Author Topic: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.  (Read 25595 times)

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Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #450 on: March 15, 2019, 02:48:24 PM »
One of the first things that drew my attention to this case is the journeys and times which don't seem to add up.  I know the area fairly well as my Bestie is an Essex girl from Gidea Park who has lived in Brentwood for many years. 

Going from Nicholls wit stat above he met with Steele at Marks Tey and they were shortly joined by Whomes.  The trio then headed for South Essex.  Steele drove his Red Toyota Hi-Lux with Nicholls as passenger and Whomes drove his beige VW Passat.  They arrive at a lay-by near the Halfway House pub, Brentwood, Nicholls joined Whomes in the Passat as driver.  They then drove to the actual Halfway House pub and waited for the Range Rover to arrive carrying the murdered trio.  Steele then joins the Range Rover?  Nicholls drives Whomes to Rettendon.  Is Nicholls saying Steele followed the Range Rover to the Hungry Horse/Travellers Joy at Rayleigh where Steele joined the Range Rover and they travelled to Rettendon or Steele joined the Range Rover and they travelled directly to Rettendon with Steele leaving his Toyota at the Halfway House?   After the murders the Beige Passat carrying Steele and Whomes with Nicholls driving travels to the Hungry Horse where Nicholls and Steele leave Whomes in the Passat and get into Steele's Hi-Lux.

Nicholls claims he was told by Steele the purpose of the visit to South Essex was to complete a drug deal with Tate.  He does not give any other explanations for journeys ie collecting/dropping others, collecting/dropping off drugs and/or making detours/alternative routes to avoid police/cctv etc.  Without further explanations the above doesn't make any sense.  According to all accounts Rolfe left Lakeside to collect Tucker from Fobbing and Tate from Basildon.  According to Nicholls, Steele had devised a plan to lure the murdered trio to Rettendon for execution.  Why would all 6 go out of their way to Halfway House?  Why then bother with Rayleigh?  What was the purpose of all these out of the way car journeys?  I can only think it was something Essex Police devised to account for the phone calls. 

If they were all being economical with these journeys, and why wouldn't they unless they were sightseeing, then it would make sense for Nicholls to have travelled alone to North Chelmsford to meet with Steele and Whomes there.  They could then swap cars and arrange to meet with the murdered trio around South Chelmsford. 

Can anyone work out why all concerned would go out of their way to Brentwood and Rayleigh?

Here's a map of Essex.  All concerned wanted to arrive at Rettendon and no explanations have been given for detours.  Home addresses as follows:

- Nicholls - Braintree, Essex
- Steele - Great Bentley, Essex
- Whomes - Brockford, Suffolk
- Rolfe - Chafford Hundred, Essex
- Tucker - Fobbing, Essex
- Tate - Basildon, Essex

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.6840984,0.4797434,11z

Unless the geography was spelled out to judge and jurors they might well be none the wiser thinking all the trips above were necessary when they were not and no explanations have been given to account for them.

Nicholls claimed he met with Steele at Marks Tey where Whomes joined them.  Nicholls left his car at Marks Tey and they travelled in convoy to South Essex.  It would make sense for Whomes and Steele to meet at Marks Tey as this is en route to South Essex (and Central/East Essex via the A12.  However it wouldn't make sense for Nicholls to drive to Marks Tey from Braintree to then travel to South Essex (and Central/East Essex).  He would travel down the A131 and then connect with the A12. 

During Nicholls police interviews he said he begrudged driving out of his way especially when he was getting up for work early and driving.  So if Steele said to Nicholls we're meeting with Tate (South Essex) then why not say to Steele ok we'll meet some place where the A131/0 and A/12 interesect?  They could swap cars at this point with Nicholls/Whomes following Steele to meet with the murdered trio. 

Why would Nicholls/Steele/Whomes and Rolfe/Tate/Tucker go to Brentwood/Rayleigh.  All these journey times could be cut by half if Nicholls/Steele/Whomes swapped cars at say Great Baddow and then met with Rolfe/Tate/Tucker at say Sandon for onward travel to Rettendon. 

For anyone unfamiliar with the geography basically Whomes was travelling from Suffolk entering North Essex.  Nicholls and Steele travelling from North Essex.  All then travelled to SW Essex but according to Nicholls they wanted to end up at soc which is central/East Essex.  The murdered trio are all from South Essex.  They basically travelled to SW Essex when according to Nicholls they were being lured to central/East Essex.  The journeys makes no sense and I can only assume they were created to account for the tel calls ie Steele at Bulphan and Tate at Wickford.

