Ballistic analyses relating to Nevill and June Bamber.

[Myster]

This raises a very interesting point in relation to Sheila because if she had been shot where she was found the shell casings would have ended up on the bed and NOT on the floor either side of her head??

Bamber was crouched/kneeling holding the rifle horizontal, level with the mattress side(s), and pointing at Sheila who was sitting upright. The first shot tracks straight through her neck to fracture the fourth vertebra. The shell casing hits the mattress side (maybe the bedside cabinet as well) and bounces off landing on her right-side (DRH1). Sheila falls back. Bamber, still crouched fires again, this time with the rifle nearly parallel with her body so that the bullet travels directly into the brain. Shell casing again hits the mattress side but is cushioned more than the first and lands in the corner on Sheila's left-side (DRH2).

I rest my case. 

[John]

PS I'm pretty certain in the other picture of where the casings were found both next to SC were over to her right?

You mean this one?   DRH1 is well away from where it should have ended up unless Sheila was first shot nearer the bottom of the bed.

[John]

Bamber was crouched/kneeling holding the rifle horizontal, level with the mattress side(s), and pointing at Sheila who was sitting upright. The first shot tracks straight through her neck to fracture the fourth vertebra. The shell casing hits the mattress side (maybe the bedside cabinet as well) and bounces off landing on her right-side (DRH1). Sheila falls back. Bamber, still crouched fires again, this time with the rifle nearly parallel with her body so that the bullet travels directly into the brain. Shell casing again hits the mattress side but is cushioned more than the first and lands in the corner on Sheila's left-side (DRH2).

I rest my case. 

Its all possible certainly, I don't think we will ever know for sure.

Mystery, do you agree about the casings found near June?

[Passer-by]

Bamber was crouched/kneeling holding the rifle horizontal, level with the mattress side(s), and pointing at Sheila who was sitting upright. The first shot tracks straight through her neck to fracture the fourth vertebra. The shell casing hits the mattress side (maybe the bedside cabinet as well) and bounces off landing on her right-side (DRH1). Sheila falls back. Bamber, still crouched fires again, this time with the rifle nearly parallel with her body so that the bullet travels directly into the brain. Shell casing again hits the mattress side but is cushioned more than the first and lands in the corner on Sheila's left-side (DRH2).

I rest my case. 

Not at all:  one of the theories I put forward was that the gun could have been on its side to be comfortable to fire - as it is in the photographs.  Then the casings would have ejected up into the air and down.  If he was staging it and she was co-operating I don't think he'd have her on the floor by the bed, he'd have her by June or in the bed, or in her own bed.  The place she was found was too odd for a staged murder, but had the randomness of spontaneity and fits with the fact that bible lived in that bedside table, and presumably she wanted to read it.

I can't believe SC sat still for all that either, it has so much less probability than her doing it herself.  To take that further, right-handed people tend to shoot themselves on the right hand side of their body, left-handed on the left - SC's wounds are to the right side of her throat:  another small detail a murderer wouldn't have thought if.  And female suicides tend more to shooting in the neck rather than the mouth or temple, which both disfigure the face.

[Passer-by]

You mean this one?   DRH1 is well away from where it should have ended up unless Sheila was first shot nearer the bottom of the bed.

Thank you, yes:  actually DRH1 is where it should be for a suicide.

[Passer-by]

Tappity-tap:  you're all ignoring my double-shot suicides . . .

"A fairly common problem is the apparently suicide that has fired two shots into the head. Even in the case of instantaneous death and destruction of the basal ganglia, double head shots are possible in suicides. There is a phenomenon called "cadarvic spasm" which is an intense non-specific, uncontrolled contraction of the muscles of the limbs immediately after death. This is quite capable of causing a second pulling of the trigger after death."

