White House Farm - ITV Drama Series - Part 2

[Holly Goodhead]

Nevill may have been crouching, trying to avoid being shot.

But the trajectories were only some 10/12 degrees below the horizontal.  If NB had been crouching the trajectory would have been much lower.  Also the wound tracks do not correspond with NB shot in a crouching position.

[Caroline]

From June's final head shot(s) as were cartridge cases DRH13 and DRH14 on the upper-landing and mid-landing respectively.

June's injuries are a bit of a mystery to me, the pillow looks as though she was shot in the head while in bed but both shots damaged her brain, so how did she walk around the bedroom?

[Myster]

Blood tests on the two tiny stains on the landing were inconclusive in showing whose blood. Moreover how did they get there?  Bearing in mind Crispy had free run of the doc for some 4 hours.

But what about the blood stains on the stairs carpet and those across the kitchen floor?  If not NB's blood then whose?

The drawn plans make the rooms appear so clean, but as you say, Crispy was wandering about for several hours, so he could have trodden in blood a few times spreading it everywhere. Then the TFU probably contributed too. What blood on the stairs carpet?... I don't remember mention of any, only the two spots on the upper-landing.

Most of that in the kitchen floor obviously belonged to Nevill, but again Crispy might have stood in the pooling there and also contributed traces from upstairs. By the time he was locked in a cupboard, the contamination was already done.

[Myster]

June's injuries are a bit of a mystery to me, the pillow looks as though she was shot in the head while in bed but both shots damaged her brain, so how did she walk around the bedroom?

Her neck wound (3) penetrated right through, so the bullet might have hit a minor artery which caused that heavy blood stain on her pillow. A bullet was also discovered within it.  Impossible, I feel, that she could have wandered around the bed for very long, if at all, had wounds (1) and (2), which caused major brain disruption, been inflicted before the rest. So they occurred last as she lay in the doorway... mentioned by Vanezis and many times elsewhere.  I think wound (7) happened whilst June was lying prone in bed with her right knee raised as she was attempting to get up. Only my opinion though, you might disagree...

[Holly Goodhead]

The drawn plans make the rooms appear so clean, but as you say, Crispy was wandering about for several hours, so he could have trodden in blood a few times spreading it everywhere. Then the TFU probably contributed too. What blood on the stairs carpet?... I don't remember mention of any, only the two spots on the upper-landing.

Most of that in the kitchen floor obviously belonged to Nevill, but again Crispy might have stood in the pooling there and also contributed traces from upstairs. By the time he was locked in a cupboard, the contamination was already done.

DCI Jones makes ref to the blood stains on stairs in his notebook.  AE also refers to in her wit stat.  DCI Hammersly refers to a light distribution of blood on the kitchen floor. 

[Holly Goodhead]

DCI Jones makes ref to the blood stains on stairs in his notebook.  AE also refers to in her wit stat.  DCI Hammersly refers to a light distribution of blood on the kitchen floor.

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=174.0;attach=373

[Holly Goodhead]

Her neck wound (3) penetrated right through, so the bullet might have hit a minor artery which caused that heavy blood stain on her pillow. A bullet was also discovered within it.  Impossible, I feel, that she could have wandered around the bed for very long, if at all, had wounds (1) and (2), which caused major brain disruption, been inflicted before the rest. So they occurred last as she lay in the doorway... mentioned by Vanezis and many times elsewhere.  I think wound (7) happened whilst June was lying prone in bed with her right knee raised as she was attempting to get up. Only my opinion though, you might disagree...

June sustained 3 exit wounds of which 2 bullets ended up in the pillow.  It is thought the neck wound occurred when her head was on the pillow. 

Dr V makes clear in his trial testimony that the 2 gsw's June sustained to her head would have immobilised her either together or independently.  Therefore they must have occurred where she was found.

[Holly Goodhead]

Possibly. Given that both Taff and Stan are deceased, I wonder where the scriptwriters got the insight from to make such a strong portrayal?

