The Smith sighting revisited.

[John]

What if SY do find that smithman was an innocent portuguese dad with his own daughter.
It would instantly demolish all the smithman abductor theories and all the smithman occulter theories, and all carrying in arms through the streets theories, period.

Well they 'think' they have found Tannerman but even then they aren't positive so the outlook for anything positive coming from SY as far as Smithman is concerned is frankly not good.  They have lost the momentum in PdL now which is a really bad sign that things aren't going too smoothly for them.  The Portuguese are becoming weary of it all again so I fear nil progress from now on and another shelving.

[pathfinder73]

I prefer studying the actual moving methods used in prior (and later) cases.

Have you found any two moves of a dead body at different times to keep an alibi? Saw one on sky last week. Couldn't dispose the body until his flat mates got back and went to sleep. They gave him his alibi for being in the flat.

[Brietta]

Well they 'think' they have found Tannerman but even then they aren't positive so the outlook for anything positive coming from SY as far as Smithman is concerned is frankly not good.  They have lost the momentum in PdL now which is a really bad sign that things aren't going too smoothly for them.  The Portuguese are becoming weary of it all again so I fear nil progress from now on and another shelving.

I think the way to progress the case is through joint working; I believe the Met would like to do just that but the Portuguese are resistant.  I think the momentum was lost long ago and the continued chaos in the Portuguese legal system would seem to negate progress in the near future.
If the Portuguese are trying to reinforce negativity regarding their policing they are certainly going the right way about it ... which is doing law enforcement in the country a disservice. 

[John]

I think the way to progress the case is through joint working; I believe the Met would like to do just that but the Portuguese are resistant.  I think the momentum was lost long ago and the continued chaos in the Portuguese legal system would seem to negate progress in the near future.
If the Portuguese are trying to reinforce negativity regarding their policing they are certainly going the right way about it ... which is doing law enforcement in the country a disservice.

I think there is a big divide in what the Portuguese believe compared to SY and that inevitably is causing a big problem.  You can't have cooperation when both parties are on different pages, it simply won't work.  The other difficulty is the differing legal systems and believing one size will fit all just won't cut it.

There is definitely something sinister in the Smith sighting and that is why Redwood has zeroed in on it in the way in which he has done.  An innocent Smithman has failed to come forward even after all the publicity that has gone out and that in itself is indicative that something just isn't as it should be.

Strange though it is, Amaral too was convinced that Smithman was his man and spent time investigating derelict properties and gardens near to where the Smith family saw him that night.

[Brietta]

Just a couple of thoughts regarding the Smith family sighting of a man carrying a child on the night of the 3rd may 2007.

In Martin Smith’s first statement he definitely excluded Robert Murat as being the man he saw.

In his second statement he definitely identified Dr Gerry McCann as being the man he saw.

His description of the man he saw and the child is remarkably similar to Jane Tanner’s description of the man she witnessed carrying a child, down to the words used; in fact one would not have been surprised had Mr Smith had sight of Jane Tanner’s statement.

Richard McCluskey also gave a further statement to the Police when he thought that he recognised Dr Gerald McCann descending aeroplane steps carrying his son: remarkably the words in Martin Smith’s amended statement mirror almost exactly the words in Richard McCluskey's.
 
The dates when these four statements were made are interesting.

04th May 2007   Jane Tanner          ~          26th May 2007 Martin Smith

12th September  Richard McCluskey    ~    20th September Martin Smith

[sadie]

Just a couple of thoughts regarding the Smith family sighting of a man carrying a child on the night of the 3rd may 2007.

In Martin Smith’s first statement he definitely excluded Robert Murat as being the man he saw.

In his second statement he definitely identified Dr Gerry McCann as being the man he saw.

His description of the man he saw and the child is remarkably similar to Jane Tanner’s description of the man she witnessed carrying a child, down to the words used; in fact one would not have been surprised had Mr Smith had sight of Jane Tanner’s statement.

Richard McCluskey also gave a further statement to the Police when he thought that he recognised Dr Gerald McCann descending aeroplane steps carrying his son: remarkably the words in Martin Smith’s amended statement mirror almost exactly the words in Richard McCluskey's.
 
