Author Topic: Sadie's theory.  (Read 126951 times)

0 Members and 5 Guests are viewing this topic.

Offline Vertigo Swirl

Re: Sadie's theory.
« Reply #480 on: June 26, 2018, 09:18:03 AM »
My quote (with a cite) was in reply to a previous selective quote (without a cite). I don't really have much interest in what Redwood said, to be honest. It's others who cling to his words in order to support their belief in the unproven  abduction theory in my opinion.
The full quote makes it clear that the inherent implication in your selected quote is incorrect - IMO
"You can't reason with the unreasonable".

Offline John

Re: Sadie's theory.
« Reply #481 on: June 26, 2018, 09:55:09 AM »
Time of Kate's alarm - 10.05pm approx.

Time of GNR arrival at 5A - 11.20pm approx.

Headstart - 1hr 15 mins approx.

Unless of course Madeleine vanished before 10.05pm, in which case the headstart is longer.

The thing is though, if Madeleine was stolen to order as Sadie theorises, the thief had no way of knowing if the alarm would be raised in 5 minutes or over an hour later.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2018, 09:08:33 AM by John »
A malicious prosecution for a crime which never existed. An exposé of egregious malfeasance by public officials.
Indeed, the truth never changes with the passage of time.

Offline pathfinder73

Re: Sadie's theory.
« Reply #482 on: June 26, 2018, 11:32:44 AM »
Have you any evidence of a getaway vehicle Sadie? I think most abductions start there. How did they make Madeleine disappear? She didn't disappear in my theory but was seen by eye witnesses and that is actual real evidence!
Smithman carrying a child in his arms checked his watch after passing the Smith family and the time was 10:03. Both are still unidentified 10 years later.

Offline Gertrude

Re: Sadie's theory.
« Reply #483 on: June 26, 2018, 01:56:19 PM »
Redwood also said this in 2012   ".. he "genuinely" believed Madeleine could be alive, though the team is following an equal line of inquiry that she might now be dead.''

   That is from the Guardian but many other UK papers just focussed on the 'abduction' theory with many of them quoting Redwood in headlines as saying she was alive and ignoring the fact he also said she might be dead.

2 years later in 2014 sniffer dogs were looking for a body, and SY were quoted,

"Scotland Yard said there was still a "substantial amount of work yet to be completed" in its investigation, and that "more activity" was expected to begin shortly.
"This recent work is part of ensuring that all lines of enquiry are progressed in a systematic manner and covers just the one hypothesis that she was killed and buried locally," it said.''

https://edition.cnn.com/2014/06/11/world/europe/portugal-uk-mccann/index.html

  So they were still seriously pursuing this equal line of enquiry 2 years later.  IMO Amaral's was also systematically looking at the possibility of a death and hiding of a body but he only had a few months in which he could develop and test that theory.

   There are plenty of cases where police suspect murder / death and don't have a full comprehensive theory such as the Kate Prout case, the Claudia Lawrence case. Arrests were made to question suspects and try and fill in the circumstances of what exactly happened. What they did have was a person that had completely disappeared and a motive. IMO this is very similar to Amaral's theory.

 I agree with John that the 'stealing to order / trafficking theory' is not a very plausible one. Where is the motive to perform such a risky kidnap of a young girl on holiday when families are actually willing to sell children throughout the world?  There is also no evidence of these trafficking gangs in the area at the time. Redwood was looking at stranger abduction as a possibility, this does not mean it was an organised smuggling gang he was looking at.
  IMO the trafficking of young European children from Portugal as presented by the UK media is a myth, African children are brought IN and this is documented. The majority of these children are also older than 10 which is also documented. There was also 1 documented case of a boy kidnapped in Portugal by a paeodophile gang and trafficked out but again he was older at 11 years old and this is just 1 case over many years.

"Visiting Portugal last year, it heard that of the 226 people identified as victims of trafficking over the last four years, 36 of these were children - five of them less than 10 years old.

Of those 36, 15 appear to have gone missing.

