Author Topic: Did this finding get followed up by the PJ?  (Read 69621 times)

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Offline Robittybob1

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Offline Sunny

Re: Did this finding get followed up by the PJ?
« Reply #1 on: August 18, 2018, 11:26:34 PM »
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=9966.msg481335#msg481335

Where was this basement capsule?  Who's place was it?

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/STEPHEN-CARPENTER.htm

Well I have a possible person who may be "laundryman" referred to in Stephen Carpenter's statement.

He is Mario Fernando Madeira Marreiros

His statement.

Occupation: Laundry worker

Place of Work: OC

He has worked at the OC since the 5th March 2007 as a laundry worker as well as the driver of the laundry vehicles of the resort, delivering and collecting laundry (towels and sheets) from the apartments that make up the resort.

With relation to the events being investigated he states that on 4th May 2007, upon arriving at work at about 10.00 he saw that next to an apartment block there were various cars and police as well as members of the press, which he found strange.

Later, when he arrived at his place of work he was informed by colleagues that this "apparatus" was due to the disappearance of a little girl who had been staying at the resort.

He was informed that the girl was three years old, of British nationality and he observed that posters with her photograph and details were already up, with indications to follow in the case of information about her disappearance.


When questioned he said that he did not know the girl or her family, only having heard about them after the event.

When questioned about the day of the disappearance (03 May 2007) of the girl whose name he does not remember, he says he carried out his normal routine, arriving at his place of work at about 10.00, with a lunch break from 13.00 to 14.30, returning to work until 18.00. After work he returned home where he stayed with his wife until 21.30 when he went alone by car to Barao de Sao Joao, where his step son works.

After having picked up his step son he returned home where he stayed until the following day when he left for work.

He only knew about the events from the press and from his colleagues.


http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARIO_MARREIROS.htm

My reasons for thinking it may be him are threefold.

Firstly he works in the laundry
Secondly he has a son (well a stepson)
Thirdly he drives the laundry van.


Stephen carpenter said this about the van.

I am certain that I read about this at the beginning, which (inaudible)' I think that afterwards, and afterwards coincides with the fact that he was the man from the laundry and of the van parked there, because as i have already explained, we were here in a small street here above which linked to the main road and to everything beside here on top, the rest was all pathways and I remember that on two or three occasions I thought...this is a dead end road, the van was parked there, I never saw anyone and more than once assumed that it would be cleaning staff and only this thought coincided with the presence of the man from the laundry, and if there were any reply to be made in relation to the link between the van parked there and the laundry man.

From what I an see nothing further was done about it.
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Offline Robittybob1

Re: Did this finding get followed up by the PJ?
« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2018, 11:41:56 PM »
This bit is interesting "After work he returned home where he stayed with his wife until 21.30 when he went alone by car to Barao de Sao Joao, where his step son works."

Those orphanage collectors had some connection to a town named something like "Barao de Sao Joao".  I remember researching that township so I wonder if the posts are still on the forum?

My posts not there anymore,  but there is a hint here http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=7118.msg316935#msg316935  "Barao de Sao Joao" is abreviated BdSJ

The parents killed in BdSJ but kids kept in an orphanage.

"GC: "three children from that family had been looked after by the orphanage"  GC = Gail Cooper.
« Last Edit: August 19, 2018, 05:00:15 AM by Robittybob1 »
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Offline Sunny

Re: Did this finding get followed up by the PJ?
« Reply #3 on: August 18, 2018, 11:49:20 PM »
This bit is interesting "After work he returned home where he stayed with his wife until 21.30 when he went alone by car to Barao de Sao Joao, where his step son works."

Those orphanage collectors had some connection to a town named something like "Barao de Sao Joao".  I remember researching that township so I wonder if the posts are still on the forum?

My posts not there anymore,  but there is a hint here http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=7118.msg316935#msg316935  "Barao de Sao Joao" is abreviated BdSJ

The parents killed in BdSJ kept in an orphanage.

"GC: "three children from that family had been looked after by the orphanage"  GC = Gail Cooper.

