Is The Tory Party Institutionally Racist....

[Vertigo Swirl]

I’d be interested to know what in Labour’s manifesto you don’t think the public would be interested in ? Re-nationalisation of the railways ? The new Green Deal ? The scrapping of zero hours contracts or the despised UC ? Your thoughts ?

Whether socialist or capitalism I can’t think of one country whose people are tolerant of criminals being treated leniently by their justice system. Care to expand ?

As to Britain being a tolerant country https://www.independent.co.uk/voices/editorials/the-uk-has-a-long-way-to-go-before-becoming-a-tolerant-multicultural-society-a7196021.html

If Labour’s manifesto was so doggone popular you’d have to ask yourself why everyone didn’t vote for it.  Perhaps it boils down to a trust issue with the leadership to deliver their promises?  Just a thought.  No one likes criminals being treated leniently, apart of course from bleeding heart liberals who believe in criminals only serving half their sentences, in ISIS brides being flown home from the middle east to be rehabilitated and given a second chance,  that sort of thing.  Ask most people if foreign born drug dealers and rapists should be deported and I would imagine most Brits would say yes in a second. 

[faithlilly]

If Labour’s manifesto was so doggone popular you’d have to ask yourself why everyone didn’t vote for it.  Perhaps it boils down to a trust issue with the leadership to deliver their promises?  Just a thought.  No one likes criminals being treated leniently, apart of course from bleeding heart liberals who believe in criminals only serving half their sentences, in ISIS brides being flown home from the middle east to be rehabilitated and given a second chance,  that sort of thing.  Ask most people if foreign born drug dealers and rapists should be deported and I would imagine most Brits would say yes in a second.

I’m sorry but exactly what policy of Labour’s ‘socialist’ manifesto didn’t the public like ?

The last two terror attacks where perpetrated after 10 years of Tory rule. They can now bring in emergency legislation to deal with the early release of terrorist prisoners so why not in the last 10 years ? Further Nazir Afzal warned that the country needed a proper deradicalisation programme but was told by Johnson that there was not enough money.

I’ve always found it very strange that while it is accepted that the poor white girls of 13, 14, 15 were groomed by older men during the Oxford, Rotherham scandals yet no such sympathy is given to the 15 year old Muslim girl groomed by one of the most sophisticated terror networks the world has ever seen. Can you explain that ?

https://www.wired.co.uk/article/deradicalisation-terrorism-daniel-koehler


Who were the foreign drug dealers and rapists that were being deported ? One of the young men deported last year had
been convicted of dangerous driving and spent seven months in prison. Does that really deserve that he be ripped from his family and his home ?

[Vertigo Swirl]

I’m sorry but exactly what policy of Labour’s ‘socialist’ manifesto didn’t the public like ?

The last two terror attacks where perpetrated after 10 years of Tory rule. They can now bring in emergency legislation to deal with the early release of terrorist prisoners so why not in the last 10 years ? Further Nazir Afzal warned that the country needed a proper deradicalisation programme but was told by Johnson that there was not enough money.

I’ve always found it very strange that while it is accepted that the poor white girls of 13, 14, 15 were groomed by older men during the Oxford, Rotherham scandals yet no such sympathy is given to the 15 year old Muslim girl groomed by one of the most sophisticated terror networks the world has ever seen. Can you explain that ?

https://www.wired.co.uk/article/deradicalisation-terrorism-daniel-koehler


Who were the foreign drug dealers and rapists that were being deported ? One of the young men deported last year had
been convicted of dangerous driving and spent seven months in prison. Does that really deserve that he be ripped from his family and his home ?

Yes, you’re definitely one of the bleeding heart liberals that I’m talking about.  I am too about many things  so don’t ask me, people hold all sorts of views I find inexplicable or contrary to mine, but they are entitled to their views and many of them seem far more popular than mine, so what can you do?

[Vertigo Swirl]

not a good move.  An example of the kind of socially progressive thing that people in the UK really aren’t tolerant of, and one which really tries my own liberal sensibilities



“Rebecca Long Bailey, seeking the Labour leadership, has reached for the transgender issue. Via Twitter — the worst possible medium for discussing these questions — she has endorsed the Labour Campaign for Trans Rights manifesto.

