Author Topic: Do past events tell their own story?  (Read 21616 times)

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Offline Wonderfulspam

Re: Do past events tell their own story?
« Reply #105 on: January 26, 2018, 01:17:20 PM »
Did they find anything?

Exactly, they found nothing, & then continued to not make any appeals to find a live child.
Christian Brueckner Fan Club

Offline Eleanor

Re: Do past events tell their own story?
« Reply #106 on: January 26, 2018, 01:20:19 PM »
Exactly, they found nothing, & then continued to not make any appeals to find a live child.

Your comment doesn't make sense.  Why make an appeal if they are still looking for a live child.  The Abductor is hardly likely to come foreword.

Offline barrier

Re: Do past events tell their own story?
« Reply #107 on: January 26, 2018, 01:21:33 PM »
When was the last time the MET or the PJ made a public appeal to find Madeleine?

As far as I know, it was 2013 on Crimewatch.

Apart from that they went digging in the dirt with cadaver dogs.

There is nothing on the met site in regards appeals for info,Smithman is known imo.

Search Madeleine McCann and you get this.

http://news.met.police.uk/search?utf8=%E2%9C%93&query=Madeleine+McCann&authenticity_token=4p9UDQP4cmJnWbqY1o%2BbEK7qRljYKdnATvAsLVerI0ePpAdvYvHEJPFHr2SzRCt%2BHa%2FTNqV6uHWwcpDh3G85Zg%3D%3D

Operation Grange gets you this.
http://news.met.police.uk/news/update-on-the-investigation-into-the-disappearance-of-madeleine-mccann-135459
« Last Edit: January 26, 2018, 04:01:39 PM by barrier »
This is my own private domicile and I shall not be harassed, biatch:Jesse Pinkman Character.

Offline Wonderfulspam

Re: Do past events tell their own story?
« Reply #108 on: January 26, 2018, 01:23:33 PM »
Your comment doesn't make sense.  Why make an appeal if they are still looking for a live child.  The Abductor is hardly likely to come foreword.

They're not making much effort to search for a live child, that's the point.

Pushing papers around & asking burglars if they killed her.

No appeals, no new age progression.

Past events tell their own story.


Christian Brueckner Fan Club

Offline Eleanor

Re: Do past events tell their own story?
« Reply #109 on: January 26, 2018, 01:39:58 PM »
They're not making much effort to search for a live child, that's the point.

Pushing papers around & asking burglars if they killed her.

No appeals, no new age progression.

Past events tell their own story.

You don't know what they are searching for.  For all you know they could know where she is already.

Offline Angelo222

Re: Do past events tell their own story?
« Reply #110 on: January 26, 2018, 06:04:05 PM »
A reminder.

There have been a number of official suspects or arguidos in this case including expat Robert Murat, Russian national Sergey Malinka and Maddie's parents, Kate and Gerry McCann. None of them have come out of this smelling of roses for one reason or another. 

Let me say firstly that it is by no means unusual for the parents of a missing child to attract suspicion since most child abduction cases do involve persons known to the child.  In this case however there are other peripheral events which leave many questions still to be answered. Those events include the refusal by Kate McCann to answer the simplest questions when formally interviewed, the voluntary non participation by the parents and their friends in a reconstruction of the events on the night Maddie disappeared, the savage attack on certain Portuguese police officers and the detective who led the original investigation. Then there was the Oakley International debacle involving fraudster Kevin Halligen which saw a secret Report and e-fits withheld from the public. Add to this the murky business involving the Madeleine Fund and the Spanish private detective agency Metodo 3 and a certain pattern begins to develop.

The Archive Report issued back when the original enquiry was shelved for lack of evidence stated that the parents had "failed to demonstrate their non involvement" and the Portuguese Supreme Court has more recently been forced to make the unprecedented declaration that the parents have not been cleared.

The Madeleine Fund itself has attracted much criticism.  Far from being the transparent Company it was initially set up to be to handle donations from the public, it has morphed into something else with accounts and payments shrouded in secrecy.

Are all these events interrelated or is there more to this than meets the eye?
De troothe has the annoying habit of coming to the surface just when you least expect it!!

Je ne regrette rien!!

Offline Angelo222

Re: Do past events tell their own story?
« Reply #111 on: January 26, 2018, 06:09:47 PM »
There are far too many secrets in this case as I have already highlighted and until a full impartial investigation into ALL aspects of it is undertaken I cannot see that changing. 
De troothe has the annoying habit of coming to the surface just when you least expect it!!

