Wandering Off Topic

[Robittybob1]

yeah sure you would hahahahaha really, even if one of your kids had just disappeared and all the people around you were doctors, yeah you’d really do that, hahahaha you know exactly how you would react in such circumstances, lolololol, hahahahaha.

And you could read all the street signs and know where to go, and who to ask for when you got there.

[Vertigo Swirl]

WRT this IMO non-issue, one of these scenarios is correct.  Which do the sceptics believe it is?

1) The McCanns drugged all three children, one of them died, the other two hung possibly perilously close to death but fortunately pulled though without any adverse effects the next day, and despite mentioning their concerns to the police about possible involvement of drugs that night, they hoped the police wouldn’t insist on testing the kids because the McCanns guessed they probably weren’t that thorough, and the McCanns didn’t care enough about any of their children’s lives to try and save them.

2) The McCanns didn’t drug the twins, only Madeleine, a course of action which resulted in her death, and so their concerns about the twins being sedated were mentioned to the police for reasons which simply can’t be explained  and strangely the twins unwittingly played along with this scenario by giving the police themselves cause for concern, but the McCanns knew all along their twins were fine which is why they didn’t insist on taking them to hospital.

Libel police please note:  the above are only scenarios not my opinion, nor what I believe happenrd, though some folk do, which IMO, is more worthy of discussion than what actually hsppened.

[G-Unit]

WRT this IMO non-issue, one of these scenarios is correct.  Which do the sceptics believe it is?

1) The McCanns drugged all three children, one of them died, the other two hung possibly perilously close to death but fortunately pulled though without any adverse effects the next day, and despite mentioning their concerns to the police about possible involvement of drugs that night, they hoped the police wouldn’t insist on testing the kids because the McCanns guessed they probably weren’t that thorough, and the McCanns didn’t care enough about any of their children’s lives to try and save them.

2) The McCanns didn’t drug the twins, only Madeleine, a course of action which resulted in her death, and so their concerns about the twins being sedated were mentioned to the police for reasons which simply can’t be explained  and strangely the twins unwittingly played along with this scenario by giving the police themselves cause for concern, but the McCanns knew all along their twins were fine which is why they didn’t insist on taking them to hospital.

Libel police please note:  the above are only scenarios not my opinion, nor what I believe happenrd, though some folk do, which IMO, is more worthy of discussion than what actually hsppened.

In my opinion it's fine to point out the weaknesses in a story without needing to speculate on the reason. The 'sedated twins' story has several weaknesses.

Although Kate McCann says she told the GNR of her fears neither they or the interpreter reported it or reacted.
Although Kate McCann says she checked the twins several times for ;signs of life' she left them in a darkened room with the door closed.
The checks which Kare McCann says she carried out on her twins were not those recommended by healthcare professionals.
No-one mentioned the possibility of sedated twins to the PJ or the FLO's.
Kate McCann criticised the PJ for not testing the twin's urine, hair or blood. It's not standard police practice ASAIK to carry out such tests unless there's a reason to do so.

[Vertigo Swirl]

In my opinion it's fine to point out the weaknesses in a story without needing to speculate on the reason. The 'sedated twins' story has several weaknesses.

Although Kate McCann says she told the GNR of her fears neither they or the interpreter reported it or reacted.
Although Kate McCann says she checked the twins several times for ;signs of life' she left them in a darkened room with the door closed.
The checks which Kare McCann says she carried out on her twins were not those recommended by healthcare professionals.
No-one mentioned the possibility of sedated twins to the PJ or the FLO's.
Kate McCann criticised the PJ for not testing the twin's urine, hair or blood. It's not standard police practice ASAIK to carry out such tests unless there's a reason to do so.

How jolly convenient to avoid considering the motive(s) for all these IYO suspicious activities and behaviours. 
If the police thought there was no reason to do checks on the twins then (them being the experts) we can only conclude the rest is just the mad rantings of an hysterical and over anxious woman, not in her right mind at the time, there all explained.

[Mr Gray]

In my opinion it's fine to point out the weaknesses in a story without needing to speculate on the reason. The 'sedated twins' story has several weaknesses.

Although Kate McCann says she told the GNR of her fears neither they or the interpreter reported it or reacted.
Although Kate McCann says she checked the twins several times for ;signs of life' she left them in a darkened room with the door closed.
The checks which Kare McCann says she carried out on her twins were not those recommended by healthcare professionals.
No-one mentioned the possibility of sedated twins to the PJ or the FLO's.
Kate McCann criticised the PJ for not testing the twin's urine, hair or blood. It's not standard police practice ASAIK to carry out such tests unless there's a reason to do so.

could you give a cite for the tests reccommennded by healthcare professionals

[Vertigo Swirl]

The McCanns and their friends were all trained medical experts but should have deferred to the doctors and nurses in a local Portuguese hospital, they should have immediately left the vicinity of their eldest child’s last known whereabouts to spend hours waiting in a hospital a & e to ascertain thst their children were either a) very deep sleepers or had been given a drug which, as it happened turned out not life threstening.  Meanwhile the sceptics concoct an alternative set of suspcisons and criticisms around this particular verdion of events.  “The McCanns cared more about the twins than Maddie”, “how could they have left the scene of the disappearance, were they running scared?”, “it was all a big deflection”, “how arrogant of them to call the ambulance as well when there was nothing wrong with the twins” blah blah blah blah blah

[G-Unit]

How jolly convenient to avoid considering the motive(s) for all these IYO suspicious activities and behaviours. 
If the police thought there was no reason to do checks on the twins then (them being the experts) we can only conclude the rest is just the mad rantings of an hysterical and over anxious woman, not in her right mind at the time, there all explained.

