...snip ...
What year?  My troubles were back in 1986  That guy died in bike accident in the end.
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Offline sadie

Re: How accurate would be Martin Smith's ID of Gerry MaCann?
« Reply #119 on: March 03, 2018, 07:13:40 AM »
What year?  My troubles were back in 1986  That guy died in bike accident in the end.
Soz

2010, not 2019  @)(++(*, soon after I had revealed some of my thoughts on another forum about Madeleine going up to Porto etc.

Seems i upset someone !