The manifesto condemns as a “hate group” Women’s Place UK, a grassroots movement founded by lifelong Labour feminists. It holds public meetings to discuss new laws that could allow any male-born person who felt so inclined to be legally treated as female and thus gain access to the services, spaces and rights that the law at present reserves for women.

To some trans activists, even suggesting that new laws can create tension is transphobic. Since they believe “trans women are women”, admitting them (and, in some cases, their penises) to women’s refuges, changing rooms and prisons is no different to admitting biological women. The manifesto demands that anyone who dissents (perhaps by suggesting that differences in anatomy matter) be expelled from Labour.

Long Bailey may calculate that this plays well with some Labour members, although the thousands of them tweeting #expelme following her move suggests not all are yet signed up to identity politics and witch-hunting”.

[faithlilly]

not a good move.  An example of the kind of socially progressive thing that people in the UK really aren’t tolerant of, and one which really tries my own liberal sensibilities



“Rebecca Long Bailey, seeking the Labour leadership, has reached for the transgender issue. Via Twitter — the worst possible medium for discussing these questions — she has endorsed the Labour Campaign for Trans Rights manifesto.

The manifesto condemns as a “hate group” Women’s Place UK, a grassroots movement founded by lifelong Labour feminists. It holds public meetings to discuss new laws that could allow any male-born person who felt so inclined to be legally treated as female and thus gain access to the services, spaces and rights that the law at present reserves for women.

To some trans activists, even suggesting that new laws can create tension is transphobic. Since they believe “trans women are women”, admitting them (and, in some cases, their penises) to women’s refuges, changing rooms and prisons is no different to admitting biological women. The manifesto demands that anyone who dissents (perhaps by suggesting that differences in anatomy matter) be expelled from Labour.

Long Bailey may calculate that this plays well with some Labour members, although the thousands of them tweeting #expelme following her move suggests not all are yet signed up to identity politics and witch-hunting”.

Like the [ censored word]emitism issue I think that this won’t even cross most voters minds when voting.

[Vertigo Swirl]

Like the [ censored word]emitism issue I think that this won’t even cross most voters minds when voting.

It doesn’t help though does it?  Not that she’s likely to be the next Labour leader thankfully.

[faithlilly]

It doesn’t help though does it?  Not that she’s likely to be the next Labour leader thankfully.

No it doesn’t. This really is not what her focus should be.

[Vertigo Swirl]

No it doesn’t. This really is not what her focus should be.

Nandy’s jumped on the bandwagon too.

[faithlilly]

Nandy’s jumped on the bandwagon too.

These are things that concern Labour’s new urban voters. They are not going to win back their traditional voters.

[Vertigo Swirl]

These are things that concern Labour’s new urban voters. They are not going to win back their traditional voters.

Well exactly. When are they going to realise this?  Are they thick or something?

[faithlilly]

Well exactly. When are they going to realise this?  Are they thick or something?

I’m not sure what’s going on tbh. They seem to be trying to be all things to all men ( and women) but failing to please anyone.

[Eleanor]

This has got to be my opportunity to put forward my ideas as a working class ignoramus with pretentions.

I do not believe that The Tory Party is Institutionally Racist.  I have always supported them so they can't be.  And it caused mayhem in our house when I said I had voted for them.
Besides, voting Tory was my first step up into The Upper Classes.  I never quite made it, but I put up a good front.  Most of the people I know in Real Life think I went to Roedean.  This might suggest that they are easily fooled.

Transgender Men are only Women in my book once they have gone the whole hog and had It chopped off.  They might then be safe around women in All Female situations.

No Woman with half a brain wants to be a Man unless seriously disturbed.  So end of that one.

ISIS Brides?  Shamima Begum was only fifteen so might not have realised what she was getting into.  But she was savvy enough to steal the money for her air fare and her sister's passport and to organise her escape.  And then to marry a Terrorist that someone else chose for her.  While I thought these girls wanted to make their own choices.  Something not quite right here.

Oh, and then it all got a bit horrid because ISIS Lost.  So she is either deranged or manipulative.  Either is not a good idea.
 