Most of part 2 is stuff we already know about but it would have been useful if they had given more background to Jeremy Bamber and in particular his exploits down under and the theft and criminal damage at Osea Caravan Park.  They also appear to have totally ignored his drug dealing exploits while in cahoots with Muggy.

Where to start?  Perhaps look at June's severe depression in 1959 requiring in-patient psychiatric treatment and ect treatment.  We are told by Dr Ferguson the source of the depression being her decision to adopt SC.  Why was SC not removed from the Bambers care?  Why were the Bambers allowed to adopt another baby?

[Holly Goodhead]

It'll be a sad world when we all become automatons to follow a line.Its why we're all different,put 12 people in a room whats there to say they all must be convinced beyond reasonable doubt.Was it all the evidence against JB that they found to be of doubt or just one part that they couldn't agree with to return the guilty verdict,did they both disagree on the same points? so many variables just to say with conviction oh! but two found JB not guilty.

If it was all so compelling why not unanimous?

[Angelo222]

The evidence at soc by way of blood stains, casings, distance of shots, trajectories and wound tracks show exactly what happened: perp was upstairs and NB was first shot twice in the face whilst he was on the landing facing into the bedroom with perp stood inside main bedroom firing at NB on the landing.

In the case of MM forensic scientist talked about a case where the police bought a house to preserve blood stains which in the end caused the case to take a completely different direction.  In this case blood stain analysis was in its infancy and wasn't used at trial in the way it would be today.  I believe there is still some potential for this aspect to be reevaluated based on soc images.

I remember reading all about this previously, the shooter had to be stood just inside the bedroom door facing Nevill when he discharged the first shots which hit Nevill. Discharging the rifle while facing out to the landing would not have left the spent shells where they fell.

Clearly Nevill got out of bed and was confronted by the killer when he opened the bedroom door. He would have stepped back slightly before being shot.  The Anschutz rifle discharges to the right when viewed from the shooting position.

[Angelo222]

The shots were all over the place.  JB was a marksman.  SC had little knowledge/experience. 25/26 shots fired. JB would have been able to kill each victim with 1 shot aimed at the head.  In the case of David Bain 5 family members died from gunshot wounds.  The firearm used had the same velocity as the one used in this case.  The perp was experienced with the firearm and used a total of 8 cartridges to kill 5 adults.  That's 2/3rd's less than the 25/26 cartridges used in this case.

That's exactly what Bamber thought but he and you are wrong. A single .22 round will not always kill a human and that is why Bamber fired several shots into most of his victims. Had a novice like Sheila used that rifle very few shots would have been on target.  And regardless, it's sheer fantasy to think Sheila could ever have fought with her father and not ended up with injuries to herself or his blood all over her. It's all very silly imo to promote such a proposition and most people can see that now.

[Angelo222]

No it does not!!!  Nevill was nowhere near the landing when shot.  The number and positions of the spent cartridges on the bedroom floor show that Nevill was shot first as he was getting out of bed having been disturbed by noises made by an intruder, i.e. Jeremy Bamber.

Holly doesn't understand that apparently.

[Angelo222]

Whether the victims were prone in bed or standing in rooms they were easy targets.

Ever tried to shoot someone at close range indoors with a long barrelled rife?

If you had you would realise that it isn't easy at all. 

[Angelo222]

Yes it does!!!!

We've been through all this loads of time.  NB was not shot in the bedroom evidenced by the fact his blood was not found in there.  NB was shot on the landing as he was facing the perp stood inside the bedroom firing out onto the landing and this is supported by all the evidence: blood stains, casings, distance of shots, trajectories and wound tracks.

Again Holly you have failed to understand the consequences of shooting someone with a single .22 standard bullet.  Unlike 38 calibre or magnum rounds there would not be an exit wound so blood can only escape via the entry and that is by no means immediate. Nevill may not have bled through his pyjamas until he made his escape downstairs.

Not finding Nevill's blood in the bedroom has little significance.

[Angelo222]

June's injuries are a bit of a mystery to me, the pillow looks as though she was shot in the head while in bed but both shots damaged her brain, so how did she walk around the bedroom?

I don't believe the head shot occurred until she got out of bed.