UK Justice Forum 🇬🇧
Alleged Miscarriages of Justice => Jeremy Bamber and the callous murder of his father, mother, sister and twin nephews. Case effectively CLOSED by CCRC on basis of NO APPEAL REFERRAL. => Topic started by: Holly Goodhead on January 22, 2020, 02:58:35 PM
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Ooooo only 5 hours until part 3 8(*(. Bottle of Peroni waiting in the fridge and some savoury nibbles at the ready; what more could a girl ask for on a cold and damp January evening!
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Ooooo only 5 hours until part 3 8(*( . Bottle of Peroni waiting in the fridge and some savoury nibbles at the ready; what more could a girl ask for on a cold and damp January evening!
Brett Collins complete with blonde highlights?
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CAL weighing in against Bamber. I think she won the contest...
https://www.eadt.co.uk/news/essex-itv-crime-drama-white-house-farm-1-6456648 (https://www.eadt.co.uk/news/essex-itv-crime-drama-white-house-farm-1-6456648)
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CAL weighing in against Bamber. I think she won the contest...
https://www.eadt.co.uk/news/essex-itv-crime-drama-white-house-farm-1-6456648 (https://www.eadt.co.uk/news/essex-itv-crime-drama-white-house-farm-1-6456648)
Well, if CAL says he's guilty------------------------------
I think the series is well done, actually, and it's particularly well done if you think he's guilty, so why, I wonder does it put me even more firmly on the fence? Hm----that's a mystery!
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Well, if CAL says he's guilty------------------------------
I think the series is well done, actually, and it's particularly well done if you think he's guilty, so why, I wonder does it put me even more firmly on the fence? Hm----that's a mystery!
Not a mystery to Mr. Myster. ?{)(**
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CAL weighing in against Bamber. I think she won the contest...
https://www.eadt.co.uk/news/essex-itv-crime-drama-white-house-farm-1-6456648 (https://www.eadt.co.uk/news/essex-itv-crime-drama-white-house-farm-1-6456648)
She tells the Sun Online: "Nothing I saw made me doubt his guilt. There really wasn’t anything, from my personal view point.
“I know there are plenty of other people who disagree. And that’s fine, as long as you can back up your reasons with material evidence, not just what his campaign team have said.
"From what I can see it’s absolutely not new evidence, I mean as far as someone being alive inside the house, they’ve tried that so many times over the years."
Bamber's legal team have also now claimed that a rifle was spotted in an upstairs window by two separate firearms officers at around 7AM on the morning of the murders.
However, Carol says: “That’s been around since the case first came to the attention of police.
“It’s not a new statement by any means and they have tried it before. I just presume he’s desperate, of course he is, I presume he’s trying whatever he can.
"But as far as new evidence is concerned, from the bit I’ve read, that’s not new."
https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/10789270/jeremy-bamber-white-house-farm-prison-letters-guilt/
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https://www.thesun.co.uk/news/10789270/jeremy-bamber-white-house-farm-prison-letters-guilt/
Carol received "hundreds" of neatly handwritten letters in total from Bamber — some up to 25 pages long — and says most of them were him repeatedly claiming his innocence.
She adds: “He did go into great depth on some issues which were always what he wanted to talk about — (what he claimed was) police corruption and withholding of evidence and so on — but when I tried to draw him out on anything more personal it was very brief.
He did write in some depth about his relationship with June Bamber and some of that, if you take it on one level, reads very moving. But when you put it into context there wasn’t a lot there.
“I did approach it with an open mind to start with and there was even a point where I did think, is this going to add up? There are always issues with cases, no matter how straightforward, unless the person who committed the crimes is willing to say so.”
Carol says the convicted killer was largely "charming" to her when he wrote.
She says: “He was really friendly, very charming. He was always very polite and he’d talk about other things too from time to time.
“But it always went back to, I remember the phrase he always used was, ‘we now have the key to the door’, or ‘we now have the key to the gate’.
“That happened so many times in his letters. There was always something that he’d found.
“He obsesses about certain key points and he’ll do his best to find a loophole within a certain part of the case, for example the logs of the calls that night or the silencer issue.
“At one point they were talking about five or six silencers involved in the case. Then it was one or two. It just went on.”
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But "he wouldn't talk about the children". I wonder why?
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Carol Lee talks of a photo,was it shown to the jury?
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Carol Lee talks of a photo,was it shown to the jury?
I would think so... nothing is usually held back in such appalling cases.
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Ooooo only 5 hours until part 3 8(*(. Bottle of Peroni waiting in the fridge and some savoury nibbles at the ready; what more could a girl ask for on a cold and damp January evening!