The “majority” of children were brought into this country by sex trafficking networks. Most came from African countries (Nigeria, Angola, Guinea-Bissau), though three were identified as coming from Romania. Of the total, only five children were trafficked for non-sexual purposes: three for ‘work exploitation’ (modern-day slavery) and two for “criminal activities”.

http://portugalresident.com/child-sex-trafficking-in-portugal-authorities-%E2%80%98lose%E2%80%99-almost-half-%E2%80%98rescued-children%E2%80%99

Offline Mr Gray

Re: Sadie's theory.
« Reply #484 on: June 26, 2018, 05:38:07 PM »
Redwood also said this in 2012   ".. he "genuinely" believed Madeleine could be alive, though the team is following an equal line of inquiry that she might now be dead.''

   That is from the Guardian but many other UK papers just focussed on the 'abduction' theory with many of them quoting Redwood in headlines as saying she was alive and ignoring the fact he also said she might be dead.

2 years later in 2014 sniffer dogs were looking for a body, and SY were quoted,

"Scotland Yard said there was still a "substantial amount of work yet to be completed" in its investigation, and that "more activity" was expected to begin shortly.
"This recent work is part of ensuring that all lines of enquiry are progressed in a systematic manner and covers just the one hypothesis that she was killed and buried locally," it said.''

https://edition.cnn.com/2014/06/11/world/europe/portugal-uk-mccann/index.html

  So they were still seriously pursuing this equal line of enquiry 2 years later.  IMO Amaral's was also systematically looking at the possibility of a death and hiding of a body but he only had a few months in which he could develop and test that theory.

   There are plenty of cases where police suspect murder / death and don't have a full comprehensive theory such as the Kate Prout case, the Claudia Lawrence case. Arrests were made to question suspects and try and fill in the circumstances of what exactly happened. What they did have was a person that had completely disappeared and a motive. IMO this is very similar to Amaral's theory.


 I agree with John that the 'stealing to order / trafficking theory' is not a very plausible one. Where is the motive to perform such a risky kidnap of a young girl on holiday when families are actually willing to sell children throughout the world?  There is also no evidence of these trafficking gangs in the area at the time. Redwood was looking at stranger abduction as a possibility, this does not mean it was an organised smuggling gang he was looking at.
  IMO the trafficking of young European children from Portugal as presented by the UK media is a myth, African children are brought IN and this is documented. The majority of these children are also older than 10 which is also documented. There was also 1 documented case of a boy kidnapped in Portugal by a paeodophile gang and trafficked out but again he was older at 11 years old and this is just 1 case over many years.

"Visiting Portugal last year, it heard that of the 226 people identified as victims of trafficking over the last four years, 36 of these were children - five of them less than 10 years old.

Of those 36, 15 appear to have gone missing.

The “majority” of children were brought into this country by sex trafficking networks. Most came from African countries (Nigeria, Angola, Guinea-Bissau), though three were identified as coming from Romania. Of the total, only five children were trafficked for non-sexual purposes: three for ‘work exploitation’ (modern-day slavery) and two for “criminal activities”.

http://portugalresident.com/child-sex-trafficking-in-portugal-authorities-%E2%80%98lose%E2%80%99-almost-half-%E2%80%98rescued-children%E2%80%99

Police have to ahve evidence to arrest people...they slso base their theories on evidence...according to the PJ there is no evidence against the mccanns...amaral thought he had evidence...imo he just didnt understand
« Last Edit: June 29, 2018, 09:12:07 AM by John »

Offline G-Unit

Re: Sadie's theory.
« Reply #485 on: June 26, 2018, 05:53:03 PM »
Police have to ahve evidence to arrest people...they slso base their theories on evidence...according to the PJ there is no evidence against the mccanns...amaral thought he had evidence...imo he just didnt understand

Your trust the PJ to tell you the truth? I think that's a bit naive given their track record in 2007.
« Last Edit: June 29, 2018, 09:12:21 AM by John »
Read and abide by the forum rules.
Result = happy posting.
Ignore and break the rules
Result = edits, deletions and unhappiness
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?board=2.0

Offline Mr Gray

Re: Sadie's theory.
« Reply #486 on: June 26, 2018, 05:57:04 PM »
Your trust the PJ to tell you the truth? I think that's a bit naive given their track record in 2007.