Afaik the murdered trio were Essex born and bred.  Nicholls travelled long distances with his work.  And we're told the architect of all this was Steele who was capable of driving RIBs (is that correct term, driving?) and flying planes so one would expect and hope his navigational skills were reasonably good.  What then was the reason for all these out of the way trips, wasting time and money, if not to cover the cell phone analysis?
« Last Edit: March 15, 2019, 03:02:55 PM by Holly Goodhead »
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Sir David Attenborough added: "They always mean beautiful things like hummingbirds. I always reply by saying that I think of a little child in east Africa with a worm burrowing through his eyeball. The worm cannot live in any other way, except by burrowing through eyeballs. I find that hard to reconcile with the notion of a divine and benevolent creator."

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #451 on: March 15, 2019, 02:57:15 PM »
Unless the geography was spelled out to judge and jurors they might well be none the wiser thinking all the trips above were necessary when they were not and no explanations have been given to account for them.

Nicholls claimed he met with Steele at Marks Tey where Whomes joined them.  Nicholls left his car at Marks Tey and they travelled in convoy to South Essex.  It would make sense for Whomes and Steele to meet at Marks Tey as this is en route to South Essex (and Central/East Essex via the A12.  However it wouldn't make sense for Nicholls to drive to Marks Tey from Braintree to then travel to South Essex (and Central/East Essex).  He would travel down the A131 and then connect with the A12. 

During Nicholls police interviews he said he begrudged driving out of his way especially when he was getting up for work early and driving.  So if Steele said to Nicholls we're meeting with Tate (South Essex) then why not say to Steele ok we'll meet some place where the A131/0 and A/12 interesect?  They could swap cars at this point with Nicholls/Whomes following Steele to meet with the murdered trio. 

Why would Nicholls/Steele/Whomes and Rolfe/Tate/Tucker go to Brentwood/Rayleigh.  All these journey times could be cut by half if Nicholls/Steele/Whomes swapped cars at say Great Baddow and then met with Rolfe/Tate/Tucker at say Sandon for onward travel to Rettendon. 

For anyone unfamiliar with the geography basically Whomes was travelling from Suffolk entering North Essex.  Nicholls and Steele travelling from North Essex.  All then travelled to SE Essex but according to Nicholls they wanted to end up at soc which is central/East Essex.  The murdered trio are all from South Essex.  They basically travelled to SE Essex when according to Nicholls they were being lured to central/East Essex.  The journeys makes no sense and I can only assume they were created to account for the tel calls ie Steele at Bulphan and Tate at Wickford.

Afaik the murdered trio were Essex born and bred.  Nicholls travelled long distances with his work.  And we're told the architect of all this was Steele who was capable of driving RIBs (is that correct term, driving?) and flying planes so one would expect and hope his navigational skills were reasonably good.  What then was the reason for all these out of the way trips, wasting time and money, if not to cover the cell phone analysis?

Oh yeah and I just remembered Nicholls said in Bloggs 19, authored By Tony Thompson, his life of crime started  by breaking into pay phone boxes all over Essex so one would think he might be reasonably offay with the county and its road network!? 
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Sir David Attenborough added: "They always mean beautiful things like hummingbirds. I always reply by saying that I think of a little child in east Africa with a worm burrowing through his eyeball. The worm cannot live in any other way, except by burrowing through eyeballs. I find that hard to reconcile with the notion of a divine and benevolent creator."

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #452 on: March 15, 2019, 04:07:23 PM »
The prosecution claim the murdered trio were lured to Rettendon by tales of scoping out a potential landing drop for a plane load of cocaine.  If this was the case the natural question would be to ask the location.  For those born, bred and still residing in South Essex, Rettendon would not be some far flung place they were incapable of finding.  And if they met Steele at the Halfway House pub, Brentwood (SE Essex) or Travellers Joy at Rayleigh (SW Essex) they would think it really odd that Steele had chosen to drive so far into South Essex from North Essex and/or drag the murdered trio to Brentwood (SW Essex) and/or Rayleigh (SE Essex) only to then travel to central/East Essex.  All the men I've ever known take great pride in getting from A to B as quickly as possible! 

It makes no sense!  If it happened as the prosecution claim Steele would meet with the murdered trio somewhere around central/East Essex.  Steele would then be driving from North Essex to central/East Essex and the murdered trio from South Essex to central/East Essex.