Je ne regrette rien!!

Offline Mr Gray

Re: Do past events tell their own story?
« Reply #112 on: January 26, 2018, 07:07:00 PM »
There are far too many secrets in this case as I have already highlighted and until a full impartial investigation into ALL aspects of it is undertaken I cannot see that changing.

All your opinion and totally wrong in mine

Offline Robittybob1

Re: Do past events tell their own story?
« Reply #113 on: January 26, 2018, 07:58:36 PM »
There have been a number of official suspects or arguidos in this case including expat Robert Murat, Russian national Sergey Malinka and Maddie's parents, Kate and Gerry McCann. None of them have come out of this smelling of roses for one reason or another. 

Let me say firstly that it is by no means unusual for the parents of a missing child to attract suspicion since most child abduction cases do involve persons known to the child.  In this case however there are other peripheral events which leave many questions still to be answered. Those events include the refusal by Kate McCann to answer the simplest questions when formally interviewed, the voluntary non participation by the parents and their friends in a reconstruction of the events on the night Maddie disappeared, the savage attack on certain Portuguese police officers and the detective who led the original investigation. Then there was the Oakley International debacle involving fraudster Kevin Halligen which saw a secret Report and e-fits withheld from the public. Add to this the murky business involving the Madeleine Fund and the Spanish private detective agency Metodo 3 and a certain pattern begins to develop.

The Archive Report issued back when the original enquiry was shelved for lack of evidence stated that the parents had "failed to demonstrate their non involvement" and the Portuguese Supreme Court has more recently been forced to make the unprecedented declaration that the parents have not been cleared.

The Madeleine Fund itself has attracted much criticism.  Far from being the transparent Company it was initially set up to be to handle donations from the public, it has morphed into something else with accounts and payments shrouded in secrecy.

Are all these events interrelated or is there more to this than meets the eye?

61
In the OP you  appear to quote from the Archiving report but the words in quotations are not from it, What is the actual sentence in the archiving report that allows you to paraphrase it as "failed to demonstrate their non involvement" please?
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Offline John

Re: Do past events tell their own story?
« Reply #114 on: January 26, 2018, 11:17:30 PM »
In the OP you  appear to quote from the Archiving report but the words in quotations are not from it, What is the actual sentence in the archiving report that allows you to paraphrase it as "failed to demonstrate their non involvement" please?

The actual extract:

"We believe that the main damage was caused to the McCann arguidos, who lost the possibility to prove what they have protested since they were constituted arguidos: their innocence towards the fateful event; the investigation was also disturbed, because said facts remain unclarified."

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/LEGAL_SUMMARY.htm
A malicious prosecution for a crime which never existed. An exposé of egregious malfeasance by public officials.
Indeed, the truth never changes with the passage of time.

Offline Robittybob1

Re: Do past events tell their own story?
« Reply #115 on: January 26, 2018, 11:51:58 PM »
The actual extract:

"We believe that the main damage was caused to the McCann arguidos, who lost the possibility to prove what they have protested since they were constituted arguidos: their innocence towards the fateful event; the investigation was also disturbed, because said facts remain unclarified."

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/LEGAL_SUMMARY.htm
So it was "damage caused to" rather than "damage caused by" the McCanns.
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Offline Robittybob1

Re: Do past events tell their own story?
« Reply #116 on: January 27, 2018, 03:23:25 AM »
The actual extract:

"We believe that the main damage was caused to the McCann arguidos, who lost the possibility to prove what they have protested since they were constituted arguidos: their innocence towards the fateful event; the investigation was also disturbed, because said facts remain unclarified."