[Myster]

Not at all:  one of the theories I put forward was that the gun could have been on its side to be comfortable to fire - as it is in the photographs.  Then the casings would have ejected up into the air and down.  If he was staging it and she was co-operating I don't think he'd have her on the floor by the bed, he'd have her by June or in the bed, or in her own bed.  The place she was found was too odd for a staged murder, but had the randomness of spontaneity and fits with the fact that bible lived in that bedside table, and presumably she wanted to read it.

I can't believe SC sat still for all that either, it has so much less probability than her doing it herself.  To take that further, right-handed people tend to shoot themselves on the right hand side of their body, left-handed on the left - SC's wounds are to the right side of her throat:  another small detail a murderer wouldn't have thought if.  And female suicides tend more to shooting in the neck rather than the mouth or temple, which both disfigure the face.

Maybe she was crouched by the side of the bed hiding from her brother when she heard him come back upstairs from his fight with Nevill in the kitchen, and that's where he found her. She was drowsy from the Haloperidol treatment and compliant. She might even have fainted as the first neck shot was fired.

If Paul Harrison, and Bamber's flights of fantasy are to be believed then she got him to shoot her away from the twins, because she didn't want them to see her die.

The bible wasn't in Nevill's bedside table either.  June kept it on her own side.  40-15

[Myster]

Tappity-tap:  you're all ignoring my double-shot suicides . . .

"A fairly common problem is the apparently suicide that has fired two shots into the head. Even in the case of instantaneous death and destruction of the basal ganglia, double head shots are possible in suicides. There is a phenomenon called "cadarvic spasm" which is an intense non-specific, uncontrolled contraction of the muscles of the limbs immediately after death. This is quite capable of causing a second pulling of the trigger after death."

After the first neck shot the rifle would have dropped away from her body because she fell backwards and would have had to reach out for it again to realign for the second shot. She wasn't killed by the first shot, hence cadaveric spasm doesn't come into play.

[Passer-by]

After the first neck shot the rifle would have dropped away from her body because she fell backwards and would have had to reach out for it again to realign for the second shot. She wasn't killed by the first shot, hence cadaveric spasm doesn't come into play.

What's all this 'falling backwards'?  She was clearly lying straight out on the floor with her head slightly supported by the bedside cabinet.  No falling backwards, no need to realign the next shot.  After what I just posted about cadaver spasm you can't state which was the first shot 

[Passer-by]

What is more, if we go with the obvious - that she

• Was lying down - because that's how she was found
  Had the gun resting partially on its left side on her body - because that's how it was found
  Had the bullet casing land slightly forward to her right
  

It is clear that even if it wasn't cadaveric spasm it could still have been a poor first shot immediately followed by a second successful one right after -  both hands would have been grasping the gun, the left on the barrel, the right on the trigger, so it wouldn't have gone anywhere.

[Passer-by]

It's suicide.

[Myster]

What's all this 'falling backwards'?  She was clearly lying straight out on the floor with her head slightly supported by the bedside cabinet.  No falling backwards, no need to realign the next shot.  After what I just posted about cadaver spasm you can't state which was the first shot 

To clarify... she was sitting upright and her upper body fell backwards after the searing impact of the first bullet, the rifle being held almost perpendicular to her neck as Vanezis states. This pierced her jugular and shattered the vertebra, but did not kill her outright (left wound)*. The rifle would then need realigning almost parallel to her body for the bullet to travel through the hard palate straight up into the brain causing instant death (right wound)*.

The Land of Nod beckons.

*photograph view

[Myster]

... and it's Murder with a capital M.

[Holly Goodhead]

CAL P195:

"Vanezis declared in court that having taken into account the pattern of bloodstaining, 'both injuries were produced while she was slightly on her right side and partially sitting up.'

[Passer-by]

CAL P195:

"Vanezis declared in court that having taken into account the pattern of bloodstaining, 'both injuries were produced while she was slightly on her right side and partially sitting up.'

"Partially" meaning anything other than lying flat.  It's easy to see from the awkwardness of her head in the photos that her head was slightly elevated by the cabinet.