It's nothing to do with convenience it's to do with avoiding speculation. The PJ didn't think anything; no-one told them there were concerns about the twins. Any mad rantings were allegedly aimed at the GNR.

[G-Unit]

could you give a cite for the tests reccommennded by healthcare professionals

Cites have been provided before and dismissed as you believe Kate McCann's actions were adequate because she was a doctor. I can assure you, however, that her actions would have been inadequate in any A & E Department had she been asked to attend a child with possible sedation.

[faithlilly]

Cites have been provided before and dismissed as you believe Kate McCann's actions were adequate because she was a doctor. I can assure you, however, that her actions would have been inadequate in any A & E Department had she been asked to attend a child with possible sedation.

Indeed. Several of the witnesses remember Kate’s request for a priest but, interestingly, not telling them of her fears for her children. Surely if she was out of her mind ( as supporters contend ) and desperately pleading that her children were unresponsive someone, anyone, would certainly have remembered it......Fiona, interestingly,  mentions Kate checking the twins for ‘signs of life’ but no mention of concern voiced to the police.

[Vertigo Swirl]

It's nothing to do with convenience it's to do with avoiding speculation. The PJ didn't think anything; no-one told them there were concerns about the twins. Any mad rantings were allegedly aimed at the GNR.

You are speculating about how you think a doctor should act when her eldest child has just disappeared and her other children seem unresponsive.  You think Kate's behaviour is "a weakness", based on your opinion of what should have happened. 
"The PJ didn't think anything.  No-one told them there were concerns about the twins".  Aren't investigators supposed to think?  Arent' they supposed to think "outside the box"?  Are they only to act when others tell them to?  Are the PJ really that passive, and well, stupid? 

[Vertigo Swirl]

This whole non-issue is based on sceptics' beliefs about what they would do in this highly unusual situation with absolutely no thought given whatsoever to the motivations for such (in) action as they see it.  It's all very well being critical about Kate's actions but if you can't or won't speculate on the whys and wherefores of your suspicions then they are simply bitching for nowt.  What are you actually hoping to achieve?  That someone with a greater mind than you will see what you have written and be able work out the sum of 2 + 2 that you yourselves are clearly unable to do?  Year after year the same criticisms over and over again and where has it got you?  Do you enjoy repeating yourselves, do you gain some comfort from it? 

[Vertigo Swirl]

Cites have been provided before and dismissed as you believe Kate McCann's actions were adequate because she was a doctor. I can assure you, however, that her actions would have been inadequate in any A & E Department had she been asked to attend a child with possible sedation.

Talk us through step by step exactly what the A & E department would have done with the twins when they arrived at hospital.

[Lace]

http://checktheevidencecom.ipage.com/checktheevidence.com/pdf/Goncalo%20Amaral%20-%20Truth%20of%20the%20Lie%20-%20Madeleine%20McCann.pdf

*snipped" page 85-86

"From the start, the way the children slept had seemed suspicious to us and we wanted to have screening tests carried out: nevertheless, faced with the media coverage of the case we put this off, worried about exposing the parents to trial by public. This was a mistake."

Those are Amaral's words. If this was an abduction, why didn't he treat the possible drugging issue with due diligence like any good policeman would, rather than stressing about the media & its impact on the parents? Had the group not comprised of doctors  and the twins had been drugged, there could have been a triple tragedy.

It  all sounds a bit fishy to me.   Kate says she told the Police she thought the twins may have been sedated.   The Police officers in their statements say it was unusual the way in which the twins slept through the noise.   It is obvious to me that these Police officers reported to Amaral about the twins.   I believe Kate when she said she told the officers.   Amaral revealing that they were concerned about the twins from the start,  proves that he was told.   He did nothing.   Kate was probably thinking they would be doing something.   Then Amaral had the nerve to say that the McCann's had given their children Calpol to help them sleep!!    IMO

[faithlilly]

It's nothing to do with convenience it's to do with avoiding speculation. The PJ didn't think anything; no-one told them there were concerns about the twins. Any mad rantings were allegedly aimed at the GNR.

Even if the police were the most incompetent people on the face of God’s earth it still does not excuse, or explain, a group of doctors, two of them anaesthetists, leaving two small children in an unresponsive state without taking any action.

[faithlilly]

It  all sounds a bit fishy to me.   Kate says she told the Police she thought the twins may have been sedated.   The Police officers in their statements say it was unusual the way in which the twins slept through the noise.   It is obvious to me that these Police officers reported to Amaral about the twins.   I believe Kate when she said she told the officers.   Amaral revealing that they were concerned about the twins from the start,  proves that he was told.   He did nothing.   Kate was probably thinking they would be doing something.   Then Amaral had the nerve to say that the McCann's had given their children Calpol to help them sleep!!    IMO

If Kate told the officers then why did no one mention it, not even her friends ? Ignoring the pleas of a mother who believes her children are in anger is a pretty big deal so why does no one mentions it the next day...not the parents, not the friends, not the family who were called, not the translator, not the police, not the Mark Warner staff...in fact not one single solitary soul ? What makes you believe Kate ?

Further do we know that Amaral was told that night or sometime in the following days ?