I don't know anything about that as yet but I have found out that Mario Fernando Madeira Marreiros (laundryman) was a witness to a sighting apparently.
http://www.gerrymccannsblogs.co.uk/press/73may13/Portugal_29_05_2013.htm
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Offline Robittybob1

« Last Edit: August 19, 2018, 12:13:55 AM by Robittybob1 »
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Offline Sunny

Re: Did this finding get followed up by the PJ?
« Reply #5 on: August 19, 2018, 12:12:32 AM »
https://youtu.be/ftxK-SQ85lM  video that I hadn't seen before.
https://joana-morais.blogspot.com/2010/05/return-of-gail-cooper-and-creepy.html

Thanks Robittybob1 I hadn't seen that video either. I can't see the creepy man being the laundry guys son though as creepyman looks too old in the drawing.  In fact he looks like the baddy in a B rated cowboy movie

Did they ever find the man Gail Cooper saw?

Anyway I am off to bed now.  Speak soon.
Members are reminded that cites must be provided in accordance with the forum rules. On several occasions recently cites have been requested but never provided. Asking for a cite is not goading but compliance.

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Offline misty

Re: Did this finding get followed up by the PJ?
« Reply #6 on: August 19, 2018, 01:34:57 AM »
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=9966.msg481335#msg481335

Where was this basement capsule?  Who's place was it?

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/STEPHEN-CARPENTER.htm

This was discussed at some stage on the forum. The conclusion reached was that it was one of the two western end garages in Block 2 (called Coraluz) immediately north of Block 5, based on what SC & the grey-haired man were discussing.
Images attached.

[attachment deleted by admin]

Offline Robittybob1

Re: Did this finding get followed up by the PJ?
« Reply #7 on: August 19, 2018, 04:54:39 AM »
How did you know it was called Coraluz for that name has not come up on "search"?

On Google it came up.  How did the laundry man afford to live there, unless it was the basement garage?
http://www.valgarve.com/12-coraluz-praia-da-luz.html
« Last Edit: August 19, 2018, 04:59:10 AM by Robittybob1 »
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Offline Robittybob1

Re: Did this finding get followed up by the PJ?
« Reply #8 on: August 19, 2018, 05:27:34 AM »
Does anyone know who this Dave is mentioned in Stephen Carpenter's statement?

"At this moment I also met an English man called Dave who lived in the area and helped the Ocean Club to authorise entry into all the apartments possible, some of the apartments in Gerry's block belonged to local owners and Dave helped to get the keys to these apartments so that they could check them and search them, they checked them all in a general manner.

[ see http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=10045.msg481482#msg481482 for the answer to this.]
« Last Edit: August 19, 2018, 07:39:52 PM by Robittybob1 »
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Offline Robittybob1

Re: Did this finding get followed up by the PJ?
« Reply #9 on: August 19, 2018, 06:10:28 AM »
Sunny - there are two unknown or even 3 unknown men in SC statement.

There is Dave the English man who helped with the keys. (that is one, and there are the two others, the Tapas Guy and the Portuguese Man).
SC states:
"A man with three children whom I met in the Tapas Bar and who I referred to as the "Tapas Guy" and a Portuguese man in a garage whom I will refer to as the "laundry man".

I think you have identified the Laundry man, but isn't it the Tapas guy who has the apartment with the garage.
I think the Tapas Man could have been identified separately.
Tapas man has the dreadlocks and his name was Michael Sperry or something like that. At this stage I don't think the laundry man is living in the apartment block opposite the McCanns apartment but I'm unsure.

Is there anyone good at comprehension that can get us on target here please?

There is a guy referred to as the Tapas Guy - but that term is not mentioned again, but he is English not Portuguese whereas the laundry man is Portuguese so they must be distinctly different people.

The English man has grey hair, but I don't think Steve gets to talk to the Portuguese man (how could he?) so when Steve is told "his son lives there"  that is in the garage, it doesn't mean the Portuguese man lives in the garage but Portuguese man's son not the English man's son.
I'm struggling with who's who!
« Last Edit: August 19, 2018, 06:18:37 AM by Robittybob1 »
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Offline Robittybob1

Re: Did this finding get followed up by the PJ?
« Reply #10 on: August 19, 2018, 10:42:49 AM »
There was one attempt to work out who SC is talking about.
http://textusa1.rssing.com/chan-26005015/all_p5.html
"2. Name-remembrance, a Carpenter oddity

To remember the nannies names, Pauline, Emma and Leanne, so well seems to reveal that Carpenter suffers from some sort psychological disorder which only allows him to remember the name of those with who he has very brief contact with.

