General discussion about the latest news (not search related)

[ShiningInLuz]

Luz is abuzz with media reps today.  We passed half a dozen this afternoon.

I talked to the GMB team, and the gist was that the locals are saying nothing.

I have seen part of the look described by Martin Brunt.  Anyone toting a video camera on a tripod, or sporting a media-quality camera gets it.  Minus the friendship.

 

[stephen25000]

If that's the case then why is he somewhat vague in his assessment of the situation?  Moreover why if he was considered for the job of heading up OG did he not actually get the job?   &%+((£

Perhaps he had the common sense not to handle the proverbial hot potato.

[misty]

If that's the case then why is he somewhat vague in his assessment of the situation?  Moreover why if he was considered for the job of heading up OG did he not actually get the job?   &%+((£

He retired from the Met in Jan 2011.
http://www.colinsutton.com/cv.pdf

The review process did not start until May 2011.

[Alfie]

He retired from the Met in Jan 2011.
http://www.colinsutton.com/cv.pdf

The review process did not start until May 2011.

Strange then that he says he was considered for the job, was it a sudden decision to retire when he did I wonder?

[misty]

Strange then that he says he was considered for the job, was it a sudden decision to retire when he did I wonder?

Maybe his post of 4/1/11 goes part way to explaining it. (at the bottom of the page)
http://colinsutton.blogspot.co.uk/2011/

[Alfie]

Maybe his post of 4/1/11 goes part way to explaining it. (at the bottom of the page)
http://colinsutton.blogspot.co.uk/2011/

Interesting, he keeps a blog.  I skimmed a couple of the entries and they both seemed rather critical of the police generally....I wonder why it's taken him 6 years though to dish the supposed dirt on Op Grange - maybe he was keeping his powder dry for the 10th Anniversary media onslaught. 

[John]

What happened to Madeleine McCann? Six key theories.



By Martin Evans
2 MAY 2017

Ten years ago, three-year-old Madeleine McCann vanished from a holiday apartment in Praia da Luz, Portugal sparking one of the largest missing persons hunts in history.

The case sparked an unprecedented level of media interest but a decade later there have still been no definitive breakthroughs and her fate remains unknown.

Although rumours, conspiracies and speculation still run rife, there are a handful of more likely theories behind her disappearance.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/0/happened-madeleine-mccann-six-key-theories/

[John]

How Madeleine McCann's parents refused to share information from their own private investigators after falling out with Portuguese and British police.

• Kate and Gerry McCann still hope to find her ten years after her disappearance
• Leaked report reveals how McCanns' relationship with police hit rock bottom
• Document said: The McCanns have had a turbulent relationship with both Portuguese and UK law enforcement. There is a lack of trust between all parties.'
• Goncalo Amaral claims she was hidden in British woman's coffin and cremated

By Martin Robinson, Uk Chief Reporter For Mailonline
PUBLISHED: 2 May 201

Madeleine McCann's parents fell out with both the Portuguese and British police investigating her disappearance, a leaked report revealed today.
Gerry and Kate McCann's relationship with detectives became so poor that they refused to share information dug up by their own private investigators.

A Home Office report ordered by then Labour minister Alan Johnson before the 2010 election shows that the couple's 'turbulent relationship' with police led to a breakdown in trust.

It says that the McCann's felt badly treated by the Portuguese authorities who closed the investigation into Madeleine's 2007 disappearance.

But when the Met Police came in they then fell out with police in Praia de Luz - and later the McCanns too, the report says.

Mr Johnson wanted to find out if the Met should intervene further in the case so the Child Exploitation and Online Protection Centre investigated.

It was commissioned in late 2009, completed by March 2010 and published in May 2010, MailOnline understands. In May 2011 the Home Office launched the Scotland Yard review of the case. The Met's investigation has cost £11million so far.

The report, seen by Sky News' Martin Brunt, said: 'It is clear that from the beginning the McCanns felt there was a lack of clarity and communication on the part of the Portuguese police.

'Despite the involvement of British consular staff, they were, by their own accounts, left for long periods without any updates or communication with the investigators.

'They state they were taken to the police station on more than one occasion and then left for hours waiting to speak to someone who never materialised.

'They describe this situation as inhumane, with no real consideration for their emotional and physical wellbeing.'

The report also reveals tensions between the Portuguese and British police, with the Met accused of acting 'like a colonial power'.