Brexit.  I have long believed that Brexit is Best for Britain.  But since I don't live in Britain and haven't for a very long time it is probably none of my business.

[ censored word]emitism remains my one big horror story.  I have known a lot of Jews in my life time and I will never understand it.  I don't even know what it means.  And I don't think [ censored word]emites  do either.

[steve_trousers]

The conservative party have shown they are the real representatives of working people in Britain today.
Labour failed to listen to their working class voters, two thirds of whom voted for Brexit. The majority of their MP's then pressured Corbyn into a 2nd referendum stance that their constituents didn't want.

I don't see anything institutionally racist about them, it's just London labour crying into their beer because they lost. Labour should have got a handle on the blatant anti semitism within their own ranks but chose not to. Another own goal seeing as many Jewish folk supported them.
 

[faithlilly]

This has got to be my opportunity to put forward my ideas as a working class ignoramus with pretentions.

I do not believe that The Tory Party is Institutionally Racist.  I have always supported them so they can't be.  And it caused mayhem in our house when I said I had voted for them.
Besides, voting Tory was my first step up into The Upper Classes.  I never quite made it, but I put up a good front.  Most of the people I know in Real Life think I went to Roedean.  This might suggest that they are easily fooled.

Transgender Men are only Women in my book once they have gone the whole hog and had It chopped off.  They might then be safe around women in All Female situations.

No Woman with half a brain wants to be a Man unless seriously disturbed.  So end of that one.

ISIS Brides?  Shamima Begum was only fifteen so might not have realised what she was getting into.  But she was savvy enough to steal the money for her air fare and her sister's passport and to organise her escape.  And then to marry a Terrorist that someone else chose for her.  While I thought these girls wanted to make their own choices.  Something not quite right here.

Oh, and then it all got a bit horrid because ISIS Lost.  So she is either deranged or manipulative.  Either is not a good idea.
 
Brexit.  I have long believed that Brexit is Best for Britain.  But since I don't live in Britain and haven't for a very long time it is probably none of my business.

[ censored word]emitism remains my one big horror story.  I have known a lot of Jews in my life time and I will never understand it.  I don't even know what it means.  And I don't think [ censored word]emites  do either.

Thank you Eleanor...very interesting answers....a few questions.

Do you think it’s possible for the Tories to be institutionally racist but as you are simply a voter and not a member it might have slipped by you ? Many voters simply avail themselves of the information they needed to make a, hopefully, informed choice but no more.

Do you think the poor girls groomed in the Oxford and Rotherham grooming scandal where somehow complicit in their own abuse simply because they drank the alcohol offered, took the drugs offered, lied to their parents etc etc ? There are cases of young girl being sexually groomed on line, taking their passports and arranging to run away. Are the complicit in their own abuse ? Isn’t grooming grooming whether it’s to run away to join a terrorist organisation or your far older abuser ?

Brexit....we will just have to wait and see.

[ censored word]emitism is abhorrent and so is any kind of racism. Are we to ignore the sort that lead to the deportations to Jamaica this week, while mourning the bullying of our Jewish neighbours ? I think Corbyn put it excellently this week when he asked Johnson if a foreign born, white man who took cocaine should face deportation ? It’s the double standard that appalls me.

[faithlilly]

The conservative party have shown they are the real representatives of working people in Britain today.
Labour failed to listen to their working class voters, two thirds of whom voted for Brexit. The majority of their MP's then pressured Corbyn into a 2nd referendum stance that their constituents didn't want.

I don't see anything institutionally racist about them, it's just London labour crying into their beer because they lost. Labour should have got a handle on the blatant anti semitism within their own ranks but chose not to. Another own goal seeing as many Jewish folk supported them.

I agree, Brexit lost Labour the election but that certainly doesn’t mean that the Tory party has those voters best interests at heart. They were a means to an end and I do pity the poor souls who think otherwise.

There are around 300,000 Jewish people in the UK...many of them Labour members and many of them voted for Labour and I’m afraid you are sadly deluded if you think the the red wall fell because Labour were accused of being [ censored word]emitic. Do your research....three Conservative MPs were accused of [ censored word]emitism in the election campaign...two of who are still members of the party...now tell me how Labour aren’t getting a handle on claims of [ censored word]emitism.