You know Bamber did it don't ya Hols! 8)-)))
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You know Bamber did it don't ya Hols! 8)-)))
Xcuse Me. I haven't made up my mind yet.
PS. Nice to see you back. Or have you been on another Forum.
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Have you made up your mind on Holly's abduction suspect?
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The speech that never was...
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The fingers that wouldn't reach...
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https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7919755/Detective-reveals-Jeremy-Bambers-crocodile-tears-sparked-suspicions-killed-family.html
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Brett Collins complete with blonde highlights?
He bats for the wrong side!
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CAL weighing in against Bamber. I think she won the contest...
https://www.eadt.co.uk/news/essex-itv-crime-drama-white-house-farm-1-6456648 (https://www.eadt.co.uk/news/essex-itv-crime-drama-white-house-farm-1-6456648)
But she hasn't challenged anyone or anything? And those she interviewed are hardly likely to deviate from their original positions.
She would not have been in a position to seek a second expert opinion and/or commission new forensic tests due to budget restraints.
And if JB had not made the material available there would be no book. JB/CT are absolute fools getting involved with the likes of PH and CAL who lack the wherewithal to mount challenges.
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But "he wouldn't talk about the children". I wonder why?
Please explain?
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Carol Lee talks of a photo,was it shown to the jury?
I don't know what photo is being referred to?
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But she hasn't challenged anyone or anything? And those she interviewed are hardly likely to deviate from their original positions.
She would not have been in a position to seek a second expert opinion and/or commission new forensic tests due to budget restraints.
And if JB had not made the material available there would be no book. JB/CT are absolute fools getting involved with the likes of PH and CAL who lack the wherewithal to mount challenges.
Of course she has!... Bamber's view of what happened at WHF. You've got your blinkers on again.
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Please explain?
Because if he feels guilty about having murdered them. So obvious.
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You know Bamber did it don't ya Hols! 8)-)))
(ty6e[
Well I might have been persuaded JB dunnit if the producers of the current ITV series showed JB cycling up to WHF donning his wetsuit and entering the farmhouse under stealth!
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Loved the part where Taff was spittin' feathers at Stan..
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Of course she has!... Bamber's view of what happened at WHF. You've got your blinkers on again.
JB wasn't there and he isn't an expert.
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Because if he feels guilty about having murdered them. So obvious.
But when did he avoid discussing them?
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But when did he avoid discussing them?
Does when matter?... he just avoided it, period.
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Does when matter?... he just avoided it, period.
I haven't heard any of the main protagonists refer to the victims any more or less than JB.
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JB wasn't there and he isn't an expert.
He was at WHF... in the bedroom... with the rifle. I always won at Cluedo as a wee lad.
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He was at WHF... in the bedroom... with the rifle. I always won at Cluedo as a wee lad.
Then why didn't the producers place him there?!
3 down with 3 to go and its looking like an OG win to JB.
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Carol Lee talks of a photo,was it shown to the jury?
According to Wilkes (p.186)... "The jury of seven men and five women were shown thick albums of photographs showing the scenes that had confronted the police when they broke into White House Farm on that August morning fourteen months before."
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Have you made up your mind on Holly's abduction suspect?
Erm. Yep.
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Just watched ep 3,was that how the silencer was found? hidden in the gun cupboard?
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Just watched ep 3,was that how the silencer was found? hidden in the gun cupboard?
The actual gun cupboard wasn't as accessible as that shown in the ITV episode.
The moderator was found in a plastic bag, in a box right at the back of the real gun cupboard here...
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ITV WHF Episode 3. A pity you have to put up with those irritating unskippable adverts, unless you subscribe to the hub...
https://www.itv.com/hub/white-house-farm/2a5719a0003 (https://www.itv.com/hub/white-house-farm/2a5719a0003)
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ITV WHF Episode 3. A pity you have to put up with those irritating unskippable adverts, unless you subscribe to the hub...
https://www.itv.com/hub/white-house-farm/2a5719a0003 (https://www.itv.com/hub/white-house-farm/2a5719a0003)
According to Trudi Benjamin today the ITV drama should be called WhiteHouseFarce
Trudi Benjamin
@tru68
2h
Don’t believe all you see in ITV drama #WhiteHouseFarm - Should have called it #WhiteHouseFarce
She also states
Trudi Benjamin
@tru68
2h
Facts not Fiction #WhiteHouseFarm
Am guessing Bamber’s having a hard time in gaol and taking it out on the CT members?