Neil Berry and Raj Balu, with who he says he spoke briefly with on May 03 in Tapas, he's able to remember their names but Philip Edmonds who he says his daughter plays with and gets into a conversation intimate enough to be told the other man would be leaving earlier the next day, he can only remembers him by “Tapas Guy”.

The only other interaction that Carpenter says he has with Berry and Balu, is what appears to have been a brief encounter with them during the searches, only long enough for them to tell him they had found suspicious “Greyhairman”, a 50 yr old man who apparently had bought all the apartments of Ocean Club's block 2.

The “Greyhairman” tale is of 2 men telling another about someone who they thought suspicious during a search for a missing girl.

Conversation between strangers while searching is not a personal one. For example, Cecília Pires, when invited to search (trespass) by a 50 yr old man, doesn’t get to know his name nor that of the elderly woman who the same man invites to join the trespassing.

Searching is a collective effort with an objective. There's no “Hello, I’m Stephen Carpenter, would you like join me in the searching? What are your names?”

Unless, one does spend a long time with the same person in the same search. After a while the “I’m sorry, what can I call you? My name is Steve, what’s yours?” is inevitable.

Funny enough with Carpenter the opposite happens. The person he seems to spend the most time with searching is the one whose name slips away from him, starts as Dave the Englishman and then becomes the person who he no longer remembers the name of.

But he remembers John Hill’s name. Why?

Observe how is seems to be so familiar with who John Hill is, so certain of  his identity while trying to remember the name of the man he’s spent a lot of time with:

“Carpenter: … I can't remember the name of the individual, who I also met by chance, and who was doing a little of translator, what was his name again, who helped to open the doors.

DC Ferguson: Was it John HILL?

Carpenter: No, John Hill was a Mark Warner employee, I forgot his name, but he...humm also knew the local Estate Agent and different people who helped to get the keys of the owners or potential renters, some of whom were on holiday.”

Could it have been John Hill instead, asks SY, oh, no, no, no, I know very well who John Hill is and not talking about him, Carpenter answers. Does the reader get to know the name of the manager of the hotels the reader has been to? Or remember the name of the manager of the last hotel the reader has been to?

The only interaction we know having happened between Carpenter and John Hill is when Carpenter observes Hill being literally ordered by Murat to open the apartments and complying:

“DC Ferguson: After he [Murat] left, he explained that Gerry was frustrated with the way in which the process was running and they went to talk to John Hill.

Carpenter: Yes.

DC Ferguson: In Mark Warner and he [Murat] demanded that he [John Hill] open up all the Mark Warner rooms so that he [Murat] could check them and he [John Hill] called the cleaning ladies etc. to help and open all the empty apartments that were not necessarily in the Mark Warner complex, but for which they could have the key. At this time you also met an English man called Dave who lived in the area and helped the Ocean Club give you [plural, so Murat and Carpenter] the authority to enter in all possible apartments, some of the apartments in Gerry's block belonged to local owners and Dave helped to get the key to these same apartments so that you could search them, and then and then began the search, searching all in general.”

John Hill is not referred to as the “manager” or the “the man from the Ocean Club” who had the keys to the apartments. He’s John Hill. As in first and last name memorised.

Meanwhile the man who “helped the Ocean Club give you [Murat and Carpenter] the authority to enter in all possible apartments” is just vague Dave, the Englishman.

Also the two of Gerry’s friends who he has quite a long walk with that morning and are the ones who tell him that the child missing is indeed Maddie, are remembered only as Gerry’s “surfing friends”.

So, to remember the nannies who took care of their children, Pauline, Emma and Leanne, is strange to say the least."

Some aspects of what Textusa talks about is admitted to by SC as he asks for a pen and paper so he can write down names to remember them.  I can appreciate that so his wife may have remembered the names of the nannies and he had written them down.

He does identify Philip Edmonds indirectly  but I'm not sure where that comes in handy as it is a description of someone he couldn't name.
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Offline Robittybob1

Re: Did this finding get followed up by the PJ?
« Reply #11 on: August 19, 2018, 10:59:03 AM »
From Sunny's post

"However who is the 50 year old Englishman?