The dates when these four statements were made are interesting.

04th May 2007   Jane Tanner          ~          26th May 2007 Martin Smith

12th September  Richard McCluskey    ~    20th September Martin Smith

Are you wondering "phoney statements"?  Cos I believe that I found a very phoney processos by Portimao PJ.  In fact it had, IIRC, 5 inaccuracies ( and I am being polite calling them inaccuracies) in it .... and appeared to be directing the searchers eye away from what actually happened to Madeleine.

Unfortunately with my inability to post GE images, I dont think I will be able to explain it properly.  I can email GEarth images to trusted peeps, but am unable to post them on forums sadly/.

[pegasus]

@Brietta, yes the words in the september statements of Smith and of McClusky are very similar, because they both had made the same (incorrect) identification based on the same TV news airport footage.  The latter even claimed to  recognise (despite the obvious clue that he had heard her speaking fluent portuguese with a ukranian accent) the woman he saw as KM, by facial recognition (cheekbone structure etc). IMO both witnesses were completely well-intentioned, but mistaken.

[Brietta]

@Brietta, yes the words in the september statements of Smith and of McClusky are very similar, because they both had made the same (incorrect) identification based on the same TV news airport footage.  The latter even claimed to  recognise (despite the obvious clue that he had heard her speaking fluent portuguese with a ukranian accent) the woman he saw as KM, by facial recognition (cheekbone structure etc). IMO both witnesses were completely well-intentioned, but mistaken.

It is the timing of the events that concerns me.

Why did Martin Smith wait so long before contacting the police to provide an alibi for Robert Murat?

Why did he wait so long before contacting the police to implicate Dr McCann with a report of exactly the same alleged 'sighting' as Mr McCluskey ... at a time when Mr McCluskey's sighting had been dismissed?

04th May 2007   Jane Tanner          ~        26th May 2007 Martin Smith

12th September  Richard McCluskey    ~    20th September Martin Smith

The dates just do not bear scrutiny ... and 'inconsistency' is not the immediate word which springs into my mind.

[pegasus]

M.Smith contacted the police before May 26th.

[Brietta]

M.Smith contacted the police before May 26th.

Where is that recorded?

[pegasus]

Where is that recorded?

I don't have the page number here but IIRC the documents are in the files.
He reported to the Garda in Ireland and it took some days to get the three of them over to Portimao for the May 26th interview

[Anna]

Where is that recorded?

cant see it in the files, but a couple of other places say he reported it on the 16th


16 May 2007

Martin Smith reports his sighting to the Portuguese Police
http://whathappenedtomadeleinemccann.blogspot.co.uk/2013/11/martin-smith-timeline-from-3-may-2007.html

[Brietta]

cant see it in the files, but a couple of other places say he reported it on the 16th


16 May 2007

Martin Smith reports his sighting to the Portuguese Police
http://whathappenedtomadeleinemccann.blogspot.co.uk/2013/11/martin-smith-timeline-from-3-may-2007.html

Still quite a delay when one considers that this was a case concerning a missing child - Jane Tanner's account was known on the 4th May ... I note from that particular blog that it is asserted that she had IDd Robert Murat, as we know that is untrue.

I think that my criticism of the delay in the first report and the ammended report still stand and that the first statement was made to alibi Robert Murat.

[pegasus]

cant see it in the files, but a couple of other places say he reported it on the 16th


16 May 2007

Martin Smith reports his sighting to the Portuguese Police
http://whathappenedtomadeleinemccann.blogspot.co.uk/2013/11/martin-smith-timeline-from-3-may-2007.html

Thanks Anna.
BTW as the Smith sighting appears to be central to most abduction and non-abduction theories, it is a shame that Mr Amaral's plan to fly the these witnesses to Portugal again in the first week of Oct 2007 was not carried out.

[faithlilly]

It's interesting that when Tony Bennett suggests there was something dubious about Martin Smith's sighting he was quite rightly ridiculed for such an idea but when certain supporters suggest the self same thing on this very forum the silence is deafening.