Poppy Ann Miller™
@PoppyMeze
7h
Viewers can't 'decide' on guilt based on the invented depravity in this barrel-bottom scraping piece of television junk. Created #JeremyBamber 'in my imagination'? What happened to integrity & truth? Read the evidence! #thiscouldhappentoyou
‘Integrity and truth’ aren’t words associated with Jeremy Bamber
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What was the trouble he had in NZ,requiring a transfer of money from Neville to bail him out?
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What was the trouble he had in NZ,requiring a transfer of money from Neville to bail him out?
In NZ Bamber enrolled on a scuba diving course at a cost of £1,500 which his mother provided, but requests for more money were refused. There was a rumour that he had left after a row with a female relative of Nevill's over some money that he'd entrusted her with some years before. Bamber decided to return home, but half-way there hadn't enough cash needed to complete the journey. He contacted his parents to send more, but they again refused and sent an air ticket instead. There was also talk, never proved, of his involvment with jewelry fraud and stolen Rolex watches.
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In NZ Bamber enrolled on a scuba diving course at a cost of £1,500 which his mother provided, but requests for more money were refused. There was a rumour that he had left after a row with a female relative of Nevill's over some money that he'd entrusted her with some years before. Bamber decided to return home, but half-way there hadn't enough cash needed to complete the journey. He contacted his parents to send more, but they again refused and sent an air ticket instead. There was also talk, never proved, of his involvment with jewelry fraud and stolen Rolex watches.
Thanks.
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In NZ Bamber enrolled on a scuba diving course at a cost of £1,500 which his mother provided, but requests for more money were refused. There was a rumour that he had left after a row with a female relative of Nevill's over some money that he'd entrusted her with some years before. Bamber decided to return home, but half-way there hadn't enough cash needed to complete the journey. He contacted his parents to send more, but they again refused and sent an air ticket instead. There was also talk, never proved, of his involvment with jewelry fraud and stolen Rolex watches.
They were Cartier and I think Aunt Agatha confirmed that he has two Cartier watches?
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Ann Eaton noticed the words "I HATE THIS PLACE" scraped into the front surface of a cupboard in the twins' bedroom. When Colin Caffell visited WHF at Ann's invitation, he thought that Sheila might have been responsible for them, but not in the period just before the murders.
The ITV version showed Ann disturbed by the words which were located on a wall within the cupboard, not on the outside. I used to have a photo of the actual cupboard and words, but can't locate it now. So a computer-drawn version of them will have to suffice...
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They were Cartier and I think Aunt Agatha confirmed that he has two Cartier watches?
Yes, you're right. He told his latest squeeze, Sue Ford, to open a kangaroo-skin purse he brought back from the Antipodes with two Cartiers inside and asked her to choose one.
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Yes, you're right. He told his latest squeeze, Sue Ford, to open a kangaroo-skin purse he brought back from the Antipodes with two Cartiers inside and asked her to choose one.
Poor Skippy! 8)><(
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Poor Skippy! 8)><(
I feel his pain... https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/302870901861 (https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/302870901861)
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What was the trouble he had in NZ,requiring a transfer of money from Neville to bail him out?
There's no evidence whatsoever JB committed any crime when travelling Antipodes. And NB and June providing some financial support was no different to what is today known as the 'bank of mum and dad'.
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Ann Eaton noticed the words "I HATE THIS PLACE" scraped into the front surface of a cupboard in the twins' bedroom. When Colin Caffell visited WHF at Ann's invitation, he thought that Sheila might have been responsible for them, but not in the period just before the murders.
The ITV version showed Ann disturbed by the words which were located on a wall within the cupboard, not on the outside. I used to have a photo of the actual cupboard and words, but can't locate it now. So a computer-drawn version of them will have to suffice...
Forensic scientists would probably have been in a position to say how old the scratches were. What did they have to say about the matter?
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'The White House Farm Murders' with Dianne Keen looks good. It says it was 6 episodes. So may go into some depth.
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(ty6e[
Well I might have been persuaded JB dunnit if the producers of the current ITV series showed JB cycling up to WHF donning his wetsuit and entering the farmhouse under stealth!
I don't believe he cycled there but took the car up the back lane and walked the rest. After all, there was blood found under the front passenger seat, I wonder was it ever tested or DNA sampled more recently?
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According to Trudi Benjamin today the ITV drama should be called WhiteHouseFarce
Trudi Benjamin
@tru68
2h
Don’t believe all you see in ITV drama #WhiteHouseFarm - Should have called it #WhiteHouseFarce
She also states
Trudi Benjamin
@tru68
2h
Facts not Fiction #WhiteHouseFarm
Am guessing Bamber’s having a hard time in gaol and taking it out on the CT members?