From Stephen Carpenter's statement


And when we entered the garage I asked who lived there, he replied that his son lived there and then there were distractions and because I was concentrated on the fifty year old English man, this man is Portuguese"

I will have a look see if I can find the laundry worker too." End quote. 

what does that mean?  "because I was concentrated on the fifty year old English man, this man is Portuguese"

I take that to mean the English man talking to him was talking about a Portuguese man, and his son.  Could that be right?
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Offline Robittybob1

Re: Did this finding get followed up by the PJ?
« Reply #12 on: August 19, 2018, 11:12:30 AM »
This bit "the English man with grey hair whose identity I did not know, but who had explained this to me.


DCF: Yes.

SC: Humm... this garage belonged to a Portuguese man, the man from the laundry"

We need to join those two sentences together which then becomes something I can understand:  "the English man with grey hair, whose identity I did not know, but who had explained this to me this garage belonged to a Portuguese man, the man from the laundry"  "And when we entered the garage I asked [the Englishman] who lived there, he replied that "his son" [the Portuguese laundry man's son] lived there.
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Offline Robittybob1

Re: Did this finding get followed up by the PJ?
« Reply #13 on: August 19, 2018, 11:26:54 AM »
If the owner of the garage was the laundry man let's see what the laundryman says again?

Well I have a possible person who may be "laundryman" referred to in Stephen Carpenter's statement.

He is Mario Fernando Madeira Marreiros

His statement.

Occupation: Laundry worker

Place of Work: OC

He has worked at the OC since the 5th March 2007 as a laundry worker as well as the driver of the laundry vehicles of the resort, delivering and collecting laundry (towels and sheets) from the apartments that make up the resort.

With relation to the events being investigated he states that on 4th May 2007, upon arriving at work at about 10.00 he saw that next to an apartment block there were various cars and police as well as members of the press, which he found strange.

Later, when he arrived at his place of work he was informed by colleagues that this "apparatus" was due to the disappearance of a little girl who had been staying at the resort.

He was informed that the girl was three years old, of British nationality and he observed that posters with her photograph and details were already up, with indications to follow in the case of information about her disappearance.


When questioned he said that he did not know the girl or her family, only having heard about them after the event.

When questioned about the day of the disappearance (03 May 2007) of the girl whose name he does not remember, he says he carried out his normal routine, arriving at his place of work at about 10.00, with a lunch break from 13.00 to 14.30, returning to work until 18.00. After work he returned home where he stayed with his wife until 21.30 when he went alone by car to Barao de Sao Joao, where his step son works.

After having picked up his step son he returned home where he stayed until the following day when he left for work.

He only knew about the events from the press and from his colleagues.


http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARIO_MARREIROS.htm

My reasons for thinking it may be him are threefold.

Firstly he works in the laundry
Secondly he has a son (well a stepson)
Thirdly he drives the laundry van.


Stephen carpenter said this about the van.

I am certain that I read about this at the beginning, which (inaudible)' I think that afterwards, and afterwards coincides with the fact that he was the man from the laundry and of the van parked there, because as i have already explained, we were here in a small street here above which linked to the main road and to everything beside here on top, the rest was all pathways and I remember that on two or three occasions I thought...this is a dead end road, the van was parked there, I never saw anyone and more than once assumed that it would be cleaning staff and only this thought coincided with the presence of the man from the laundry, and if there were any reply to be made in relation to the link between the van parked there and the laundry man.

From what I an see nothing further was done about it.
This bit is weird: "After work he returned home where he stayed with his wife until 21.30 when he went alone by car to Barao de Sao Joao, where his step son works.

After having picked up his step son he returned home where he stayed until the following day when he left for work."

I wonder if his stepson and his wife ever confirmed his alibi?  To have a car driving away from PdL potentially from across the road from the McCanns at the 21.30H time window could be very significant.
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Offline Robittybob1

Re: Did this finding get followed up by the PJ?
« Reply #14 on: August 19, 2018, 12:02:54 PM »
He picks his son up from work but doesn't say where he drops him off.  Is he still living at home or is he the one who is from our suspicion the son who is living in the capsule under the apartments across the road from the McCanns?
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