A Simple Question.

[jassi]

Maybe if we had all the information it would be far more than half the forum   

[Carana]

I find it pays not to try to second guess something on the basis of what I know to be incomplete information.

Do you mean something specific that you, personally, have further information about, or do you mean in general?

I've never said I had complete information and I doubt that anyone does, including the police - if they did the case would presumably be solved.

[Brietta]

The OP demanded a simple "yes" or "no" which in my opinion is a rather inward looking approach and one cannot help but wonder at the apparent inability to look beyond Kate and Gerry and the friends they holidayed with anyway.

Surely the obvious fact that following that path led the Amaral investigation into a cul de sac from which it could not be extrapolated even by the change of coordinator for the simple reason the theory was unsustainable because of a lack of evidence.

Someone, somewhere knows exactly what happened to Madeleine McCann and when it became obvious to the Portuguese judiciary there was nothing to justify Kate and Gerry's arguido status making it by definition neither of them; nor there having been any evidence to make any of their friends arguidos in the first instance meaning it was none of them either, in my opinion it merited the net being cast a bit wider to encompass those who were there on the night and who had the opportunity.

Yet here we are nearly eleven years down the line and there are still those who cannot let go of the discredited theory which took Madeleine's case off track and sadly left it there until the advent of Operation Grange.

[slartibartfast]

The OP demanded a simple "yes" or "no" which in my opinion is a rather inward looking approach and one cannot help but wonder at the apparent inability to look beyond Kate and Gerry and the friends they holidayed with anyway.

Surely the obvious fact that following that path led the Amaral investigation into a cul de sac from which it could not be extrapolated even by the change of coordinator for the simple reason the theory was unsustainable because of a lack of evidence.

Someone, somewhere knows exactly what happened to Madeleine McCann and when it became obvious to the Portuguese judiciary there was nothing to justify Kate and Gerry's arguido status making it by definition neither of them; nor there having been any evidence to make any of their friends arguidos in the first instance meaning it was none of them either, in my opinion it merited the net being cast a bit wider to encompass those who were there on the night and who had the opportunity.

Yet here we are nearly eleven years down the line and there are still those who cannot let go of the discredited theory which took Madeleine's case off track and sadly left it there until the advent of Operation Grange.

IYO

[Vertigo Swirl]

I didn’t dodge the points I was simply stopping you pulling this topic further off topic.

So you think that if Rowley, or Redwood, was asked directly if the McCanns were suspects and they were they’d possibly admit it ? Really ?

I have answered your question on this I think twice already.  My opinion has not changed in thr intervening hours.

[Vertigo Swirl]

And yet the journalists keep asking.

That's their job.

[Robittybob1]

That's their job.

What the job of a journalist?  So can you give me an example please?

[Alice Purjorick]

Do you mean something specific that you, personally, have further information about, or do you mean in general?

I've never said I had complete information and I doubt that anyone does, including the police - if they did the case would presumably be solved.

I mean in general.
I would not work on the presumption that the police game plan was merely to counter punch to whatever came along.
We, having incomplete information a lot of which comes from dubious sources, are not likely to drop the shot into the right county let alone town but it's fun pretending we can.

[Mr Gray]

I mean in general.
I would not work on the presumption that the police game plan was merely to counter punch to whatever came along.
We, having incomplete information a lot of which comes from dubious sources, are not likely to drop the shot into the right county let alone town but it's fun pretending we can.

But when we have precise information  from impeccable sources.... The alerts have no evidential  reliability... It seems to make no difference to those with a set in stone mindset

[Carana]

I mean in general.
I would not work on the presumption that the police game plan was merely to counter punch to whatever came along.
We, having incomplete information a lot of which comes from dubious sources, are not likely to drop the shot into the right county let alone town but it's fun pretending we can.

I wasn't suggesting that, Alice.

I'm just offering my opinion, I'm not expecting anyone to necesarily agree with it.

I've listened to statements made on TV, supposedly verbatim quotes from pressers, and I've read several strategic debriefs.

I hope you'd consider those sources as possibly more reliable than a number of tabloid stories churned out in the early media frenzy that some still seem fond of regurgitating as gospel?

ETA: And my comment had 3 aspects to it:

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=9247.msg451169#msg451169

[Brietta]

IYO

Please be specific and differentiate what you consider to be opinion as opposed to fact in the post you complain about.
Thank you.

[slartibartfast]

Please be specific and differentiate what you consider to be opinion as opposed to fact in the post you complain about.
Thank you.

Most of it.

[Alice Purjorick]

But when we have precise information  from impeccable sources.... The alerts have no evidential  reliability... It seems to make no difference to those with a set in stone mindset

As I have repeatedly said Messrs Grime and Harrison may say what they like out of court.
In court they simply would not be allowed to say "The alerts have no evidential  reliability" as that is assuming a power they do not have. They may well be correct but that would not be the point should it wind up in court. In that case it would be up to the judge to direct and the judges and jury [if any] to decide the weighting if any given.

So what precise information with impeccable sources do you have to offer?
The case extends somewhat further than a pair of dogs, their handler and his boss.

[Carana]

As I have repeatedly said Messrs Grime and Harrison may say what they like out of court.
In court they simply would not be allowed to say "The alerts have no evidential  reliability" as that is assuming a power they do not have. They may well be correct but that would not be the point should it wind up in court. In that case it would be up to the judge to direct and the judges and jury [if any] to decide the weighting if any given.

So what precise information with impeccable sources do you have to offer?
The case extends somewhat further than a pair of dogs, their handler and his boss.

All a bit hypothetical, but anyway.

If the McCanns had been tried in PT, would Grime and Harrison have had to testify in person? Or would the rogs have sufficed (it must be somewhere in the articles I posted earlier, but I haven't actually read it all yet).

Next question: if they had to testify in person, who would have been competent to question whether corroborative / physical / forensic evidence was necessary? The didn't have such dogs in PT, so there would have been no precedent.

[G-Unit]

As I have repeatedly said Messrs Grime and Harrison may say what they like out of court.
In court they simply would not be allowed to say "The alerts have no evidential  reliability" as that is assuming a power they do not have. They may well be correct but that would not be the point should it wind up in court. In that case it would be up to the judge to direct and the judges and jury [if any] to decide the weighting if any given.

So what precise information with impeccable sources do you have to offer?
The case extends somewhat further than a pair of dogs, their handler and his boss.

Talking of Grime's boss, it would be fascinating to know what Mr McCann had to say to him;

I never met nor spoken to Gerald McCann. However I do know that he addressed my head supervisor at the time, the South Yorkshire Head of Police, or Mr. Meredith Hughes.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARTIN_GRIMES_RIGATORY.htm