Poppy Ann Miller™
@PoppyMeze
7h
Viewers can't 'decide' on guilt based on the invented depravity in this barrel-bottom scraping piece of television junk. Created #JeremyBamber 'in my imagination'? What happened to integrity & truth? Read the evidence! #thiscouldhappentoyou
‘Integrity and truth’ aren’t words associated with Jeremy Bamber
I think Trudi Benjamin is the biggest joke. Would you agree?
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There's no evidence whatsoever JB committed any crime when travelling Antipodes. And NB and June providing some financial support was no different to what is today known as the 'bank of mum and dad'.
I believe Brett Collins could tell you differently.
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There's no evidence whatsoever JB committed any crime when travelling Antipodes. And NB and June providing some financial support was no different to what is today known as the 'bank of mum and dad'.
Didn't ask of any criminal activity did I.
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I think Trudi Benjamin is the biggest joke. Would you agree?
I would!
She knows Bamber’s campaign is a farce and she’s one of the key players of the farce
She has a law degree now apparently so there are no excuses for the way she chooses to behave.
She knows how the criminal justice system works. She knows a criminal trial is about guilt and non guilt and she knows the Court of Appeal aren’t interested in innocence or guilt.
Her, and the CT’s, attempts at manipulating the case papers and presenting them in the way they have is foolish and no different to what her ‘hero’ and convicted fraudster Mike Tesco have done before her.
Trudi, Michelle Diskin Bates, they are all a ‘joke’ and a bunch of hypocrites! They see nothing wrong doing something like this https://www.thesun.co.uk/archives/news/278106/mass-murderer-jeremy-bamber-has-bizarre-mothers-day-rant-read-at-grave-of-parents-he-killed-30-years-ago/ then slag off a TV drama which is only half way through.
Mark Newby stated there would be no further comments pending the JR; that didn’t last long did it!?
And let’s not forget Trudi Benjamin chose to put herself and Jeremy Bamber ‘front and centre’ as she called it not long after Simon Halls guilt was exposed!
”Ms Benjamin, 47, defended the video, saying: “We were sensitive to the fact we were at a graveside. We decided it was a way to put him front and centre.”
She didn’t know Bamber prior to him going to prison, she wasn’t at his trial, she’s a very very foolish women!
She should have demanded Bamber have a brain scan before getting involved with him!
🎀 Michelle Diskin Bates 🎀
@Michelle_Diskin
5h
Very important...did you or yours provide information in the past? We need to hear from you again please. https://twitter.com/bambertweets/status/1220690484676395008
https://mobile.twitter.com/Michelle_Diskin/status/1220690961858166784
They are showing nothing but desperation
Didn’t Michelle Diskin Bates warn Trudi Benjamin of David Jessel’s comments following the justice gap article on Simon Halls confession, her comment was made under his
‘you always have to reserve a part of your brain for the possibility that the person you campaign for just might be guilty.
https://theerrorsthatplaguethemiscarriageofjusticemovement.home.blog/simon-hall-confession-a-time-to-take-stock-by-professor-julie-price-originally-published-by-jon-robins-of-the-justice-gap/
Apparently they are ‘friends’ some friend *&^^&
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I think Trudi Benjamin is the biggest joke. Would you agree?
She's a disgrace. And her chocolate cake looks like cows' doings.
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I would!
She knows Bamber’s campaign is a farce and she’s one of the key players of the farce
She has a law degree now apparently so there are no excuses for the way she chooses to behave.
She knows how the criminal justice system works. She knows a criminal trial is about guilt and non guilt and she knows the Court of Appeal aren’t interested in innocence or guilt.
Her, and the CT’s, attempts at manipulating the case papers and presenting them in the way they have is foolish and no different to what her ‘hero’ and convicted fraudster Mike Tesco have done before her.
Trudi, Michelle Diskin Bates, they are all a ‘joke’ and a bunch of hypocrites! They see nothing wrong doing something like this https://www.thesun.co.uk/archives/news/278106/mass-murderer-jeremy-bamber-has-bizarre-mothers-day-rant-read-at-grave-of-parents-he-killed-30-years-ago/ then slag off a TV drama which is only half way through.
Mark Newby stated there would be no further comments pending the JR; that didn’t last long did it!?
And let’s not forget Trudi Benjamin chose to put herself and Jeremy Bamber ‘front and centre’ as she called it not long after Simon Halls guilt was exposed!
”Ms Benjamin, 47, defended the video, saying: “We were sensitive to the fact we were at a graveside. We decided it was a way to put him front and centre.”
She didn’t know Bamber prior to him going to prison, she wasn’t at his trial, she’s a very very foolish women!
She should have demanded Bamber have a brain scan before getting involved with him!
