The Sun claims Madeleine McCann was kidnapped during a botched burglary.

[G-Unit]

It's in The Files.  Big, big thingy.  He mislaid his keys and they all covered it up so he wouldn't lose his job.

Do you expect people to read the entire files to check that what you're saying is correct? Please provide a cite confirming your assertion. 

[ShiningInLuz]

How many cleaners do you know that are easily persuaded to take part in a crime, Id thnk cleaners were the last kind of people to approach, 40 50 60 yr omld women just making a few euros for their familieis, hardly the nub of sin city

That isn't the point.  Security wrt keys was weak.

As is so happens, security wrt to closed but unlocked windows was not too hot either.  Combine knowing the shutter could be opened from outside with knowing the window was unlocked, and you have the possibility of a burglary and more.

I presume OG was talking to John Hill about something, and I don't think that something was Smithman.

What would your questions be to put to Mr Hill?  How about - how many burglaries in the OC - and in how many was there no evidence of forced entry?

[Alice Purjorick]

Lots of keys.

So some dozy git lost a bunch of keys?

[Alice Purjorick]

It might be an idea if posters mugged up on the mechanisms* that operate roller shutters and mechanisms* that lock windows. Some of these Eureka moments would not be so bleedin' Eureka then.

aka CDAs
 

[pegasus]

There is also the potential issue of guests leaving a key under a doormat for fellow guests.

At 5H during the daytime the key was left under the doormat.
"there was the only one key to the apartment so during the day time we left the key under the ... mat ... that you wipe your feet on ... that’s basically how we gained entry into it during the day time.” (d p rog)

[pegasus]

Smithman is definitely being avoided it seems

A burglary interrupted before entry, with the burglar taking nothing, would not necessarily rule out smithman.

[ShiningInLuz]

Did what?

Established that in one of his visits here, one could get a cruciform key cut in Luz, perhaps one or two hundred metres from OC reception for €6.50.

Thus, OC key security = weak.

[Alice Purjorick]

Established that in one of his visits here, one could get a cruciform key cut in Luz, perhaps one or two hundred metres from OC reception for €6.50.

Thus, OC key security = weak.

One presumes he nicked a key and had a copy made ?

[ShiningInLuz]

I'm losing the plot completely here. Shining has a theory that a pre-planned abduction may have taken place. She suggested three components to her theory.

1. Weak security as in keys, hence the discussion about who would be able to have a set cut.
2. The MW booking system offering details about children's ages which weren't shown on other booking systems. Hence the discussion about who could see the details and whether the system was actually significantly different.
3. Control over allocation of apartments. I haven't as yet been able to discover the advantage of having this control.

I think perhaps a new thread to discuss Shining's theory may be needed, as it's not a botched burglary.

While this particular theory is not botched burglary, the two overlap considerably.

Botched burglary - explain open window and raised shutter.

Planned abduction - explain the same.

So let's focus on botched burglary.  Someone transferred the McCanns from OC reception to 5A.  Two drivers, one fairly young and one (cough) somewhat older.  A question the McCanns could answer easily.  A stone unturned.

The younger driver can be established as living close to 5A, and in Heri's latest visit, we went to the top level of LuzTur.  Confirming that from this public area, one can observe the whole of the rear of block 5.

This is what theories are made of.  Plug in some facts.  Plug in some analysis.  What you get is - what you get.

[misty]

"After checking in we were driven over to our accommodation in a minibus by a Mark Warner rep."
Madeleine - hardback page 45.

NOT an OC driver.

[ShiningInLuz]

One presumes he nicked a key and had a copy made ?

No, he asked how much it was to get a copy of cruciform key made.  The answer is still €6.50.

[Alice Purjorick]

No, he asked how much it was to get a copy of cruciform key made.  The answer is still €6.50.

So establishing that one can have a common format key cut for six and half Euros 100 odd metres down the road proves O.C key security is weak?
I don't follow.
That test would appear not to stand up.

[ShiningInLuz]

So establishing that one can have a common format key cut for six and half Euros 100 odd metres down the road proves O.C key security is weak?
I don't follow.
That test would appear not to stand up.

Electronic lock with keycard plus a change every time there was a new visitor.

Physical keys unchanged for ?? years and copy-able for loose change.

Not rocket science.

[G-Unit]

Electronic lock with keycard plus a change every time there was a new visitor.

Physical keys unchanged for ?? years and copy-able for loose change.

Not rocket science.

As a sensible, workable believable theory I give this 2 out of 10. Far too many ifs and buts and no answers to the obvious questions. It's very badly thought out and needs a lot more work in my opinion.

[ShiningInLuz]

As a sensible, workable believable theory I give this 2 out of 10. Far too many ifs and buts and no answers to the obvious questions. It's very badly thought out and needs a lot more work in my opinion.

Do you have a 3 out of 10?