I would say you don't understand  what happened  in 2007...the McCann's were not made arguidos until the PJ  misunderstood the evidence... I can't see, that happening again

Offline Lace

Re: Sadie's theory.
« Reply #487 on: June 26, 2018, 06:18:06 PM »
Redwood also said this in 2012   ".. he "genuinely" believed Madeleine could be alive, though the team is following an equal line of inquiry that she might now be dead.''

   That is from the Guardian but many other UK papers just focussed on the 'abduction' theory with many of them quoting Redwood in headlines as saying she was alive and ignoring the fact he also said she might be dead.

2 years later in 2014 sniffer dogs were looking for a body, and SY were quoted,

"Scotland Yard said there was still a "substantial amount of work yet to be completed" in its investigation, and that "more activity" was expected to begin shortly.










"This recent work is part of ensuring that all lines of enquiry are progressed in a systematic manner and covers just the one hypothesis that she was killed and buried locally," it said.''

https://edition.cnn.com/2014/06/11/world/europe/portugal-uk-mccann/index.html

  So they were still seriously pursuing this equal line of enquiry 2 years later.  IMO Amaral's was also systematically looking at the possibility of a death and hiding of a body but he only had a few months in which he could develop and test that theory.

   There are plenty of cases where police suspect murder / death and don't have a full comprehensive theory such as the Kate Prout case, the Claudia Lawrence case. Arrests were made to question suspects and try and fill in the circumstances of what exactly happened. What they did have was a person that had completely disappeared and a motive. IMO this is very similar to Amaral's theory.

 I agree with John that the 'stealing to order / trafficking theory' is not a very plausible one. Where is the motive to perform such a risky kidnap of a young girl on holiday when families are actually willing to sell children throughout the world?  There is also no evidence of these trafficking gangs in the area at the time. Redwood was looking at stranger abduction as a possibility, this does not mean it was an organised smuggling gang he was looking at.
  IMO the trafficking of young European children from Portugal as presented by the UK media is a myth, African children are brought IN and this is documented. The majority of these children are also older than 10 which is also documented. There was also 1 documented case of a boy kidnapped in Portugal by a paeodophile gang and trafficked out but again he was older at 11 years old and this is just 1 case over many years.

"Visiting Portugal last year, it heard that of the 226 people identified as victims of trafficking over the last four years, 36 of these were children - five of them less than 10 years old.

Of those 36, 15 appear to have gone missing.

The “majority” of children were brought into this country by sex trafficking networks. Most came from African countries (Nigeria, Angola, Guinea-Bissau), though three were identified as coming from Romania. Of the total, only five children were trafficked for non-sexual purposes: three for ‘work exploitation’ (modern-day slavery) and two for “criminal activities”.

http://portugalresident.com/child-sex-trafficking-in-portugal-authorities-%E2%80%98lose%E2%80%99-almost-half-%E2%80%98rescued-children%E2%80%99

Yes Redwood did say he thought Madeleine was alive,   and he did say she may be dead,  in other words IMO whoever abducted her had murdered her.   Not that the McCann's had hidden her body.

The Police were digging the waste ground in Portugal,  but I believe that was because someone came forward and said they heard men talking and one said 'why did you bring the body here'.   So IMO they were digging up the waste ground to see if she had been buried there.   They found nothing.

What risky abduction are you talking about?    The police believe they had been watching 5a they knew the children were alone every evening.   They knew the parents checked and when they checked they had it all planned out.   The only hiccups were that firstly Gerry met Jez and they were talking in the road,  secondly that Jane was going to take over looking after her daughter who was ill   both of these were not planned for. Otherwise they knew they had half an hour before anyone went to 5a again.

So you know that no child is ever taken to be trafficked n Portugal do you?  Without a doubt?   Amaral said no one could have entered the apartment with the door locked.  Yet a man was entering apartments to sexually abuse children,  when the apartments were secured and the parents were in the apartments.  Nothing is ever bullet proof.
« Last Edit: June 26, 2018, 06:20:20 PM by slartibartfast »

Offline jassi

Re: Sadie's theory.
« Reply #488 on: June 26, 2018, 06:44:11 PM »
Yes Redwood did say he thought Madeleine was alive,   and he did say she may be dead, in other words IMO whoever abducted her had murdered her.   Not that the McCann's had hidden her body.