Did the defence challenge Nicholls on this aspect of his testimony and/or produce any interactive maps showing all these unexplained and out of the way car journeys?

 
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Sir David Attenborough added: "They always mean beautiful things like hummingbirds. I always reply by saying that I think of a little child in east Africa with a worm burrowing through his eyeball. The worm cannot live in any other way, except by burrowing through eyeballs. I find that hard to reconcile with the notion of a divine and benevolent creator."

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #453 on: March 18, 2019, 04:52:52 PM »
A YouTuber produces informative vids about the case.  Here's a recent one re location:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLFvwc14w78&t=2126s

I was wondering if it might have been possible to drive an off-road 4 x 4 along Workhouse Lane from the Wheatsheaf pub and/or White House Farm.  Having had another look at the ordnance survey map

https://osmaps.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/51.64225,0.55855,16/pin

there appears to be a track from WHF to soc.  It appears from the Guardian article this is the route Peter Theobald and Ken Jiggins took in the morning to feed the pheasants.

https://www.theguardian.com/theguardian/1996/mar/07/fromthearchive

The article also states the pheasants are fed twice a day which chimes with farmer friends one of whom I know in the winter usually goes late afternoon/early evening. 

The perp wasn't a stupid person.  He (most likely a he) would know White House Farm and the adjacent area was visited by others: farmer, fishermen, shooters, dog walkers so I think the perp or his associates must have carried out recces on the location to ensure they were not going to be disturbed.  And/or was a lookout involved and/or did cars cover the entrances/exits to prevent anyone gaining access for a short period of time?  All vehicles used could have been stolen and/or sold/purchased with false papers/plates eg Marshall who sold Noye his Land Rover with false name/paper.

Did Whomes actually visit the Wheatsheaf pub car park or is this a red herring?  Whomes has apparently passed 26 City and Guild exams in prison and taught himself to read and write so clearly not an idiot but if at the time he was somewhat naive during his police interviews (there's no evidence he was a career criminal in the way Steele was) and was unable to read and write and the police put it to him his phone placed him at Workhouse Lane he might well have cracked under pressure and said he was in a pub in the area picking up Nicholls car.  This then morphs into the Wheatsheaf pub when in reality it may have been some other pub miles away.  We know the cell phone analysis is not capable of pinpointing someone's location to within even a few miles let alone a few hundred meters.  Once he commits to being at the Wheatsheaf pub he's stuffed whether he was there or not.

Imo they were def all on drugs related business but I would rule out Steele and Whomes as perps based on the efficiency of the shootings which have all the hallmarks of someone trained by the military or police.
« Last Edit: March 18, 2019, 06:07:07 PM by Holly Goodhead »
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Sir David Attenborough added: "They always mean beautiful things like hummingbirds. I always reply by saying that I think of a little child in east Africa with a worm burrowing through his eyeball. The worm cannot live in any other way, except by burrowing through eyeballs. I find that hard to reconcile with the notion of a divine and benevolent creator."

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #454 on: March 18, 2019, 05:06:50 PM »
Here's a vid of farmer Peter Theobald shooting a wood pigeon:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6XAsQA85FU

No I'm not suggesting PT was responsible.  This type of shooting in terms of accuracy, skill etc is completely different from taking out 3 adult males at close range ambush style. 

I would say the perp was more along the lines of police marksman Tony Long (and I'm not suggesting him either).  or a member of the SAS/Iranian embassy siege or SEAL/Bin Laden.  This is the type of person psychologically and with this level of skill.   

https://www.theguardian.com/tv-and-radio/2016/aug/19/tony-long-secrets-of-a-police-marksman-channel-4-review

Judge Hidden or the expert I can't recall now said it was a given, or words to this effect, the perp was well versed with the firearm.  This is an understatement imo as it implies the perp simply knew how to operate it and downplays the skill required to take out the the murdered trio in the manner they were killed. 
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Sir David Attenborough added: "They always mean beautiful things like hummingbirds. I always reply by saying that I think of a little child in east Africa with a worm burrowing through his eyeball. The worm cannot live in any other way, except by burrowing through eyeballs. I find that hard to reconcile with the notion of a divine and benevolent creator."

