Author Topic: The investigation into the Smith family's sighting  (Read 70246 times)

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Offline John

Re: The investigation into the Smith family's sighting
« Reply #120 on: September 26, 2017, 02:43:49 PM »
Two highly trained professional investigations, one private, one official have ruled out Tannerman in favour of Smithman yet you stubbornly cling to him by your fingertips. Can I ask why Brietta?

It is perfectly acceptable to ask questions just as it is also acceptable to choose not to answer them.  Repeated posting of the same question however constitutes goading and will be removed.

My own view is that Tannerman cannot properly be ruled out since there are still too many unanswered questions surrounding Crècheman, one being why was he walking from west to east if he was returning from the night crèche?
« Last Edit: September 26, 2017, 02:49:36 PM by John »
A malicious prosecution for a crime which never existed. An exposé of egregious malfeasance by public officials.
Indeed, the truth never changes with the passage of time.

Offline faithlilly

Re: The investigation into the Smith family's sighting
« Reply #121 on: September 26, 2017, 04:58:50 PM »
It is perfectly acceptable to ask questions just as it is also acceptable to choose not to answer them.  Repeated posting of the same question however constitutes goading and will be removed.

My own view is that Tannerman cannot properly be ruled out since there are still too many unanswered questions surrounding Crècheman, one being why was he walking from west to east if he was returning from the night crèche?

Fair dos. I think I made my point anyway.
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline faithlilly

Re: The investigation into the Smith family's sighting
« Reply #122 on: September 26, 2017, 06:18:54 PM »
Here's my theory for reading before it gets whooshed.

Amaral  never gave any credence to Jane Tanner's sighting, even less so when there were suspicions it was Murat.
I think he then saw Crecheman's statement & kept it in reserve as he pursued the McCanns. Once he had acquired enough "evidence" & they were charged, prosecution would have produced Crecheman so that the McCanns could not have used the unidentified Tannerman in defence of their claims of abduction. Whilst Smithman remained unidentified too, Tannerman could never be charged as Madeleine's abductor.
After the McCanns left Portugal & the PP didn't have enough evidence to charge them, cue M Smith to identify Smithman as Gerry. Take a fresh statement, move the time of the sighting on a bit then add that to all the other "evidence" which, in Amaral's eyes should have been enough. The presence of Crecheman could then have been revealed, Only it didn't work because Amaral was sidelined - so Crecheman's details remained buried & would have remained buried without the McCanns determination to get the investigation reopened.

IMO Crecheman was Amaral's Ace, which he never got to play - probably because he couldn't without incriminating himself after the UK authorities launched a review.

Amaral wants you to believe that Tannerman was Gerry & Smithman was Gerry - he said so in Chapter 20 of his book

Extract from Chapter 20 - An Irish Family In A State Of Shock.

"When we receive this information, at the end of September, we think we finally have the piece that will allow us to complete the puzzle. Because of this, we may be able to reconstruct the course of events on that cold night of May 3rd in Vila da Luz. We have a better understanding of why Jane Tanner, "sent," the alleged abductor in the opposite direction to that taken by the man seen by the Smith family. Suspicion had to be diverted from Gerald who - if he was the guilty party - would have taken this route: leaving apartment 5A, the individual who was carrying the child, did not go east, towards Murat's house, but west in the direction of the beach."


All my own opinion, exercising the same freedom of speech Amaral has been legally granted.

So why didn't Rebelo, while reviewing the case, discover Crecheman ?
Brietta posted on 10/04/2022 “But whether or not that is the reason behind the delay I am certain that Brueckner's trial is going to take place.”

Let’s count the months, shall we?

Offline G-Unit

Re: The investigation into the Smith family's sighting
« Reply #123 on: September 26, 2017, 07:02:20 PM »
Here's my theory for reading before it gets whooshed.

Amaral  never gave any credence to Jane Tanner's sighting, even less so when there were suspicions it was Murat.
I think he then saw Crecheman's statement & kept it in reserve as he pursued the McCanns. Once he had acquired enough "evidence" & they were charged, prosecution would have produced Crecheman so that the McCanns could not have used the unidentified Tannerman in defence of their claims of abduction. Whilst Smithman remained unidentified too, Tannerman could never be charged as Madeleine's abductor.
After the McCanns left Portugal & the PP didn't have enough evidence to charge them, cue M Smith to identify Smithman as Gerry. Take a fresh statement, move the time of the sighting on a bit then add that to all the other "evidence" which, in Amaral's eyes should have been enough. The presence of Crecheman could then have been revealed, Only it didn't work because Amaral was sidelined - so Crecheman's details remained buried & would have remained buried without the McCanns determination to get the investigation reopened.

IMO Crecheman was Amaral's Ace, which he never got to play - probably because he couldn't without incriminating himself after the UK authorities launched a review.

