Author Topic: Who was the Irish teenager who saw Gerry and Jez talking?  (Read 86521 times)

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Offline Miss Taken Identity

Re: Who was the Irish teenager who saw Gerry and Jez talking?
« Reply #135 on: March 26, 2015, 12:47:47 AM »
The 14 year old girl & her father weren't on the OC guest list according to the press report.
It makes me chuckle (sorry) to think that the PJ could have used 2 Irish girls of 12 & 14 yrs as prime witnesses in a case against the McCanns. What were they thinking?

Why is age a reason for chuckling? children can be great witnesses ask Aprils family! or is it because they are Irish?  I get the feeling no one here likes the Smiths or their testimony. I wonder why that is. He could very well be  the alleged abductor  OR an accomplice OR a innocent person, or a witness in some way.

Let's rubbish him as well because SY are looking for an abductor we are told...they also say Smithman is a person of interest...Hmmmm confused .com  they jump into these anomalies feet first them 'believers'
'Never underestimate the power of stupid people'... George Carlin

Offline G-Unit

Re: Who was the Irish teenager who saw Gerry and Jez talking?
« Reply #136 on: March 26, 2015, 01:04:35 AM »
Why is age a reason for chuckling? children can be great witnesses ask Aprils family! or is it because they are Irish?  I get the feeling no one here likes the Smiths or their testimony. I wonder why that is. He could very well be  the alleged abductor  OR an accomplice OR a innocent person, or a witness in some way.

Let's rubbish him as well because SY are looking for an abductor we are told...they also say Smithman is a person of interest...Hmmmm confused .com  they jump into these anomalies feet first them 'believers'

Probably better witnesses than adults who had perhaps drink taken. Stop with the 'believers', will you? I keep singing that song of the Monkees;

'now I'm a believer
Not a trace of doubt in my mind.'   

or the composer's version;
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K22e3AcJe64
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Offline misty

Re: Who was the Irish teenager who saw Gerry and Jez talking?
« Reply #137 on: March 26, 2015, 01:25:54 AM »
Why is age a reason for chuckling? children can be great witnesses ask Aprils family! or is it because they are Irish?  I get the feeling no one here likes the Smiths or their testimony. I wonder why that is. He could very well be  the alleged abductor  OR an accomplice OR a innocent person, or a witness in some way.

Let's rubbish him as well because SY are looking for an abductor we are told...they also say Smithman is a person of interest...Hmmmm confused .com  they jump into these anomalies feet first them 'believers'

I agree children can be great witnesses. They can also be easily manipulated.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3006894/The-yummy-mummy-satanic-sex-cult-smears-terrorised-swish-suburb-Yoga-teacher-forced-children-make-false-abuse-allegations-against-teachers-priests-father.html

Offline G-Unit

Re: Who was the Irish teenager who saw Gerry and Jez talking?
« Reply #138 on: March 26, 2015, 01:29:27 AM »
I agree children can be great witnesses. They can also be easily manipulated.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3006894/The-yummy-mummy-satanic-sex-cult-smears-terrorised-swish-suburb-Yoga-teacher-forced-children-make-false-abuse-allegations-against-teachers-priests-father.html

Are you suggesting that the PJ might manipulate a child witness? do you think they would interview them without an adult? They didn't interview Kate McCann alone!
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Offline misty

Re: Who was the Irish teenager who saw Gerry and Jez talking?
« Reply #139 on: March 26, 2015, 01:42:50 AM »
Are you suggesting that the PJ might manipulate a child witness? do you think they would interview them without an adult? They didn't interview Kate McCann alone!

The PJ as an official body would not attempt to manipulate a child witness imo.

Offline faithlilly

Re: Who was the Irish teenager who saw Gerry and Jez talking?
« Reply #140 on: March 26, 2015, 06:03:22 AM »
Because the consensus view is that the alarm was raised earlier.  Why do you think lots of people were mistaken and only one of them correct?

What consensus view ? The witness times vary from 9.30 to 10.13 so Gerry could be as correct as anyone else.
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Alfred R Jones

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Re: Who was the Irish teenager who saw Gerry and Jez talking?
« Reply #141 on: March 26, 2015, 08:53:54 AM »
What consensus view ? The witness times vary from 9.30 to 10.13 so Gerry could be as correct as anyone else.
Why don't you jot down all the different times mentioned in witness statements and see if there is any consensus view.  Also, what time for the alarm being raised is in the PT AG's final report?

Offline Carana

Re: Who was the Irish teenager who saw Gerry and Jez talking?
« Reply #142 on: March 26, 2015, 08:55:12 AM »
Looks like we have reached the end of the road with the "Irish teenager" thingy and we are yet again veering to wards the "Bash the McCanns" thingy - as we always seem do.

So what momentous conclusions have we reached?

Did or did she not exist?

If she did ... who was she?

If she did not exist ... who invented her ... and for what purpose?

The girl alluded to is clearly meant to be Aoife, IMO, but it seems unlikely that she'd have walked all the way from the restaurant to near 5A for a secret ciggie in the middle of dinner. I suppose it's vaguely possible that she did see two men talking somewhere else or on a different night. However, she made no mention of any such sighting in her statement, and could have simply said she'd gone for a walk if she had. There was no mention of a man with a baby buggy, either, which would have been a fairly obvious detail to notice. There is no other Irish girl in the files who could fit the bill.