🎀 Michelle Diskin Bates 🎀
@Michelle_Diskin
5h
Very important...did you or yours provide information in the past? We need to hear from you again please. https://twitter.com/bambertweets/status/1220690484676395008
https://mobile.twitter.com/Michelle_Diskin/status/1220690961858166784
They are showing nothing but desperation
Didn’t Michelle Diskin Bates warn Trudi Benjamin of David Jessel’s comments following the justice gap article on Simon Halls confession, her comment was made under his
‘you always have to reserve a part of your brain for the possibility that the person you campaign for just might be guilty.
https://theerrorsthatplaguethemiscarriageofjusticemovement.home.blog/simon-hall-confession-a-time-to-take-stock-by-professor-julie-price-originally-published-by-jon-robins-of-the-justice-gap/
Apparently they are ‘friends’ some friend *&^^&
Simon Halls case review manager at the CCRC John Curtis wrote the following, which took place on 21 November 2014 marking the 40th anniversary of the Birmingham Pub Bombings.
Mark Newby was also in attendance
Excerpts:
Righting wrongs
“Too many cases, too few resources and no room for complacency – John Curtis reports on the Criminal Cases Review Commission state of play”
“The afternoon gave a more critical perspective with solicitor Mark Newby urging the CCRC to undertake more proactive reviews, to challenge the Police and to search for evidence rather than to accept assurances that it had been lost or had never existed.
Newby’s concerns on reviews were echoed by Professor Carolyn Hoyle of Oxford University. Professor Hoyle is leading an externally funded research project covering the Commission’s investigative and decision-making processes. The CCRC has facilitated access to its archives and open interviews with personnel. Hoyle’s initial findings suggest some differences between the CCRC’s investigators. Some appear to be more prepared to go “beyond the bundle” than others, to ask questions, or to conduct crime scene visits, or to speak with those connected with the case be they experts, representatives or police officers.
In panel discussions, the Commission responded with contributions from staff explaining that investigations and interviews were determined by evidential value and that references are made whenever the statutory test is met. The Commission also commended the pro bono work done by professionals, law clinics and university projects in assisting applicants to assemble information and to highlight lines of inquiry.
The Commission’s contribution to society is important. Miscarriages of justice remain a reality, as are the challenges to the organisation charged with their investigation. The CCRC Chairman’s concluding words provide an apt statement of aspiration: “We can’t know whether a particular person is telling the truth or not. We do not know whether they committed the crime they are accused of or not.” But, he said, people are entitled to be taken seriously when they approach the CCRC claiming to have been the victim of a miscarriage of justice. “Detailed, thorough, impartial investigation may confirm what they are saying – or it may tell us otherwise. But the possibility that what they are saying may indeed be the truth must always, always be our starting point. How different might the case of the Birmingham Six have been had it been approached from the beginning in that spirit?”
https://www.counselmagazine.co.uk/articles/righting-wrongs
Not a word about ’innocence fraud’
Nothing by John Curtis of having been conned for all those years. Not a single mention of what went wrong, how, why and where?!
Only Richard Fosters parting words of,
‘people are entitled to be taken seriously when they approach the CCRC claiming to have been the victim of a miscarriage of justice. “Detailed, thorough, impartial investigation may confirm what they are saying – or it may tell us otherwise’
Why aren’t the CCRC demanding chancers like Bamber, Robin Garbutt etc take a brain scan before being considered for yet another case review?
“Miscarriages of justice remain a reality’ as does ‘innocent fraud’!
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Didn’t Michelle Diskin Bates warn Trudi Benjamin of David Jessel’s comments following the justice gap article on Simon Halls confession, her comment was made under his
‘you always have to reserve a part of your brain for the possibility that the person you campaign for just might be guilty.
https://theerrorsthatplaguethemiscarriageofjusticemovement.home.blog/simon-hall-confession-a-time-to-take-stock-by-professor-julie-price-originally-published-by-jon-robins-of-the-justice-gap/
Apparently they are ‘friends’ some friend *&^^&
This women is the biggest hypocrite - with a capital F
🎀 Michelle Diskin Bates 🎀
@Michelle_Diskin
5h
Sense at last! Thank you ☺️
Jeremy Bamber claims ‘ultimate alibi’ PROVES he didn’t massacre his family in White House Farm murders – The Sun
https://mobile.twitter.com/Michelle_Diskin/status/1220688020866764800
Look through her tweets to see what she said about the sun re Hillsborough
Didn’t Michelle Diskin Bates warn Trudi Benjamin of David Jessel’s comments following the justice gap article on Simon Halls confession, her comment was made under his
‘you always have to reserve a part of your brain for the possibility that the person you campaign for just might be guilty.
https://theerrorsthatplaguethemiscarriageofjusticemovement.home.blog/simon-hall-confession-a-time-to-take-stock-by-professor-julie-price-originally-published-by-jon-robins-of-the-justice-gap/
Apparently they are ‘friends’ some friend *&^^&
Michelle Diskin Bates 🎀 Retweeted
Jeremy Bamber
@JBamberFacebook
In the news today Essex police officers are jailed for forging documents and for dishonesty. The names of the corrupt officers in #JeremyBamber case are known and they will be held accountable for their actions.