Amaral wants you to believe that Tannerman was Gerry & Smithman was Gerry - he said so in Chapter 20 of his book

Extract from Chapter 20 - An Irish Family In A State Of Shock.

"When we receive this information, at the end of September, we think we finally have the piece that will allow us to complete the puzzle. Because of this, we may be able to reconstruct the course of events on that cold night of May 3rd in Vila da Luz. We have a better understanding of why Jane Tanner, "sent," the alleged abductor in the opposite direction to that taken by the man seen by the Smith family. Suspicion had to be diverted from Gerald who - if he was the guilty party - would have taken this route: leaving apartment 5A, the individual who was carrying the child, did not go east, towards Murat's house, but west in the direction of the beach."


All my own opinion, exercising the same freedom of speech Amaral has been legally granted.

At least Amaral based his theories on the facts. You are lacking the evidence you need to accuse him of hiding crecheman's 'statement'. He never made a statement afaik. He may have completed a questionnaire for LP along with 558 other people, but none of them are in the PJ files. Are they all hidden away by Amaral, do you think?
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Offline Alice Purjorick

Re: The investigation into the Smith family's sighting
« Reply #124 on: September 26, 2017, 07:11:27 PM »
Here's my theory for reading before it gets whooshed.

Amaral  never gave any credence to Jane Tanner's sighting, even less so when there were suspicions it was Murat.
I think he then saw Crecheman's statement & kept it in reserve as he pursued the McCanns. Once he had acquired enough "evidence" & they were charged, prosecution would have produced Crecheman so that the McCanns could not have used the unidentified Tannerman in defence of their claims of abduction. Whilst Smithman remained unidentified too, Tannerman could never be charged as Madeleine's abductor.
After the McCanns left Portugal & the PP didn't have enough evidence to charge them, cue M Smith to identify Smithman as Gerry. Take a fresh statement, move the time of the sighting on a bit then add that to all the other "evidence" which, in Amaral's eyes should have been enough. The presence of Crecheman could then have been revealed, Only it didn't work because Amaral was sidelined - so Crecheman's details remained buried & would have remained buried without the McCanns determination to get the investigation reopened.

IMO Crecheman was Amaral's Ace, which he never got to play - probably because he couldn't without incriminating himself after the UK authorities launched a review.

Amaral wants you to believe that Tannerman was Gerry & Smithman was Gerry - he said so in Chapter 20 of his book

Extract from Chapter 20 - An Irish Family In A State Of Shock.

"When we receive this information, at the end of September, we think we finally have the piece that will allow us to complete the puzzle. Because of this, we may be able to reconstruct the course of events on that cold night of May 3rd in Vila da Luz. We have a better understanding of why Jane Tanner, "sent," the alleged abductor in the opposite direction to that taken by the man seen by the Smith family. Suspicion had to be diverted from Gerald who - if he was the guilty party - would have taken this route: leaving apartment 5A, the individual who was carrying the child, did not go east, towards Murat's house, but west in the direction of the beach."


All my own opinion, exercising the same freedom of speech Amaral has been legally granted.

Did he? That's not how I read it.
In addition
"Yeah right Sr Amaral so tell us where this geezer was lurking for about 45 minutes to an hour"?
I would imagine he(Sr Amaral) would have seen that one coming or he thinks the public and PP are to dim to work it out.

"Navigating the difference between weird but normal grief and truly suspicious behaviour is the key for any detective worth his salt.". ….Sarah Bailey

Offline misty

Re: The investigation into the Smith family's sighting
« Reply #125 on: September 26, 2017, 07:32:40 PM »
Did he? That's not how I read it.
In addition
"Yeah right Sr Amaral so tell us where this geezer was lurking for about 45 minutes to an hour"?
I would imagine he(Sr Amaral) would have seen that one coming or he thinks the public and PP are to dim to work it out.
From Amaral's perspective - Chapter 8 TToTL.

......At this time, images of Robert Murat - considered to be the main suspect - begin to be circulated all over the world. After they return to Ireland, the Smiths continue to follow the case. They learn that, according to Jane Tanner's statements, Murat is definitely the man encountered on the night of the abduction. Mr Smith then gets in touch with the Irish police to relate what he saw on the night of May 3rd. He insists, categorically, that the man they came across with the little girl in his arms was not Robert Murat. He is sure of it because he knows him.
With hindsight, he is utterly convinced that the little girl was definitely Madeleine. We secretly organise for the Smiths to come to Portugal. On May 26th, in the offices of the Department of Criminal Investigation in Portimão, we interview the father and his son. What they say seems credible. However, because of the dim street lighting, they say they would have a hard time formally recognising the man who was carrying the child. On the other hand, they describe very clearly how the man was holding the little girl and how he was walking. That scene is indelibly printed in their memory. After their interview, they go back to the scene, accompanied by investigators. They indicate the precise place where they came across the man.

