Author Topic: Were the heal prick blood samples of MM used as a reference DNA sample  (Read 25436 times)

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Offline Robittybob1

Re: Were the heal prick blood samples of MM used as a reference DNA sample
« Reply #30 on: August 14, 2016, 10:01:25 PM »
FSS report.

Couldn't be more clear.
Lesley Ann Denton is not aware that Madeleine is the result of an IVF treatment or else she would need to include not only Sean and Amelie but also other unknown persons as well.
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Offline mercury

Re: Were the heal prick blood samples of MM used as a reference DNA sample
« Reply #31 on: August 14, 2016, 10:02:34 PM »
We haven't been told who collected the pillowcase but Gerry McCann was in Rothley on 21st May and the FSS received it on 22nd. A few reasons have been given for the trip home, but the pillowcase hasn't been mentioned by the McCanns.

Auntie janet got some eyelashes off her pillow in the second week in june according to the book Madeleine to give to the southafrican body finder

?

Offline mercury

Re: Were the heal prick blood samples of MM used as a reference DNA sample
« Reply #32 on: August 14, 2016, 10:04:23 PM »
Lesley Ann Denton is not aware that Madeleine is the result of an IVF treatment or else she would need to include not only Sean and Amelie but also other unknown persons as well.
No she wouldnt seeing as ivf treatment was carried out for the parents and no one else!!! As proven by the dna profiles
« Last Edit: August 14, 2016, 10:06:40 PM by mercury »

ferryman

  • Guest
Re: Were the heal prick blood samples of MM used as a reference DNA sample
« Reply #33 on: August 14, 2016, 10:05:45 PM »
Lesley Ann Denton is not aware that Madeleine is the result of an IVF treatment or else she would need to include not only Sean and Amelie but also other unknown persons as well.

Rubbish.

IVF is irrelevant.


Offline Robittybob1

Re: Were the heal prick blood samples of MM used as a reference DNA sample
« Reply #34 on: August 14, 2016, 10:41:10 PM »
Rubbish.

IVF is irrelevant.
I don't dismiss it so easily.
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Offline Brietta

Re: Were the heal prick blood samples of MM used as a reference DNA sample
« Reply #35 on: August 15, 2016, 01:42:18 AM »
Sigh ... I think that for once he was actually doing his job and eliminating all possible scenarios.  The majority of child abductions take place as the result of a custody dispute when a relationship or a marriage has broken down.
He was merely checking that out by ascertaining parentage and in doing so verified that Kate and Gerry are without doubt Madeleine's biological parents.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2016, 09:54:51 AM by Angelo222 »
"All I'm going to say is that we've conducted a very serious investigation and there's no indication that Madeleine McCann's parents are connected to her disappearance. On the other hand, we have a lot of evidence pointing out that Christian killed her," Wolter told the "Friday at 9"....

ferryman

  • Guest
Re: Were the heal prick blood samples of MM used as a reference DNA sample
« Reply #36 on: August 15, 2016, 04:56:46 AM »
Sigh ... I think that for once he was actually doing his job and eliminating all possible scenarios.  The majority of child abductions take place as the result of a custody dispute when a relationship or a marriage has broken down.
He was merely checking that out by ascertaining parentage and in doing so verified that Kate and Gerry are without doubt Madeleine's biological parents.

Beg to differ with you, there, Brietta.

Shortlyafter Amaral asked those questions of the Portuguese laboratory, (timing critical) the Gerry not Madeleine's father canard broke.

I think Amaral had pre-determined that he was going to spread that (malicious) rumour and didn't allow a pesky detail of an answer not remotely conducive to it to stop him.

Offline Robittybob1

Re: Were the heal prick blood samples of MM used as a reference DNA sample
« Reply #37 on: August 15, 2016, 05:35:16 AM »
in #15 are the questions and answers relating to the DNA profiles
Quote
Reply to Queries

- We inform you that none of the samples received by this institute were designated as supposedly belonging to the missing girl and we therefore, cannot reply to this query.


- Samples were studied - hair and a piece of cloth - nuclear DNA profiles only being obtained from 4 samples, which upon comparison with the DNA profiles of Kate and Gerry, could not belong to the girl.

- The samples were then studied using mitochondrial DNA analysis, the same was done for the other samples, giving the results in accordance with our report of 9th July No. 2007/000226 LX-BC.

- As requested in point 5, it was determined that the profile obtained by the British lab could belong to a son/daughter of the McCanns.

- The comparison of the profiles obtained in autossomic STR from Kate and Gerry McCann with the profile obtained was carried out.
Signed

I find the answers a bit confusing for the first sentence says ..... "cannot reply to this query".  But then they do reply with a sentence that has  this in it "which upon comparison with the DNA profiles of Kate and Gerry, could not belong to the girl."  So there was some samples that did not belong to Madeleine or any daughter of Kate and Gerry.  Did I read that right?

But from the "mitochondrial DNA analysis" of the samples "it was determined that the profile obtained by the British lab could belong to a son/daughter of the McCanns".  So there was a child of the McCanns but it wasn't Madeleine.   Did I read that right?

