Why were they all at the White House that night? Colin Caffell's alibi?

[Robittybob1]

From https://murderpedia.org/male.B/images/bamber_jeremy/20011745.pdf  part of an Appeal Court document.

"17. Shortly after the marriage Sheila’s mental health began to fail and the couple divorced in
May 1982. During 1983 Sheila was admitted to a psychiatric hospital and subsequently was
diagnosed as a paranoid schizophrenic. In March 1985 she was re-admitted to hospital
before being discharged a little under four weeks later. For the months before their death,
the children had been living with their father, although seeing their mother frequently. On 4
August 1985 (three days before the killings) Colin Caffell had taken his ex-wife and
children to spend a few days with their grandparents at the farm in Essex."

Did Collin Caffell have a watertight alibi for that night?

[Aunt Agatha]

From https://murderpedia.org/male.B/images/bamber_jeremy/20011745.pdf  part of an Appeal Court document.

"17. Shortly after the marriage Sheila’s mental health began to fail and the couple divorced in
May 1982. During 1983 Sheila was admitted to a psychiatric hospital and subsequently was
diagnosed as a paranoid schizophrenic. In March 1985 she was re-admitted to hospital
before being discharged a little under four weeks later. For the months before their death,
the children had been living with their father, although seeing their mother frequently. On 4
August 1985 (three days before the killings) Colin Caffell had taken his ex-wife and
children to spend a few days with their grandparents at the farm in Essex."

Did Collin Caffell have a watertight alibi for that night?

4th August?   why, whats your thinking?

[Robittybob1]

4th August?   why, whats your thinking?

"Did Collin Caffell have a watertight alibi for the night of the murders?"   Not the alibi for the day he brought the kids to White House Farm.

[Caroline]

"Did Collin Caffell have a watertight alibi for the night of the murders?"   Not the alibi for the day he brought the kids to White House Farm.

Of course he did.

[Robittybob1]

Of course he did.

What was it then?

[Caroline]

What was it then?

Have you read anything on the case yet?

Why does he need an alibi?

[mrswah]

Have you read anything on the case yet?

Why does he need an alibi?

I doubt he does, but what's the answer to Rob's question?

[Robittybob1]

Have you read anything on the case yet?

Why does he need an alibi?

He is part of the family that was murdered, so I thought it would be normal to check his alibi.  The time of death was not established beyond saying they all died that night.   

[Brietta]

He is part of the family that was murdered, so I thought it would be normal to check his alibi.  The time of death was not established beyond saying they all died that night.

In my opinion since the police had been pointed in the direction of murder/suicide by Bamber's sworn narrative why on earth would the police question innocent victims about their whereabouts at the time of the massacre?

All this time after the event and the information we have to hand, I have to admit to my dismay when I saw the thread title.

[Robittybob1]

In my opinion since the police had been pointed in the direction of murder/suicide by Bamber's sworn narrative why on earth would the police question innocent victims about their whereabouts at the time of the massacre?

All this time after the event and the information we have to hand, I have to admit to my dismay when I saw the thread title.

Are you referring to Jeremy Bamber's first statement?  What was the date of that and is it available to be read?

[Brancher]

From https://murderpedia.org/male.B/images/bamber_jeremy/20011745.pdf  part of an Appeal Court document.

"17. Shortly after the marriage Sheila’s mental health began to fail and the couple divorced in
May 1982. During 1983 Sheila was admitted to a psychiatric hospital and subsequently was
diagnosed as a paranoid schizophrenic. In March 1985 she was re-admitted to hospital
before being discharged a little under four weeks later. For the months before their death,
the children had been living with their father, although seeing their mother frequently. On 4
August 1985 (three days before the killings) Colin Caffell had taken his ex-wife and
children to spend a few days with their grandparents at the farm in Essex."

Did Collin Caffell have a watertight alibi for that night?

I think (but I'm not certain) that he lived with his then-girlfriend, Heather, so I would think his whereabouts would be confirmed by her, if they needed to be.  He drove back home from Essex to London a few days before the incident and was at home when the news was broken to him by two WPCs, who visited him.