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #455 on: March 18, 2019, 06:30:39 PM »
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=6020.msg510060#msg510060

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=6020.msg510061#msg510061

I have read the above through several times now and I think the thing that stands out for me is that there's no mention of tyre tracks other than at some stage someone had driven beyond the gate.  This is hardly surprising given Peter Theobald and Ken Jiggins had undoubtedly fed the pheasants the day before. 

There's numerous references to footprints around the Range Rover but nothing about tyre tracks?  Is the reason for this that first respondents made errors in that they drove down the track towards the soc destroying evidence?  And/or did Peter Theobald and Ken Jiggins leave soc by the main road?  Even so you would think a partial tyre pattern could be distinguished?
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Sir David Attenborough added: "They always mean beautiful things like hummingbirds. I always reply by saying that I think of a little child in east Africa with a worm burrowing through his eyeball. The worm cannot live in any other way, except by burrowing through eyeballs. I find that hard to reconcile with the notion of a divine and benevolent creator."

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #456 on: March 18, 2019, 10:11:34 PM »
And thinking further about the links above there's no mention of footprints other than those around the Range Rover.  We know for sure Peter Theobald and Ken Jiggins went up to the Range Rover.  Thereafter first respondents also went up to the Range Rover.  But there's no mention of footprints along any tracks?  If, as the prosecution claim, Whomes arrived by foot and left by foot along with Steele where are the footprints?  I can't see any evidence that the snow was so deep that footprints/tyre tracks melted away.  The track was somewhat sheltered by the hedges either side.  No real explanation has been provided.  In the link above it states an officer flagged up that soc was changing due to a rise in temperature but surely first respondents would take this into account when first arriving and ensure any footprints/tyre tracks in snow were preserved?
Women's World Cup 2019 Trailer THIS IS THE WOMEN'S WORLD CUP // ⚽️🔥💯

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Sir David Attenborough added: "They always mean beautiful things like hummingbirds. I always reply by saying that I think of a little child in east Africa with a worm burrowing through his eyeball. The worm cannot live in any other way, except by burrowing through eyeballs. I find that hard to reconcile with the notion of a divine and benevolent creator."

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #457 on: March 20, 2019, 04:38:00 PM »
A YouTuber produces informative vids about the case.  Here's a recent one re location:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lLFvwc14w78&t=2126s

I was wondering if it might have been possible to drive an off-road 4 x 4 along Workhouse Lane from the Wheatsheaf pub and/or White House Farm.  Having had another look at the ordnance survey map

https://osmaps.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/51.64225,0.55855,16/pin

there appears to be a track from WHF to soc.  It appears from the Guardian article this is the route Peter Theobald and Ken Jiggins took in the morning to feed the pheasants.

https://www.theguardian.com/theguardian/1996/mar/07/fromthearchive

The article also states the pheasants are fed twice a day which chimes with farmer friends one of whom I know in the winter usually goes late afternoon/early evening. 

The perp wasn't a stupid person.  He (most likely a he) would know White House Farm and the adjacent area was visited by others: farmer, fishermen, shooters, dog walkers so I think the perp or his associates must have carried out recces on the location to ensure they were not going to be disturbed.  And/or was a lookout involved and/or did cars cover the entrances/exits to prevent anyone gaining access for a short period of time?  All vehicles used could have been stolen and/or sold/purchased with false papers/plates eg Marshall who sold Noye his Land Rover with false name/paper.

Did Whomes actually visit the Wheatsheaf pub car park or is this a red herring?  Whomes has apparently passed 26 City and Guild exams in prison and taught himself to read and write so clearly not an idiot but if at the time he was somewhat naive during his police interviews (there's no evidence he was a career criminal in the way Steele was) and was unable to read and write and the police put it to him his phone placed him at Workhouse Lane he might well have cracked under pressure and said he was in a pub in the area picking up Nicholls car.  This then morphs into the Wheatsheaf pub when in reality it may have been some other pub miles away.  We know the cell phone analysis is not capable of pinpointing someone's location to within even a few miles let alone a few hundred meters.  Once he commits to being at the Wheatsheaf pub he's stuffed whether he was there or not.

Imo they were def all on drugs related business but I would rule out Steele and Whomes as perps based on the efficiency of the shootings which have all the hallmarks of someone trained by the military or police.