The Police were digging the waste ground in Portugal,  but I believe that was because someone came forward and said they heard men talking and one said 'why did you bring the body here'.   So IMO they were digging up the waste ground to see if she had been buried there.   They found nothing.

What risky abduction are you talking about?    The police believe they had been watching 5a they knew the children were alone every evening.   They knew the parents checked and when they checked they had it all planned out.   The only hiccups were that firstly Gerry met Jez and they were talking in the road,  secondly that Jane was going to take over looking after her daughter who was ill   both of these were not planned for. Otherwise they knew they had half an hour before anyone went to 5a again.

So you know that no child is ever taken to be trafficked n Portugal do you?  Without a doubt?   Amaral said no one could have entered the apartment with the door locked.  Yet a man was entering apartments to sexually abuse children,  when the apartments were secured and the parents were in the apartments.  Nothing is ever bullet proof.


No,No. In other words he really had no idea and was hedging his bets.  IMO
I believe everything. And l believe nothing.
I suspect everyone. And l suspect no one.
I gather the facts, examine the clues... and before   you know it, the case is solved!"

Or maybe not -

OG have been pushed out by the Germans who have reserved all the deck chairs for the foreseeable future

Offline Robittybob1

Re: Sadie's theory.
« Reply #489 on: June 26, 2018, 07:13:11 PM »
Your trust the PJ to tell you the truth? I think that's a bit naive given their track record in 2007.
you don't trust the PJ?
Moderation
John has instructed all moderators to take a very strong line with posters who constantly breach the rules of this forum.  This sniping, goading, name calling and other various forms of disruption will cease.

Offline faithlilly

Re: Sadie's theory.
« Reply #490 on: June 26, 2018, 07:46:55 PM »
Yes Redwood did say he thought Madeleine was alive,   and he did say she may be dead,  in other words IMO whoever abducted her had murdered her.   Not that the McCann's had hidden her body.

The Police were digging the waste ground in Portugal,  but I believe that was because someone came forward and said they heard men talking and one said 'why did you bring the body here'.   So IMO they were digging up the waste ground to see if she had been buried there.   They found nothing.

What risky abduction are you talking about?    The police believe they had been watching 5a they knew the children were alone every evening.   They knew the parents checked and when they checked they had it all planned out.   The only hiccups were that firstly Gerry met Jez and they were talking in the road,  secondly that Jane was going to take over looking after her daughter who was ill   both of these were not planned for. Otherwise they knew they had half an hour before anyone went to 5a again.

So you know that no child is ever taken to be trafficked n Portugal do you?  Without a doubt?   Amaral said no one could have entered the apartment with the door locked.  Yet a man was entering apartments to sexually abuse children,  when the apartments were secured and the parents were in the apartments.  Nothing is ever bullet proof.

Do we know if the windows in the apartments that were broken into were closed ? I don’t remember reading that they were.
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline G-Unit

Re: Sadie's theory.
« Reply #491 on: June 26, 2018, 07:54:23 PM »
you don't trust the PJ?

I don't trust anyone.
Read and abide by the forum rules.
Result = happy posting.
Ignore and break the rules
Result = edits, deletions and unhappiness
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?board=2.0

Offline faithlilly

Re: Sadie's theory.
« Reply #492 on: June 26, 2018, 08:02:55 PM »
I don't trust anyone.


But....but... but you have to trust the PJ goddammit !!! Call yourself a sceptic !!  @)(++(*
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline G-Unit

Re: Sadie's theory.
« Reply #493 on: June 26, 2018, 08:18:06 PM »

But....but... but you have to trust the PJ goddammit !!! Call yourself a sceptic !!  @)(++(*

 @)(++(*
Read and abide by the forum rules.
Result = happy posting.
Ignore and break the rules
Result = edits, deletions and unhappiness
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?board=2.0

Offline Brietta

Re: Sadie's theory.
« Reply #494 on: June 26, 2018, 08:34:21 PM »
Topic, please;  or run the risk of deletions.  Thank you
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....