Cadaver dogs are unreliable - Eugene Zapata

[Eleanor]

Where do you get that idea from?

Do you seriously think that The South Yorkshire Police who owned Eddie would have allowed Martin Grime to involve the dog in illegal practices?

[Robittybob1]

I still consider myself a newbie so please be patient but 'Eddie' didn't do the above in 5A or the hire car?

They located invisible quantities of human blood.

Do you seriously think that The South Yorkshire Police who owned Eddie would have allowed Martin Grime to involve the dog in illegal practices?

If the training was legal in the USA what's the problem?

[Holly Goodhead]

Under no circumstances would The South Yorkshire Police have allowed Martin Grime to take Eddie to America to engage in a practice that is illegal in Britain.  Let alone have paid the costs.

Is the article misty posted saying it's illegal or that it has the potential to breach the human rights act? 

I can't see even in the US that 'Eddie' was training with human corpses only piglets which have a different DNA to humans and as such a different scent.  There's no donor like system whereby the deceased are able to say they're happy for their corpse to be used for this purpose and next of kin and/or the state would not be able to authorise such.

[jassi]

Do you seriously think that The South Yorkshire Police who owned Eddie would have allowed Martin Grime to involve the dog in illegal practices?

Despite your incredulity, it would be nice to see your supporting evidence for such a statement.

[Eleanor]

They located invisible quantities of human blood.
If the training was legal in the USA what's the problem?

Can you not see that it would make a mockery of British Law, especially unsupervised and at great cost.

[Holly Goodhead]

They located invisible quantities of human blood.

I don't believe FSS was able to determine the human cellular material?

If the training was legal in the USA what's the problem?

Where's the evidence 'Eddie' trained in US using human corpses?

[Robittybob1]

I don't believe FSS was able to determine the human cellular material?

Where's the evidence 'Eddie' trained in US using human corpses?

But it is what the dogs were trained to find, there is no test for cadaver odour, nor a way to see the minute quantity of blood that Keela alerts to.  Well there is a video show Grime training his dogs using human tissue. 

[Holly Goodhead]

Can you not see that it would make a mockery of British Law, especially unsupervised and at great cost.

Even the gung-ho US would not use human corpses for such training. 

If someone wants to donate an organ they need to specify such.  Where has anyone specified they are happy for their corpse or part of to be scattered around the US for 'Eddie' to locate?

[Eleanor]

But it is what the dogs were trained to find, there is no test for cadaver odour, nor a way to see the minute quantity of blood that Keela alerts to.  Well there is a video show Grime training his dogs using human tissue.

Which Dogs?  Are you sure you aren't talking about Morse.  Morse belonged exclusively to Martin Grime and after his retirement.

[Robittybob1]

Even the gung-ho US would not use human corpses for such training. 

If someone wants to donate an organ they need to specify such.  Where has anyone specified they are happy for their corpse or part of to be scattered around the US for 'Eddie' to locate?

It was contact samples wasn't it?  Like "swabs" that had been in contact with a human cadaver, but also ancient human bones and teeth (in the video), and dried blood samples provided by the trainer (in the video).

Which Dogs?  Are you sure you aren't talking about Morse.  Morse belonged exclusively to Martin Grime and after his retirement.

I'm not sure about that.  We would have to view the video again. See if he names the dog.

[Holly Goodhead]

But it is what the dogs were trained to find, there is no test for cadaver odour, nor a way to see the minute quantity of blood that Keela alerts to.  Well there is a video show Grime training his dogs using human tissue.

No individual or state thankfully has the power to take human remains, however big or small, to use in such an experiment.

We don't need 'Keela' to see minute quantities of blood she simply alerts to and scrapings are collected for scientific examination.   In this case FSS were unable to identify anything remotely relevant. 

[Holly Goodhead]

It was contact samples wasn't it?  Like "swabs" that had been in contact with a human cadaver, but also ancient human bones and teeth (in the video), and dried blood samples provided by the trainer (in the video).

I'm not sure about that.  We would have to view the video again. See if he names the dog.

Please post up the video.

[barrier]

Even the gung-ho US would not use human corpses for such training. 

If someone wants to donate an organ they need to specify such.  Where has anyone specified they are happy for their corpse or part of to be scattered around the US for 'Eddie' to locate?

Sure?

https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2010/12/down-on-the-body-farm-inside-the-dirty-world-of-forensic-science/67241/

https://allthatsinteresting.com/body-farms

[jassi]

Now don't let awkward facts get in the way.

[Holly Goodhead]

Sure?

https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2010/12/down-on-the-body-farm-inside-the-dirty-world-of-forensic-science/67241/

https://allthatsinteresting.com/body-farms

I meant without prior authorisation from a donor and that's what happening here:

The cadavers on most body farms come from two sources: medical examiners -- "If nobody claims a body, you have to do something with it," Jantz said -- and pre-donors. The latter is the preferred method: the Anthropological Research Facility in Knoxville currently has over 2,000 pre-donors on file who will bestow their corporeal remains to the facility after they die. "We get over 100 donated bodies each year from donations," Jantz said. "People donate themselves like they would to a medical school."

Is there any evidence 'Eddie' trained with human corpses?  And even if he did he did not locate a corpse or human remains at 5A or in the hire car.