Just to clarify where I have talked above about the possibility of Whomes not actually visiting the Wheatsheaf pub on night of murders, I suggested he may have been at another pub when in fact I meant to say he may well have been some other place in the area not necessarily a pub.  Some will probably think 'Oh come now Holly the guy committed to being at the Wheatsheaf pub what more evidence do you want'?  Whomes was not a career/hardened criminal.  His greatest crime convicted of prior to his current conviction was a sentence of months for car fraud.  I'm not sure what that involved but it is obviously wasn't serious based on the length of sentence served in a Cat C prison.  If he's innocent and found himself in the frame for murder he may well have cracked during police interviews.  I can see how underhand the police can be in interviews not just this case but other cases too.  Also bearing in mind as I said apparently Whomes was unable to read and write at the time.  If the police showed him a map highlighting the soc and said we know your phone was used along Workhouse Lane (they knew no such thing as it isn't that accurate) he may well have said I was in a local pub which then morphs into the Wheatsheaf. 
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Sir David Attenborough added: "They always mean beautiful things like hummingbirds. I always reply by saying that I think of a little child in east Africa with a worm burrowing through his eyeball. The worm cannot live in any other way, except by burrowing through eyeballs. I find that hard to reconcile with the notion of a divine and benevolent creator."

Offline Chud

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #458 on: March 21, 2019, 09:23:36 AM »
And thinking further about the links above there's no mention of footprints other than those around the Range Rover.  We know for sure Peter Theobald and Ken Jiggins went up to the Range Rover.  Thereafter first respondents also went up to the Range Rover.  But there's no mention of footprints along any tracks?  If, as the prosecution claim, Whomes arrived by foot and left by foot along with Steele where are the footprints?  I can't see any evidence that the snow was so deep that footprints/tyre tracks melted away.  The track was somewhat sheltered by the hedges either side.  No real explanation has been provided.  In the link above it states an officer flagged up that soc was changing due to a rise in temperature but surely first respondents would take this into account when first arriving and ensure any footprints/tyre tracks in snow were preserved?

The best theory to explain this is that another vehicle came in behind the Range Rover negating the need to walk up and down the lane or hover up and down the lane as there's no footprints. We know the previous evening of the 6th the lane was muddy and water filled ruts in the lane had not frozen at this point as there is clearly a lot of mud on the Range Rover tyres. Any vehicle leaving the lane at this time of the evening would leave obvious tyre marks in the areas that weren't water logged but this would be difficult to assess correctly due to the volume of traffic the lane was used to from farmers and game hunters. The following morning when the farmers drove down the lane they explained that the water filled ruts were frozen, as well as this observation them driving down the lane would of probably destroyed most of the visible tyre tracks of the previous evening.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2019, 09:30:02 AM by Chud »

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #459 on: April 04, 2019, 02:52:49 PM »
The best theory to explain this is that another vehicle came in behind the Range Rover negating the need to walk up and down the lane or hover up and down the lane as there's no footprints. We know the previous evening of the 6th the lane was muddy and water filled ruts in the lane had not frozen at this point as there is clearly a lot of mud on the Range Rover tyres. Any vehicle leaving the lane at this time of the evening would leave obvious tyre marks in the areas that weren't water logged but this would be difficult to assess correctly due to the volume of traffic the lane was used to from farmers and game hunters. The following morning when the farmers drove down the lane they explained that the water filled ruts were frozen, as well as this observation them driving down the lane would of probably destroyed most of the visible tyre tracks of the previous evening.

 (ty6e[ Chud, I'm back

Yep I agree another vehicle pulled up behind effectively preventing the Range Rover and its occupants from moving.  The RR would not have enough traction or distance to drive through the gate or push back a vehicle behind.  No room for a quick turn sideways and again not enough traction or distance to drive through the hedges.  Even if the occupants fled the vehicle they were effectively locked in by the gate and hedges with the only option fleeing up the track towards the main road with the perp with shotgun at the ready. 

I am surprised that it wasn't possible to pick up a partial tyre print somewhere along the track or at the point of turning off the main road onto the track even if the farmer and first respondents drove the same path.

Investigators talk a lot about footprints and how certain individuals handed over footwear but nothing about tyre prints other than tyre prints continuing beyond the gate.   
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Sir David Attenborough added: "They always mean beautiful things like hummingbirds. I always reply by saying that I think of a little child in east Africa with a worm burrowing through his eyeball. The worm cannot live in any other way, except by burrowing through eyeballs. I find that hard to reconcile with the notion of a divine and benevolent creator."

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #460 on: April 04, 2019, 03:23:27 PM »
Poster From The Other Forum

What efficiency? Fireing a shotgun eight times at three close range targets (less than two feet away) is not efficent. Moreover one shot skimmed past patricks head and out the window.