(link: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-essex-48228167) bbc.co.uk/news/uk-englan…
@jbcampaignltd
@Bambertweets
'Lazy' child abuse detectives jailed
Sharon Patterson and Lee Pollard ditched work and faked forms while carrying out investigations.
bbc.co.uk
5:07 PM · May 10, 2019 · Twitter for Android
Where’s the proof of police corruption and don’t Bamber’s murder conviction require overturning before making these false allegations?
What integrity does she think she brings to Bamber’s campaign?
Leigh Chambers asks: ‘Michelle, Peter there talking about police corruption
You’ve never said in your book that it was corruption that ended with Barry’s conviction
Why, why do you think Barry was the target?
Michelle Diskin Bates replies: “I couldn’t say it was corruption because I had no proof of that and I didn’t want my book to not have integrity I wanted people to be able to trust what I was writing
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I believe Brett Collins could tell you differently.
Ah, but would he?
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I feel his pain... https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/302870901861 (https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/302870901861)
Own the dogs that I have and then tell me what should be done.
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Own the dogs that I have and then tell me what should be done.
What the hell are you on about?!!! READ MY POST WHICH WAS IN RESPONSE TO CAROLINE'S ABOUT A TV KANGAROO, BEFORE COMMENTING
No need to talk to me about the trials and tribulations of owning dogs either, I've been there and done that!
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Ah, but would he?
Doubt it, but he'd sell you a car of your choice... illegally.
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I don't believe he cycled there but took the car up the back lane and walked the rest. After all, there was blood found under the front passenger seat, I wonder was it ever tested or DNA sampled more recently?
John Hayward, the biologist, did test it and said it was unlikely to have had any evidential value.
When the PJ wrote to former MW guests of 5A about any loss of blood they were told a young girl scraped her knee which bled and a man cut his face shaving. The fact tiny blood stains were found on NB's car seat I don't find unusual especially given he was a farmer.
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John Hayward, the biologist, did test it and said it was unlikely to have had any evidential value.
Unlikely and not having any is totally different would you not agree,if it was the twins or even Sheilas, being of no blood relative to any of the Bambers it might have counted for a lot.
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Unlikely and not having any is totally different would you not agree,if it was the twins or even Sheilas, being of no blood relative to any of the Bambers it might have counted for a lot.
John Hayward's trial testimony explained why he thought it was irrelevant, bearing in mind he was effectively acting for the prosecution, but it seems Admin deleted the link:
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=7845.msg379422#msg379422
If it was blood from a victim then it must have been in the form of transfer ie a smear and I think they were small circular stains.
Also no one, other than John, has ever suggested JB drove to WHF to carry out the murders. The police ruled this out on the basis they thought JB would have been seen or heard. His cottage was surrounded by other properties. The farmhouse is reached by a track along which sit cottages occupied by farm workers and others.
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John Hayward's trial testimony explained why he thought it was irrelevant, bearing in mind he was effectively acting for the prosecution, but it seems Admin deleted the link:
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=7845.msg379422#msg379422
If it was blood from a victim then it must have been in the form of transfer ie a smear and I think they were small circular stains.
Also no one, other than John, has ever suggested JB drove to WHF to carry out the murders. The police ruled this out on the basis they thought JB would have been seen or heard. His cottage was surrounded by other properties. The farmhouse is reached by a track along which sit cottages occupied by farm workers and others.
John thinks he may have drove part way.
Bolded bit,one more reason for the silencer.
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John thinks he may have drove part way.
Bolded bit,one more reason for the silencer.
In court the jury were shown three different routes, blue, red and green, which the police believed Bamber took, cycling to and from WHF, as in their diagram below. The red (or back farm) route being the shortest and hidden from public gaze for at least a third of the distance, seemed to be the most likely one he used.
That farm track route still exists, starting from East Coast Classics (or A) at WHF to where it joins the B1026 Maldon Road, then SW on to Goldhanger...
https://www.google.com/maps/search/white+house+farm+tolleshunt+d'arcy/@51.7593843,0.7965025,1116m/data=!3m1!1e3 (https://www.google.com/maps/search/white+house+farm+tolleshunt+d'arcy/@51.7594044,0.7951526,1328m/data=!3m1!1e3)
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In court the jury were shown three different routes which the police believed Bamber took to and from WHF as in their diagram below.
