So what are the various scenarios available to us?

[AnneGuedes]

Abducted of course, obviously impossible, pure nonsense... are performative utterances, they aren't truth-evaluable. Words can't change reality.  What is done is done, as said Lady Macbeth, what exists exists and cannot not be.

[AnneGuedes]

Tanner's and Cooper's vivid imagination.

Mrs Tanner's carrier is faceless (she hasn't justified why on this sketch the face is like erased), her imagination was more inspired by the bottom of the pyjamas and the type of shoes, but Mrs Cooper's caricature originates perhaps in those terrors children have.

[Lace]

Did she ? How so ?

You know what I mean.

Dianne Webster placed Gerry McCann in the Tapas bar when Kate alerted that Madeleine was missing.

You said that only members of the McCann group say Gerry was there at that exact time.

So why would Dianne Webster lie?

[Lace]

So what happened then stephen?  As you are the "Mccanns are involved in the dirty deed" expert.

Come up with the goods (a valid plausible alternative to abduction), or shut up.




Cos without a valid alternative you are talking thru the place where the sun doesn't shine ... Even in PT

    Well said Sadie.

[sadie]

I suggest you get out in the real world  and ask normal people, not fellow mccannites what they think happened to Madeleine.

I am in the real world stephen

And I mix mainly with decent thinking people of intellect.. 

I have heard criticism of the fact that they were 250yards away drinking <<<< all lies, put about as disinformation.

... as the advent of GEarth and the PJ files have proved they were only 50 metres away in what effectively was the back garden to their apartment ... and they were having a meal with normal amounts of wine.

I have never come across one who thinks that the Mccanns dunit.

Just what type of person do you mix with?


Are you PJ?

[sadie]

You firmly entrenched your head up the derrieres of the Mccanns long ago. So I need no advice on that.

I am under no obligation legally or otherwise to prove my theory.

That belongs firmly in the hands of those obsessed with a non-proven abduction including the Mccanns themselves.

For without proof, you have nowhere to go.........................

No you cant give a valid  reasonable theory, can you?

Cos there aint one.

[stephen25000]

I am in the real world stephen

And I mix mainly with decent thinking people of intellect.. 

I have heard criticism of the fact that they were 250yards away drinking <<<< all lies, put about as disinformation.

... as the advent of GEarth and the PJ files have proved they were only 50 metres away in what effectively was the back garden to their apartment ... and they were having a meal with normal amounts of wine.

I have never come across one who thinks that the Mccanns dunit.

Just what type of person do you mix with?


Are you PJ?

You clearly are not in the real world.

Speaking as you do to people who support your view doesn't count, i.e. the 'intellectual' ones

As to that old chestnut, they weren't in the back garden.

They were in a tapas bar, several nights in a row, wining and dining.

In the mail on one evening they consumed 10 bottles of wine, that from one of the waiters, there is also mention somewhere of 13 on one evening. Not counting anything else they drank.

Don't try giving me a lecture about the effects of alcohol and that it doesn't effect or impair peoples'  judgement, because it bloody well does.

[sadie]

You clearly are not in the real world.

Speaking as you do to people who support your view doesn't count, i.e. the 'intellectual' ones

As to that old chestnut, they weren't in the back garden.

They were in a tapas bar, several nights in a row, wining and dining.

In the mail on one evening they consumed 10 bottles of wine, that from one of the waiters, there is also mention somewhere of 13 on one evening. Not counting anything else they drank.

Don't try giving me a lecture about the effects of alcohol and that it doesn't effect or impair peoples'  judgement, because it bloody well does.

Have you been there Stephen?  I have and eaten there.

There is an inside bar and an outside restaurant.

They were NOT on the bar; they were outside in the restaurant ... and it was effectively their back garden



Citations please for the 10 bottles and 13 bottles of wine.


Stephen

Don't try giving me a lecture about the effects of alcohol and that it doesn't effect or impair peoples'  judgement, because it bloody well does.

On this forum we all know, very well, about the effects of alcohol, don't we?
You picked a bad one there Stephen



Now a proper theory, please, if you want to have any creditability at all.


.........  moderated .......

[AnneGuedes]

While it is an unavoidable fact that Madeleine disappeared from Apartment 5A of the 'Ocean Club', the manner and circumstances under which this happened are not - despite the numerous diligences made in that sense -, therefore the range of crimes that were indicated and referred to during the inquiry remains untouched.
This is the GA final report.
No evidence of abduction nor concealment of corpse, no nothing, but investigation hampered inter allia by refusal of reconstruction by the TP7, who had the choice.
Therefore those who assume there was an abduction do it with contempt of the Portuguese Ministério Public, the equivalent of the CPS.
Everybody has the absolute right to believe in the abduction, but it has to be clearly expressed it's an opinion, not a fact.
No debate is possible otherwise.

[faithlilly]

You know what I mean.

Dianne Webster placed Gerry McCann in the Tapas bar when Kate alerted that Madeleine was missing.

You said that only members of the McCann group say Gerry was there at that exact time.

So why would Dianne Webster lie?

I said at the time of the Smith sighting, not at the time of the alert.

[DCI]

I said at the time of the Smith sighting, not at the time of the alert.

So Gerry was in the Tapas bar, when Kate went to do her check, 10pm.
Gerry was in the Tapas bar, when Kate raised the alarm 10.10 pm, ish.

But he wasn't in the Tapas bar between 9.50 and 10pm, when Martin Smith saw him, some 400 metre's away.  8-)(--)

[faithlilly]

So Gerry was in the Tapas bar, when Kate went to do her check, 10pm.
Gerry was in the Tapas bar, when Kate raised the alarm 10.10 pm, ish.

But he wasn't in the Tapas bar between 9.50 and 10pm, when Martin Smith saw him, some 400 metre's away.  8-)(--)

 Gerry claims himself that the alarm was raised no earlier than 10.13 and there is no clear independent witness evidence that categorically puts him in the tapas bar before this time. The location of the Smith sighting is a mere 5-8 minute brisk walk from the OC so it is entirely possible that after the Smith sighting Gerry turned right, concealed the body and was back at the tapas for the alarm.

[AnneGuedes]

At around 10pm, Kate, Madeleine's mother, went to her apartment to check on her children. She came back totally shocked, shouting, saying that Madeleine was no longer in her bedroom. (MO's first statement)
(Matthew O) clarifies that that news (the disappearance) had been communicated to all the friends who were in the Tapas by KM subsequent to her having personally been to her flat to check that her children were well.
The question asked, he relates that she had gone there alone to do that at 21:50.

[DCI]

At around 10pm, Kate, Madeleine's mother, went to her apartment to check on her children. She came back totally shocked, shouting, saying that Madeleine was no longer in her bedroom. (MO's first statement)
(Matthew O) clarifies that that news (the disappearance) had been communicated to all the friends who were in the Tapas by KM subsequent to her having personally been to her flat to check that her children were well.
The question asked, he relates that she had gone there alone to do that at 21:50.

Where does he say this "he relates that she had gone there alone to do that at 21:50".

You seem to have different files?

[DCI]

Gerry claims himself that the alarm was raised no earlier than 10.13 and there is no clear independent witness evidence that categorically puts him in the tapas bar before this time. The location of the Smith sighting is a mere 5-8 minute brisk walk from the OC so it is entirely possible that after the Smith sighting Gerry turned right, concealed the body and was back at the tapas for the alarm.

So its a mere 5-8 minute brisk walk from the OC?. How long was it said the walk from the Tapas to the apartment was?
How long did it take the Smiths to walk a straight line from the sighting to their complex?