So I stand by my theory there was another biological relation of Kate and Gerry that wasn't Madeleine in the apartment.
Yet that still doesn't seem to make sense, for the two sentences seem to contradict each other.  More research is required.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2016, 06:28:48 AM by Robittybob1 »
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ferryman

  • Guest
Re: Were the heal prick blood samples of MM used as a reference DNA sample
« Reply #38 on: August 15, 2016, 08:33:37 AM »
What I was trying work out if Gerry has an officer with him so he is protected from the accusation that he contaminated that pillow case himself.  I'm not saying he did, but some are saying "he had experienced officers with him and his role was just to let them into his house" but that was total news to me.  It seems like the forum here is also not aware of this alleged Police presence yet it is clearly Gerry's intention to collect a sample of DNA crucial to this case. 
Maybe it was wrong for the PJ or the FSS to use this  reference sample, since a potential suspect had the chance to tamper with it.
But then again it is only at the level of a missing person investigation at this stage and that is about the normal level of security of evidence gathering in a missing person inquiry.
e.g When the parent or a missing child is asked to get something belonging to their child it would not be done as if it was a crime scene.  The parent would just go into the child's play areas or bedroom and take some items in order to help the inquiry.
So personally I do not find it suspect even if Gerry did this evidence collection unaccompanied.

I'm glad about that.

The results of the DNA profile obtained from the pillowcase is approximately 29
million times more likely if the profile originates form a natural child of theirs rather
than someone unrelated to them.

In my opinion, the results detailed above provide extremely strong support for the
view that the profile obtained from the pillowcase originated from a natural child of
Kate HEALY and GERALD McCANN.

Please note: I understand that the McCANN's have a second female child. It
therefore remains a formal possibility that the DNA on the pillowcase could
have originated from her as the genetics would be in keeping with those
described above.

If I can be of further assistance or you require a CJA statement please do not
hesitate to contact me at the laboratory on 01937 548287.

Yours sincerely


Lesley Anne Denton
FORENSIC SCIENTISTS
Date: 28 June 2007



The other bit of the equation (not completed at the point Leslie Anne Denton wrote the above, but assuredly completed) was to take the profile of the McCanns' (only) other (female) child and compare the profile with the profile from the pillow.

When they did that, they found the two profiles different, confirming that they had Madeleine's DNA.

To confirm, the (initial) sweep (by the Portuguese) forensic laboratory did not establish Madeleine's DNA.

The sweep 3 months later by the British didn't, either, but the saliva (from the pillow of Madeleine's Rothley home) certainly did.

And forget UVF (or whatever else).

Offline G-Unit

Re: Were the heal prick blood samples of MM used as a reference DNA sample
« Reply #39 on: August 15, 2016, 08:45:28 AM »
The answer to the thread question is that it's assumed that the blood spot was Madeleine's, but no-one ever actually said that it was, or that it was from her heel prick.
Read and abide by the forum rules.
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Ignore and break the rules
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Offline Robittybob1

Re: Were the heal prick blood samples of MM used as a reference DNA sample
« Reply #40 on: August 15, 2016, 09:24:46 AM »
....

The other bit of the equation (not completed at the point Leslie Anne Denton wrote the above, but assuredly completed) was to take the profile of the McCanns' (only) other (female) child and compare the profile with the profile from the pillow.

When they did that, they found the two profiles different, confirming that they had Madeleine's DNA.

To confirm, the (initial) sweep (by the Portuguese) forensic laboratory did not establish Madeleine's DNA.

The sweep 3 months later by the British didn't, either, but the saliva (from the pillow of Madeleine's Rothley home) certainly did.
...
Would you define what you mean by sweep?
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Offline Robittybob1

Re: Were the heal prick blood samples of MM used as a reference DNA sample
« Reply #41 on: August 15, 2016, 09:26:14 AM »
The answer to the thread question is that it's assumed that the blood spot was Madeleine's, but no-one ever actually said that it was, or that it was from her heel prick.
Seems a very correct answer.  I hope to fully study the DNA question.  You sound like your understanding will be invaluable.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2016, 09:50:09 AM by Robittybob1 »
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Offline Angelo222

Re: Were the heal prick blood samples of MM used as a reference DNA sample
« Reply #42 on: August 15, 2016, 10:01:21 AM »
Does having Madeleine's DNA really bring anything to this mystery?
De troothe has the annoying habit of coming to the surface just when you least expect it!!

Je ne regrette rien!!

Offline jassi

Re: Were the heal prick blood samples of MM used as a reference DNA sample
« Reply #43 on: August 15, 2016, 10:04:32 AM »
Does having Madeleine's DNA really bring anything to this mystery?

Not at the moment, perhaps, but it would be useful for identification purposes of a child, dead or alive.
I believe everything. And l believe nothing.
I suspect everyone. And l suspect no one.
I gather the facts, examine the clues... and before   you know it, the case is solved!"

Or maybe not -

OG have been pushed out by the Germans who have reserved all the deck chairs for the foreseeable future

Offline Angelo222

Re: Were the heal prick blood samples of MM used as a reference DNA sample
« Reply #44 on: August 15, 2016, 10:46:45 AM »
Not at the moment, perhaps, but it would be useful for identification purposes of a child, dead or alive.

I suppose so in the case of skeletal remains being found in a drain in Praia da Luz.  So very sad.
« Last Edit: August 16, 2016, 07:55:35 AM by Angelo222 »
De troothe has the annoying habit of coming to the surface just when you least expect it!!

Je ne regrette rien!!