The report says: 'Clearly, the McCanns have had a turbulent relationship with both Portuguese and UK law enforcement. They now openly acknowledge that there is a distinct lack of trust between all parties.'

The police in Britain and Portugal say they are working together to find Madeleine, who vanished on May 3 2007.

Yesterday it emerged the former Portuguese detective Goncalo Amaral has claimed Madeleine's body was cremated in a TV interview that will add to her parents' anguish.

The detective, one of the leading investigators early in the case, made the wild statement hours after her parents vowed to take him back to court over other claims.

Amaral made his latest statement on a TV documentary to be aired on the 10th anniversary of her disappearance from the Praia da Luz resort in Portugal.


Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4466364/McCanns-wouldn-t-share-information-police.html#ixzz4fxBxfTg3

[misty]

The latest news leaked by who knows, is suggesting a woman was involved in the 'abduction' of young Madeleine.

One has to wonder what her role was. lookout? perpetrator? childless woman desperate for a child of her own? Did she want to care for young Maddie herself?

Hadn't we already decided the woman in purple was JT, as identified by Jez Wilkins?

[John]

Hadn't we already decided the woman in purple was JT, as identified by Jez Wilkins?

Good point misty.  There couldn't have been that many woman walking around block 5 that night dressed in purple.

Jane Tanner was a member of the tapas 9 group of friends

[slartibartfast]

Good point misty.  There couldn't have been that many woman walking around block 5 that night dressed in purple.

Jane Tanner was a member of the tapas 9 group of friends

Surely this can't be the key lead, a woman in purple spotted near 5a, when we already know JT was there on the night?

[misty]

Surely this can't be the key lead, a woman in purple spotted near 5a, when we already know JT was there on the night?

The one thing I didn't think about before when we discussed this was the route JM drove to the Baptista & back home again. Was Rua Dr. Francisco Gentil Martins a one-way street back in May 2007?

[Brietta]

http://library.college.police.uk/docs/npia/Strategic-debrief-operation-task-2009.pdf
[Page 18]

That is the same cite you provided the last time I asked for it ... but since you didn't respond to it you appear either not to have seen it or to have ignored it 
http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=8140.msg401151#msg401151

Please note there is nothing untoward in Kate and Gerry McCann releasing the FLO. 

It is wrong of you to keep posting as if it is. 

If you had read further into the cite you provided you might have ascertained that the limitations imposed on the FLO by Portuguese secrecy laws impeded their function.  A scenario which was obviously apparent to all concerned.

Deploying Family Liaison Officers (FLO) Abroad, pages 28 and 29
http://library.college.police.uk/docs/npia/Strategic-debrief-operation-task-2009.pdf

[misty]

In an interview with Expresso newspaper, the deputy director of the Judiciary Police, Pedro do Carmo, argues that no police in the world could guarantee results different from those obtained so far in Portugal in the case of the disappearance of Madeleine McCann.

"We had never had and did not have a similar case again"

By Hugo Franco
I's a ten year old mystery that still divides the public opinion and intrigues the Portuguese and English authorities that investigate the case. What happened to Madeleine Beth McCann, the 4-year-old English girl who disappeared from the Ocean Club apartment in Praia da luz (Lagos) on the night of May 3, 2007 - 10 years ago the next Wednesday? The Judiciary Police (PJ) has some suspicions and a certainty: it was not the parents, Gerry and Kate McCann, who harmed to the child born in Leicester.

In September 2007, the McCanns were constituted as arguidos by the the Portuguese Justice but in the following year the case was closed for lack of evidence. It was reopened by the PJ in 2013 and continues to be investigated simultaneously with Scotland Yard. To this day, however, despite hundreds of leads and sightings of Maddie, no one was charged or convicted and the girl, who would have been 14 years old, has never been found.

Until the process was archived in 2008, there were three lines of investigation by the Judiciary Police on the case. Hypothesis 1: the parents accidentally killed their daughter and then concealed the body. Hypothesis 2: Maddie was abducted by a group linked to the trafficking of minors and sold for the purpose of sexual exploitation. Hypothesis 3: The child was killed following an abduction that went wrong.

Did the reopening of the case in 2013 open up more investigative lines than the three that were followed at that time?
I cannot speak about the investigation. What I can say is that the PJ remains convinced that there are elements that can still be worked and that can lead to some results. If it is not possible to achieve this result, at least we want to get some answers to the many questions that the case generates. Ultimately, to get to a point where the PJ concludes that there is nothing more that can be done to answer those questions.