No diagram.
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No diagram.
I pressed the Post button too early! @)(++(*
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John Hayward's trial testimony explained why he thought it was irrelevant, bearing in mind he was effectively acting for the prosecution, but it seems Admin deleted the link:
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=7845.msg379422#msg379422
If it was blood from a victim then it must have been in the form of transfer ie a smear and I think they were small circular stains.
Also no one, other than John, has ever suggested JB drove to WHF to carry out the murders. The police ruled this out on the basis they thought JB would have been seen or heard. His cottage was surrounded by other properties. The farmhouse is reached by a track along which sit cottages occupied by farm workers and others.
He could have left his car away from the cottage and walked to it and done the same when he returned. There is also a rear lane into White House Farm which he could have used without attracting much attention.
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He could have left his car away from the cottage and walked to it and done the same when he returned. There is also a rear lane into White House Farm which he could have used without attracting much attention.
Isn't the neighbour supposed to have said they saw his car? Of course this claim could be (like many more) BS!
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Ann Eaton noticed the words "I HATE THIS PLACE" scraped into the front surface of a cupboard in the twins' bedroom. When Colin Caffell visited WHF at Ann's invitation, he thought that Sheila might have been responsible for them, but not in the period just before the murders.
The ITV version showed Ann disturbed by the words which were located on a wall within the cupboard, not on the outside. I used to have a photo of the actual cupboard and words, but can't locate it now. So a computer-drawn version of them will have to suffice...
Looks like Bamber’s writing
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=634.0
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Looks like Bamber’s writing
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=634.0 (http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=634.0)
Another good find! That was the photo I'd been looking for.
It looks like at some stage the words had been covered up with a sheet of paper, a drawing maybe, sellotaped around the edge because of the different shades of paintwork you can make out.
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John Hayward, the biologist, did test it and said it was unlikely to have had any evidential value.
When the PJ wrote to former MW guests of 5A about any loss of blood they were told a young girl scraped her knee which bled and a man cut his face shaving. The fact tiny blood stains were found on NB's car seat I don't find unusual especially given he was a farmer.
More recent DNA testing would have cleared this up. It was either irrelevant or the proverbial smoking gun.
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Isn't the neighbour supposed to have said they saw his car? Of course this claim could be (like many more) BS!
Remembering too that all this took place in the wee small hours when most people are sleeping.
Just out of curiosity, has there been anything resurrected by the CT recently which could in any way clear JB?
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More recent DNA testing would have cleared this up. It was either irrelevant or the proverbial smoking gun.
Yes potentially dna tests might have revealed whose blood. I will try and locate John Hayward's trial testimony re this.
Was NB's car at WHF when police arrived?
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John thinks he may have drove part way.
Bolded bit,one more reason for the silencer.
In whose car and parked where? How did he then get to and from?
Myster has in the past uploaded vids of rifle fired with and without silencer and there's very little sound difference.
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Remembering too that all this took place in the wee small hours when most people are sleeping.
Just out of curiosity, has there been anything resurrected by the CT recently which could in any way clear JB?
I agree, I wouldn't hear my neighbours drive off in the small hours.
There is NOTHING that could/can clear him and resurrection is right! @)(++(* @)(++(*
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I agree, I wouldn't hear my neighbours drive off in the small hours.
There is NOTHING that could/can clear him and resurrection is right! @)(++(* @)(++(*
Bourtree cottage is surrounded by other properties so law of averages someone would have seen or heard a car start up in such a rural location. Also if JB was off to murder his family he would know all it would take is someone to say 'well I heard/saw a car start up at?' and he would be rumbled.
As someone who believes he's innocent I'm very confident his conviction will be overturned based on new forensic evidence.
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Bourtree cottage is surrounded by other properties so law of averages someone would have seen or heard a car start up in such a rural location. Also if JB was off to murder his family he would know all it would take is someone to say 'well I heard/saw a car start up at?' and he would be rumbled.
As someone who believes he's innocent I'm very confident his conviction will be overturned based on new forensic evidence.
Dorothy Foakes heard him bomb past her cottage in Pages Lane when he drove home at 9:30 the night before. If he then left Bourtree for WHF by car in the middle of the night, he would risk waking neighbours and the same on his return. So the pushbike theory via the shortest RED route there and back seems to me the most logical.
Unless, that is, Caroline's theory that he carried out the murders whilst still at the farm that evening holds any water.