If Jeremy did this, then Colin Caffell is the biggest surviving victim of the incident and he ought to have everybody's unqualified sympathy.  I must admit - and I feel slightly ashamed to say this - I have never been able to feel complete sympathy for him, though.  I'm not sure why.  I can't put my finger on it, but I've never taken to him.  I have always thought there is something fundamentally disingenuous about him. 

But a murderer?  No.  No way.  Impressions aside, he had no motive at all, I think he loved the twins, and he did not have (nor does he have) any significant mental health issues, to anyone's knowledge.  Has he any knowledge of or association with guns at all or even ever fired a gun?  I'd be surprised.  He's just a normal man caught up in it, and quite genial.  I struggle to even imagine him losing his temper, never mind murdering anybody.

New angles are welcome, though, so if you have one, let's hear it.  Putting my legal hat on, I would take great care when making novel accusations against specific surviving individuals.  It's one thing to 'do a Mike' and say David Boutflour was the Hunched Man, or whatever - I doubt the English libel courts will be much interested, either way - it's quite another thing to accuse a harmless, genial, naive sculptor who's done generous rehabilitation work in prison with lifers of being a murderer himself.

[APRIL]

I think (but I'm not certain) that he lived with his then-girlfriend, Heather, so I would think his whereabouts would be confirmed by her, if they needed to be.  He drove back home from Essex to London a few days before the incident and was at home when the news was broken to him by two WPCs, who visited him.

If Jeremy did this, then Colin Caffell is the biggest surviving victim of the incident and he ought to have everybody's unqualified sympathy.  I must admit - and I feel slightly ashamed to say this - I have never been able to feel complete sympathy for him, though.  I'm not sure why.  I can't put my finger on it, but I've never taken to him.  I have always thought there is something fundamentally disingenuous about him. 

But a murderer?  No.  No way.  Impressions aside, he had no motive at all, I think he loved the twins, and he did not have (nor does he have) any significant mental health issues, to anyone's knowledge.  Has he any knowledge of or association with guns at all or even ever fired a gun?  He's just a normal man caught up in it, and quite genial.  I struggle to even imagine him losing his temper, never mind murdering anybody.

New angles are welcome, though, so if you have one, let's hear it.  Putting my legal hat on, I would take great care when making novel accusations against specific surviving individuals.  It's one thing to 'do a Mike' and say David Boutflour was the Hunched Man, or whatever - I doubt the English libel courts will be much interested, either way - it's quite another thing to accuse a harmless, genial, naive sculptor who's done generous rehabilitation work in prison with lifers of being a murderer himself.

Beautifully insightful, Brancher

[Brancher]

Beautifully insightful, Brancher

That's kind, thank you, but I feel slightly ashamed of myself for not completely taking to him, given that he has been horribly victimised here.  He's a man who, in every facet of his being, cries out to be liked, but I can't like him.  Is there something wrong with me or have my spidey-senses picked up something off-key about him?  I tend to be right in my 'gut' judgement about people, for reasons I won't go into. 

But he's not a fundamentally bad man, let alone a murderer, I'm convinced of that.  Indeed, the very question is surely superfluous.

[Vertigo Swirl]

There’s thinking out of the box, and then there’s just plain absurdity.  Can we not do this?  Hasn’t the man suffered enough without being put in the frame for murders he very clearly and obviously had nothing to do with?

[APRIL]

That's kind, thank you, but I feel slightly ashamed of myself for not completely taking to him, given that he has been horribly victimised here.  He's a man who, in every facet of his being, cries out to be liked, but I can't like him.  Is there something wrong with me or have my spidey-senses picked up something off-key about him?  I tend to be right in my 'gut' judgement about people, for reasons I won't go into. 

But he's not a fundamentally bad man, let alone a murderer, I'm convinced of that.  Indeed, the very question is surely superfluous.

Is it possible that you've picked up that he wasn't a comfortable fit with the Bambers? I don't see him as a "man's man", but rather, aesthetic types with esoteric interests. I imagine him to have been a loving, gentle, and rather lenient father. I can't help but feel that, had it not been for her background, which I think she was at odds with, they may have been a good match.