This is what you call using a shotgun efficiantly. Eight targets, eight shots fired and all eight targets hit.

https://streamable.com/pd90w

lol

SAS/SEALS and Police marksman are all skilled and trained to engage targets that are armed and ready. ie people that will shoot back at them.  It doesnt take any skill to shoot three unsuspecting and unarmed men sat in a stationary vehicle.

Making things up to circumvent the incriminating evidence is never going to achieve anything.

My Response

Spot the difference between the posters video clip and the soc.  It isn't difficult:

Video Clip From Poster On Other Forum

- Immovable targets
- Unhindered line of fire
- Daylight
- Little or no anxiety
- Zero chance of immovable targets to return fire
- Not illegal

Scene of crime

- Potential for targets to move
- Hindered line of fire eg car seats, headrests and other parts of car interior
- Darkness outside with the only artificial lighting being interior car lights
- Potential for at least some anxiety.  Get it wrong and end up seriously injured, dead and/or serving a long custodial sentence
- Potential for targets to return fire
- Illegal

The SAS/SEAL are on operational duties within the confines of the law.  The perp at SoC was operating outside the law. 

Try reading the expert evidence:

"He said from the relaxed positions of the deceased three it appeared to have happened very rapidly. There was not time for special movement or something to move them from their comfortable positions".

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=6020.msg510061#msg510061

Absolute rubbish to think anyone other than a marksman could fire off those shots with the murdered trio not moving from their comfortable positions.  There's zero evidence Steele or Whomes possessed this sort of skill.
« Last Edit: April 04, 2019, 03:26:01 PM by Holly Goodhead »
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Sir David Attenborough added: "They always mean beautiful things like hummingbirds. I always reply by saying that I think of a little child in east Africa with a worm burrowing through his eyeball. The worm cannot live in any other way, except by burrowing through eyeballs. I find that hard to reconcile with the notion of a divine and benevolent creator."

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #461 on: April 04, 2019, 04:01:18 PM »
Can anyone think of another gangland killing involving 3 victims?

Other gangland killings seem to involve 1 victim?

- John "Goldfinger" Palmer
- Paul Massey
- John Kinsella
- https://www.essexlive.news/news/history/unsolved-murders-essex-baffle-police-516282  These are probably not all gang related but some are and all involve 1 victim only.

If some bad feeling developed between Steele and Tate then it was far easier and less risky for Steele to appear at Tate's front door and carry out the deed.  Steele was capable of orchestrating the importation of cannabis from Europe on a grand scale so turning up at Tate's in a stolen vehicle and disposing of all the evidence thereafter was potentially easier than what is alleged to have happened.  There's no real evidence any animosity existed between Steele/Whomes and Tate let alone Rolfe and Tucker?  Why would Steele/Whomes want to murder Rolfe and Tucker and take on board all that risk?  What was the motive and potential reward?

The so-called Essex Boys will be no different to other drug gangs all over the UK.  Same rivalries, attempting to wrip each other off, maneuvering for position etc but most killings don't involve 3 victims.  They're ususally 1 on 1 or 2 on 1 but here we have an unknown number on 3 which is unusual.  Why?
Women's World Cup 2019 Trailer THIS IS THE WOMEN'S WORLD CUP // ⚽️🔥💯

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Sir David Attenborough added: "They always mean beautiful things like hummingbirds. I always reply by saying that I think of a little child in east Africa with a worm burrowing through his eyeball. The worm cannot live in any other way, except by burrowing through eyeballs. I find that hard to reconcile with the notion of a divine and benevolent creator."

Offline Chud

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #462 on: April 05, 2019, 01:04:21 AM »
(ty6e[ Chud, I'm back

Yep I agree another vehicle pulled up behind effectively preventing the Range Rover and its occupants from moving.  The RR would not have enough traction or distance to drive through the gate or push back a vehicle behind.  No room for a quick turn sideways and again not enough traction or distance to drive through the hedges.  Even if the occupants fled the vehicle they were effectively locked in by the gate and hedges with the only option fleeing up the track towards the main road with the perp with shotgun at the ready. 

I am surprised that it wasn't possible to pick up a partial tyre print somewhere along the track or at the point of turning off the main road onto the track even if the farmer and first respondents drove the same path.

Investigators talk a lot about footprints and how certain individuals handed over footwear but nothing about tyre prints other than tyre prints continuing beyond the gate.