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/LEGAL_SUMMARY.htm
It is a complex idea and in the end I felt the only way to do it justice was to quote the whole section:
"E - About the Interest of the Reconstitution

Taking into account that there were certain points in the arguidos' and witnesses' statements that revealed, apparently at least, contradiction or that lacked physical confirmation, it was decided to carry out the "reconstitution of the fact", a diligence that is consecrated in article 150 of the Penal Process Code in the sense of duly clarifying, on the very location of the facts , the following very important details, among others:

1 - The physical, real and effective proximity between Jane Tanner, Gerald McCann and Jeremy Wilkins, at the moment when the first person walked by them, and which coincided with the sighting of the supposed suspect, carrying a child. It results, in our perspective, strange that neither Gerald McCann nor Jeremy Wilkins saw her, or the alleged abductor, despite the exiguity of the space and the peacefulness of the area;

2 - The situation concerning the window to the bedroom where Madeleine slept, together with the twins, which was open, according to Kate. It seemed then necessary to clarify if there was a draught, since movement of the curtains and pressure under the bedroom door are mentioned, which, eventually, could be verified through the reconstitution;

3 - The establishment of a timeline and of a line of effective checking on the minors that were left alone in the apartments, given that, if it is believed that such checking was as tight as the witnesses and the arguidos describe it, it would be, at least, very difficult to reunite conditions for the introduction of an abductor in the residence and the posterior exit of said abductor, with the child, namely through a window with scarce space. It is added that the supposed abductor could only pass, through that window, holding the minor in a different position (vertical) from the one that witness JANE TANNER saw (horizontal);

4 - What happened during the time lapse between approximately 6.45/7 p.m. - the time at which MADELEINE was seen for the last time, in her apartment, by a different person (David Payne) from her parents or siblings - and the time at which the disappearance is reported by Kate Healy - at around 10 p.m.;

5 - The obvious and well-known advantages of immediate appreciation of evidence, or in other words, the fulfilment of the principle of contiguity of evidence in order to form a conviction, as firm as possible, about what was seen by Jane Tanner and the other interposers, and, eventually, to dismiss once and for all any doubts that may subsist concerning the innocence of the missing [child's] parents.

In this sense, the legal procedures were followed, according to the norms and conventions that are in force, and the appearance of the witnesses was requested, inviting them to be present inclusively appealing to solidarity with the McCann couple, as it is certain that since the beginning they adhered to that process diligence.

Nevertheless, despite national authorities assuming all measures to render their trip to Portugal viable, for unknown motives, after the many doubts that they raised about the necessity and opportunity of their trip were clarified several times, they chose not to attend, which rendered the diligence inviable.

We believe that the main damage was caused to the McCann arguidos, who lost the possibility to prove what they have protested since they were constituted arguidos: their innocence towards the fateful event; the investigation was also disturbed, because said facts remain unclarified."
http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/LEGAL_SUMMARY.htm

The rest of the Tapas group refused to attend in order to help the PJ remove any doubt of the McCann couple's innocence".  I had to read that several times.  Were they out to prove the McCanns innocent?
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Offline Carana

Re: Do past events tell their own story?
« Reply #117 on: January 27, 2018, 04:17:48 AM »

snip
The rest of the Tapas group refused to attend in order to help the PJ remove any doubt of the McCann couple's innocence".  I had to read that several times.  Were they out to prove the McCanns innocent?

My understanding is that the T7 (and Jez) felt that they were going to get hassled by the media again, and the T7 (or at least some of them) were suspicious about what the purpose actually was and were worried that they could be stitched up.

Declining to go wasn't taken well by the prosecutor who expressed his disapproval.


Offline pathfinder73

Re: Do past events tell their own story?
« Reply #118 on: January 27, 2018, 10:51:04 AM »
So it was "damage caused to" rather than "damage caused by" the McCanns.

And an unprecedented amount of money being spent on a missing child case. That tells it's own story IMO  8(0(*
Smithman carrying a child in his arms checked his watch after passing the Smith family and the time was 10:03. Both are still unidentified 10 years later.

Offline Carana

Re: Do past events tell their own story?
« Reply #119 on: January 27, 2018, 03:20:31 PM »
And an unprecedented amount of money being spent on a missing child case. That tells it's own story IMO  8(0(*

A missing UK child in a foreign country, with huge media interest, brownie points for politicians, a very suspect case involving some members of the same team...

Madeleine was young, pretty and white. A sad fact is that if she'd been a brown, unphotogenic, male adolescent, the case masy not have attracted the same amount of attention, and therefore less effort. That is something that I do find unfair, but not because there was so much help to help find Madeleine, but that every missing kid (or even an adult in suspected non-voluntary disappearance cases) should be afforded the same.

There was a case a few years ago of a family trying to find a missing black UK 13-year-old girl... and the press was barely interested. They then decided to make a media storm out of it using the key-word Maddie and the media then latched onto it. As a result of the attention, the girl was eventually found, alive, a few weeks after that.