Their coming to Portugal as well as their statements are kept secret. Within a few days, they go back to Ireland, but contact is maintained: they undertake to let us have any further details they remember. We finally have credible witness statements about that stranger who, on the night of May 3rd, was walking in the streets of Vila da Luz with a child in his arms.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Does that not sound to you like Amaral believed the 2 sightings were one & the same person, because it sure does to me?
Back to the opening post - if Crecheman's questionnaire/statement/whatever it was put himself in the vicinity of 5A around the time of Jane's sighting, how would the PJ have worked that into the equation, given the questions we have about Crecheman's direction of travel?
To rule Tannerman out as Crecheman at that stage only left Smithman, whom the Smiths were unable to identify because they said so. If he was an invention, he would never be identified, thus leaving the abduction scenario absolutely in focus & contrary to Amaral's thesis. After all, the Smith family were totally independent of the Tapas 9. If he was a genuine sighting then why, oh why, did Amaral do absolutely nothing about it bar keeping in touch with the Smiths?
« Last Edit: November 27, 2017, 02:55:23 AM by misty »

Offline misty

Re: The investigation into the Smith family's sighting
« Reply #126 on: September 26, 2017, 07:34:17 PM »
So why didn't Rebelo, while reviewing the case, discover Crecheman ?

IMO. Because the statement wasn't there to be seen or he never followed up the creche aspect?
« Last Edit: September 26, 2017, 08:22:58 PM by Slartibartfast »

Offline jassi

Re: The investigation into the Smith family's sighting
« Reply #127 on: September 26, 2017, 08:03:07 PM »
If the statement wasn't there how did Redwood find it?
I believe everything. And l believe nothing.
I suspect everyone. And l suspect no one.
I gather the facts, examine the clues... and before   you know it, the case is solved!"

Or maybe not -

OG have been pushed out by the Germans who have reserved all the deck chairs for the foreseeable future

Offline misty

Re: The investigation into the Smith family's sighting
« Reply #128 on: September 26, 2017, 08:04:29 PM »
If the statement wasn't there how did Redwood find it?

HOLMES.

Offline slartibartfast

Re: The investigation into the Smith family's sighting
« Reply #129 on: September 26, 2017, 08:25:27 PM »
HOLMES.

Possibly, but it would be more likely, IMO, that it went directly from LP to OG (Holmes).
“Reasoning will never make a Man correct an ill Opinion, which by Reasoning he never acquired”.

Offline Robittybob1

Re: The investigation into the Smith family's sighting
« Reply #130 on: September 26, 2017, 08:31:25 PM »
Possibly, but it would be more likely, IMO, that it went directly from LP to OG (Holmes).
Like it was never shared with the PJ at all as it came in after the case was closed down in Portugal?
Moderation
John has instructed all moderators to take a very strong line with posters who constantly breach the rules of this forum.  This sniping, goading, name calling and other various forms of disruption will cease.

Offline jassi

Re: The investigation into the Smith family's sighting
« Reply #131 on: September 26, 2017, 08:39:23 PM »
HOLMES.
So it was put on there  the LP right at the beginning, never a paper version in Portugal.
I believe everything. And l believe nothing.
I suspect everyone. And l suspect no one.
I gather the facts, examine the clues... and before   you know it, the case is solved!"

Or maybe not -

OG have been pushed out by the Germans who have reserved all the deck chairs for the foreseeable future

Offline misty

Re: The investigation into the Smith family's sighting
« Reply #132 on: September 26, 2017, 08:45:01 PM »
So it was put on there  the LP right at the beginning, never a paper version in Portugal.

There would have been the paper copy completed by Crecheman, recorded by LP & put onto HOLMES & then it would have been sent to the PJ in some format - otherwise, why bother with questionnaires if the Lead Investigators would never see them?

Offline Robittybob1

Re: The investigation into the Smith family's sighting
« Reply #133 on: September 26, 2017, 08:51:50 PM »
There would have been the paper copy completed by Crecheman, recorded by LP & put onto HOLMES & then it would have been sent to the PJ in some format - otherwise, why bother with questionnaires if the Lead Investigators would never see them?
Could the PJ have filed them in the round bin?
Moderation
John has instructed all moderators to take a very strong line with posters who constantly breach the rules of this forum.  This sniping, goading, name calling and other various forms of disruption will cease.

Offline slartibartfast

Re: The investigation into the Smith family's sighting
« Reply #134 on: September 26, 2017, 08:52:26 PM »
There would have been the paper copy completed by Crecheman, recorded by LP & put onto HOLMES & then it would have been sent to the PJ in some format - otherwise, why bother with questionnaires if the Lead Investigators would never see them?

Maybe LP acted as the PJ are usually accused of and just decided it wasn’t important and filed it.
“Reasoning will never make a Man correct an ill Opinion, which by Reasoning he never acquired”.