At around that time, there were rumours flying around that a security camera showed that none of the T9 had walked up that road in the relevant time frame. This was originally supposed to be an OC cctv, but it later morphed into a different building's security camera. The half-truth in that is that there was a security camera (which, by the time the police noticed it a week later, had been wiped), but it was around the Smith block. (There was also the Paraiso one, which was nowhere near Block 5 either.)

There was also much mocking during that period of numerous alleged changes in JT's descriptions and general story.

The only purpose of all that that I can see was to discredit JT because the PJ had already decided on their scenario and JT's sighting couldn't be shoe-horned into it.

As I can't find anything to substantiate the Irish ciggie girl even as a half-truth, I'll go with doesn't exist, or at the very least that the two men talking were seen elsewhere and were not Gerry and Jez outside 5A.

Offline Carana

Re: Who was the Irish teenager who saw Gerry and Jez talking?
« Reply #143 on: March 26, 2015, 09:08:37 AM »
We haven't actually been told where the efits came from. Rumour says that Oakley International included them in a dossier handed to the McCanns in 2008, and the Smith family helped to produce them. The Smith's denied this in a statement 30th Jan 2008. They may have changed their minds later, of course;

He has been contacted by Mr Brian Kennedy who is supporting the McCann family to take part in a photo fit exercise. He has given no stories or helped in any photo fits.
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/MARTIN_SMITH.htm

In the same statement he said;
I would be 60-80% sure that it was Gerard McCann that I met that night carrying a child.

 The archiving of the case in Portugal occurred around August 2008. Oakley International are supposed to have been threatened with legal action by the McCanns if they made their dossier public because it was critical of the parents. The efits didn't appear in Kate McCann's book published May 2011, and they don't appear on their website now. If the McCanns had the efits in 2008 they could have released them to the media but they choose not to, allegedly because Jane Tanner's sighting was being promoted and releasing more efits would have confused the issue.

Personally, I prefer to take that Sunday Times article with a pinch of salt. Some of it may be true, other details may be false, inaccurate or misleading. There is no way of knowing, either, whether the apology / correction printed (which is often conveniently forgotten) is complete or the barest minimum. The paper was successfully sued for £55,000, which went to charity.

Offline G-Unit

Re: Who was the Irish teenager who saw Gerry and Jez talking?
« Reply #144 on: March 26, 2015, 09:11:56 AM »
Why don't you jot down all the different times mentioned in witness statements and see if there is any consensus view.  Also, what time for the alarm being raised is in the PT AG's final report?

The first reported time is 21.20;

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/TIME_LINE_INFORMATION.htm
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Offline Mr Gray

Re: Who was the Irish teenager who saw Gerry and Jez talking?
« Reply #145 on: March 26, 2015, 09:15:11 AM »
The first reported time is 21.20;

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/TIME_LINE_INFORMATION.htm

again it shows how unreliable witness recall is ...

Offline Carana

Re: Who was the Irish teenager who saw Gerry and Jez talking?
« Reply #146 on: March 26, 2015, 09:32:14 AM »
The first reported time is 21.20;

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/TIME_LINE_INFORMATION.htm

Something I've been meaning to check, but haven't got around to is whether or not the statements mentioning an earlier time were taken by the same police officer or not. It could also be different officers using the same computer in which the earlier time was a mistaken that never got corrected (but there's no way of verifying that).

I don't have time right now, but perhaps someone interested in this issue would be able to find it faster than I could: there was at least one statement referring to someone rushing over to the Millenium restaurant at 22:xx and
a statement from someone at the Millenium stating that someone had rushed in at 21:xx + a few minutes.

Unless there is a time warp running through the middle of PdL... something may well have been incorrectly typeed up in the statements. It could be as simple as a rolling, uncorrected typo.

Another curious detail that would seem to potentially indicate a recurring typo is that quite a few of the statements tally in terms of minutes after the hour, but the hour itself is noted as either 21 or 22 hours.

Alfred R Jones

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Re: Who was the Irish teenager who saw Gerry and Jez talking?
« Reply #147 on: March 26, 2015, 09:35:42 AM »
The first reported time is 21.20;

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/TIME_LINE_INFORMATION.htm
yes, and....?  How many other witnesses concur with this time?

Offline G-Unit

Re: Who was the Irish teenager who saw Gerry and Jez talking?
« Reply #148 on: March 26, 2015, 09:39:38 AM »
Personally, I prefer to take that Sunday Times article with a pinch of salt. Some of it may be true, other details may be false, inaccurate or misleading. There is no way of knowing, either, whether the apology / correction printed (which is often conveniently forgotten) is complete or the barest minimum. The paper was successfully sued for £55,000, which went to charity.

Did I quote a Sunday Times article?
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Offline G-Unit

Re: Who was the Irish teenager who saw Gerry and Jez talking?
« Reply #149 on: March 26, 2015, 09:42:46 AM »
yes, and....?  How many other witnesses concur with this time?

We used to say 'what did your last servant die of' when I was young. May I suggest you read the link and then you'll know.
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