Hi Holly,

There are many different prints you can see from some of the photos, some have been identified in some detail outside of the police reports.. but there dooesn't appear to be too much focus from them about the importance of the different tyre tracks as if conveniently swept under the carpet.. unless of course there is a bundle of information undisclosed that was not deemed important to the prosecution..

Offline Chud

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #463 on: April 05, 2019, 08:02:49 AM »
Poster From The Other Forum

What efficiency? Fireing a shotgun eight times at three close range targets (less than two feet away) is not efficent. Moreover one shot skimmed past patricks head and out the window.


This is what you call using a shotgun efficiantly. Eight targets, eight shots fired and all eight targets hit.

https://streamable.com/pd90w

lol

SAS/SEALS and Police marksman are all skilled and trained to engage targets that are armed and ready. ie people that will shoot back at them.  It doesnt take any skill to shoot three unsuspecting and unarmed men sat in a stationary vehicle.

Making things up to circumvent the incriminating evidence is never going to achieve anything.

My Response

Spot the difference between the posters video clip and the soc.  It isn't difficult:

Video Clip From Poster On Other Forum

- Immovable targets
- Unhindered line of fire
- Daylight
- Little or no anxiety
- Zero chance of immovable targets to return fire
- Not illegal

Scene of crime

- Potential for targets to move
- Hindered line of fire eg car seats, headrests and other parts of car interior
- Darkness outside with the only artificial lighting being interior car lights
- Potential for at least some anxiety.  Get it wrong and end up seriously injured, dead and/or serving a long custodial sentence
- Potential for targets to return fire
- Illegal

The SAS/SEAL are on operational duties within the confines of the law.  The perp at SoC was operating outside the law. 

Try reading the expert evidence:

"He said from the relaxed positions of the deceased three it appeared to have happened very rapidly. There was not time for special movement or something to move them from their comfortable positions".

http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=6020.msg510061#msg510061

Absolute rubbish to think anyone other than a marksman could fire off those shots with the murdered trio not moving from their comfortable positions.  There's zero evidence Steele or Whomes possessed this sort of skill.

Furthermore, Nicholls alleges that the gun Mick is carrying falls to pieces in "TV Bloopers" style during the hit.. Police forensics confirm only one gun used.. If they weren't dead already they would of surely moved from the relaxed position during this gun failure if they were taking it in turns to shoot them to share the responsibility. Nicholls uses this tactic in nearly of all his statements, he adds detail to the event which are designed to add a level of credence to the story but under scrutiny don't stack up. In my opinion to carry out a hit this clinically apart from being an expert you'd at least need to have some confidence the weapons were serviced correctly and fit for purpose.

Offline Chud

Re: Could the Rettendon Two be a potential MoJ.
« Reply #464 on: April 05, 2019, 08:14:18 AM »
Can anyone think of another gangland killing involving 3 victims?

Other gangland killings seem to involve 1 victim?

- John "Goldfinger" Palmer
- Paul Massey
- John Kinsella
- https://www.essexlive.news/news/history/unsolved-murders-essex-baffle-police-516282  These are probably not all gang related but some are and all involve 1 victim only.

If some bad feeling developed between Steele and Tate then it was far easier and less risky for Steele to appear at Tate's front door and carry out the deed.  Steele was capable of orchestrating the importation of cannabis from Europe on a grand scale so turning up at Tate's in a stolen vehicle and disposing of all the evidence thereafter was potentially easier than what is alleged to have happened.  There's no real evidence any animosity existed between Steele/Whomes and Tate let alone Rolfe and Tucker?  Why would Steele/Whomes want to murder Rolfe and Tucker and take on board all that risk?  What was the motive and potential reward?

The so-called Essex Boys will be no different to other drug gangs all over the UK.  Same rivalries, attempting to wrip each other off, maneuvering for position etc but most killings don't involve 3 victims.  They're ususally 1 on 1 or 2 on 1 but here we have an unknown number on 3 which is unusual.  Why?

Yes I have often wondered this myself, I think in part this is what elevated this story in the press, very unusual to have three victims in very close proximity..  It is also fair to say that if you were planning a murder of this scale, you wouldn't tell your victims in advance where to be knowing that for two weeks or so (it is alleged) they were talking about this RV among their associates bringing them untold wealth and in the case of Rolfe, his girlfriend that were meeting Micky the Pilot.. I mean it's too stupid to comprehend.