Did Scotland Yard's entry into action in the case back in 2011 delivered results?

Since they've also decided to open an investigation, the contacts between the PJ and Metropolitan Police have been regular. There has been a constant exchange of information, which has been positive. This exchange of information remains. It can even be said that the relationship between the two police forces is of great proximity and great collaboration.

The reconstruction of the night of May 3, 2007, as the PJ investigators initially intended, with the presence of the McCanns and their English friends at the scene (that never happened due to the group's lack of willingness to return to Praia da Luz) would it have been essential to better understand what happened to the English girl?

I do not want to talk about what happened up to 2008. This has been sufficiently debated at its appropriate place.

Any idea how many people were heard in total in this case?

No. But certainly several hundred people.

Ten years on after the events at Praia da Luz, why do you think the case is still so much debated?

First because there was a deliberate and legitimate effort on the part of the child's parents in keeping the issue on the agenda of the media. But there are also other elements, such as the circumstances of the disappearance. Ten years later we still do not know what happened, which makes it possible to say, at least in relation to Portugal, that this is a unique case. We had never had one, and we did not have a similar case again. There were other cases of disappearances of children where it was not possible to bring the perpetrators to justice. But in those cases we either caught someone or it was possible for the police to understand what had happened. In this case we are not yet in a position to say what is behind the disappearance. This makes it a unique case. And maybe an extremely rare case worldwide.

Do you hope to know the truth about what happened on the night of May 3, 2007 in Praia da Luz?

Of course that's what motivates us. It is that hope that keeps us working on the investigation.

As you said in a recent interview, the Maddie case is a thorn on the side of the Judiciary Police?

Although I have used this expression into the conversation, it is not the term 'thorn on the side'. It is in the DNA of the Judiciary Police to solve all the crimes that as a duty to investigate. Whenever this does not happen it is something that will not leave us, and can not leave us, satisfied. We are very demanding with our work. In this case, we are not satisfied and remain committed to resolve the case.

Is the PJ still learning from this case ten years on?

We like to learn from every case and we also want to learn from this one. But only after we know what has happened will we be able to draw conclusions from it: understand what we have done well and less well. And we have not yet reached that point. We want to learn lessons from it in its due time.

The English media again insinuates that Portugal continues to be a country that cannot solve a case of this dimension. But the British police have not done better. Can the English public opinion change since Scotland Yard has not been successful, either?

We are not insensitive to others' opinions but our responsibility and commitment is with our fellow citizens. The Portuguese have every reason to be proud and trust their Judiciary Police, which proves on a daily basis its capacity, effectiveness and competence. Difficult cases exist in all countries. The results sometimes take time to arrive and this is also true for all countries. Our expectation is that there is a capacity for everyone to understand that this is so. No police anywhere in the world could guarantee different results.

So would a case like this one have the same results today anywhere else in the world?

I would not say it would have the same results. I would say is that in a case like this one there would be no guarantee of having different results anywhere else in the world. No police in any part of the world could guarantee different results, up to this moment, from those the Judiciary has achieved.

Would the PJ have done something different today in this investigation?

That is a conclusion that we can only reach after the moment we know what has happened or have reached a point where it is not possible to do anything more to clarify the case. And we have not yet reached that point.

Do you think it was a mistake to have the McCann couple constituted as arguidos in September 2007?

Obviously, I will not answer that question. But what I can say, just as I did back in 2011 and 2013, is that Maddie's parents are not suspects. That statement remains: the parents are not suspects. Period.

in Expresso, May 2, 2017

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[Alfie]

"The parents are not suspects.  Period".  I have just subjected this statement to some serious analysis and here are my findings:

Note Pedro de Carmo uses the expression "the parents" and not "the McCanns" - this impersonal way of addressing them indicates a lack of candour, and indicates his less than truthful demeanour.  He then goes on to use the word "suspects" which is clearly quite suspect in itself.  He then cuts off any further discussion by using the blunt riposte "Period" which could be a Freudian reference to menstruation = blood, blood = murder. It's clear following my analysis that de Carmo means "The parents ARE suspects". 

I've just paid $100 to do the statement analysis course so I'm now an authority on the subject.