Most, if not all of the Maldon Road route and Head Street wasn't streetlit in 1985. 'Twas the same in 2009 on Google Streetview, and is possibly still unlit today.
https://www.google.com/maps/@51.7458247,0.7563684,3a,77.1y,262.79h,75.89t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1syE_Of1xrXN2jcLuZyHrzaA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656 (https://www.google.com/maps/@51.7458247,0.7563684,3a,77.1y,262.79h,75.89t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1syE_Of1xrXN2jcLuZyHrzaA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656)
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Bourtree cottage is surrounded by other properties so law of averages someone would have seen or heard a car start up in such a rural location. Also if JB was off to murder his family he would know all it would take is someone to say 'well I heard/saw a car start up at?' and he would be rumbled.
As someone who believes he's innocent I'm very confident his conviction will be overturned based on new forensic evidence.
Same as where I live and I wouldn't hear anyone.
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Same as where I live and I wouldn't hear anyone.
That's why I said law of averages someone would have seen or heard given the number of neighbouring properties and the rural location.
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That's why I said law of averages someone would have seen or heard given the number of neighbouring properties and the rural location.
Not necessarily.
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That's why I said law of averages someone would have seen or heard given the number of neighbouring properties and the rural location.
Bambers car could have been heard that many times that it wouldn't be out of the ordinary to hear it,so it doesn't register.
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Bambers car could have been heard that many times that it wouldn't be out of the ordinary to hear it,so it doesn't register.
Unless you have reason, you don't hear what you neighbours do. Otherwise no one would sleep.
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Bambers car could have been heard that many times that it wouldn't be out of the ordinary to hear it,so it doesn't register.
EP seem to think it would have been seen/heard and dismissed the idea he used his car. You can hear commentary to this effect by Di Miller on The Crimes That Shook Britain Vid.
Bearing in mind we're talking mid week, mid 80's early hours where there was little/no noise/light pollution.
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EP seem to think it would have been seen/heard and dismissed the idea he used his car. You can hear commentary to this effect by Di Miller on The Crimes That Shook Britain Vid.
Bearing in mind we're talking mid week, mid 80's early hours where there was little/no noise/light pollution.
Here... https://youtu.be/_S9U_ljZpts?t=1499 (https://youtu.be/_S9U_ljZpts?t=1499)
Well done Bob 'Dusty' Miller... https://www.theguardian.com/media/greenslade/2014/sep/16/ofsted-police (https://www.theguardian.com/media/greenslade/2014/sep/16/ofsted-police)
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Here... https://youtu.be/_S9U_ljZpts?t=1499 (https://youtu.be/_S9U_ljZpts?t=1499)
Well done Bob 'Dusty' Miller... https://www.theguardian.com/media/greenslade/2014/sep/16/ofsted-police (https://www.theguardian.com/media/greenslade/2014/sep/16/ofsted-police)
‘He investigated major cases, such as the multiple murders perpetrated by Jeremy Bamber and crimes related to the "George Davis is innocent campaign".
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‘He investigated major cases, such as the multiple murders perpetrated by Jeremy Bamber and crimes related to the "George Davis is innocent campaign".
A playable wicket was dug up cause of that case.
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A playable wicket was dug up cause of that case.
Did the CoA declare him ‘innocent’ as Duncan Campbell claims in his headline here https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2011/may/24/george-davis-innocent ?
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Did the CoA declare him ‘innocent’ as Duncan Campbell claims in his headline here https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2011/may/24/george-davis-innocent ?
The Court of Appeal can overturn a conviction, it is not within their ability or power to declare anyone innocent. No such authority or commission exists within the criminal justice system in the UK.
Clearly Duncan Campbell doesn't understand this.
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The Court of Appeal can overturn a conviction, it is not within their ability or power to declare anyone innocent. No such authority or commission exists within the criminal justice system in the UK.
Clearly Duncan Campbell doesn't understand this.
So why in 2011 did he write and publish this and how did Gordon Bishop manage this;
“Mr George had brought claims against articles in both The Sun and the News of the World. Allegations included that there were grounds to suspect him of the murder despite his acquittal,
https://www.5rb.com/news/barry-george-wins-apology/
which was clearly smoke and mirrors
‘The Defendant now recognises that those articles would have been understood to mean that there were grounds to suspect Mr George of the murder despite his acquittal. The Defendant accepts that the verdict of the second jury in acquitting Mr George was correct and it apologises to Mr George for any suggestion otherwise.
On Sunday the 3rd August 2008 the News of the World carried a report of the interviews
https://www.5rb.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/12/George-v-News-Group-SIOC-16-Dec-2009.pdf