Did Jeremy Bamber exhibit psychopathic tendencies?

[Nicholas]

Too many people who had direct contact with Jeremy Bamber have made the same claim that he had psychopathic tendencies. He has never accepted this and now he has probably grown out of it in middle age and will never accept it just as he doesn't have the savvy to put his hands up to the killings which would stand him in good stead in the future. His continual denial isn't fooling anyone but then he knows that if he admits to murdering his adoptive nephews in cold blood he would present as a target in prison.

How has Bamber ‘grown out’ of his psychopathy? He’ll always be a psychopath - there’s no known cure

[APRIL]

Too many people who had direct contact with Jeremy Bamber have made the same claim that he had psychopathic tendencies. He has never accepted this and now he has probably grown out of it in middle age and will never accept it just as he doesn't have the savvy to put his hands up to the killings.

I just find myself wondering what is meant by "They grow out of it"? I mean, how is it possible to suddenly develop a conscience, empathy? After a life-time of not knowing what emotion is, it must scare s**t out of them. Do they then confess to all their past crimes, or does "growing out of it" cause amnesia? Whilst I concede that the opportunities, with age, become less for them to practice psychopathy, I'm inclined to think once a psychopath, always a psychopath.

[Caroline]

Caroline, that's not my argument. I'm more inclined to see Sheila as hating herself rather than hating her mother. Even towards the end of her life, she claimed to have accepted God because it would help her relationship with June. To me, it sounds like a child craving affection. Whilst I have no ideas what "normal" is, you'd be really amazed at the number of people who talk to me about being "normal, like us"!!!!

Yes, I know, I didn't mean it was your argument - but it is insinuated by many.

[Caroline]

I just find myself wondering what is meant by "They grow out of it"? I mean, how is it possible to suddenly develop a conscience, empathy? After a life-time of not knowing what emotion is, it must scare s**t out of them. Do they then confess to all their past crimes, or does "growing out of it" cause amnesia? Whilst I concede that the opportunities, with age, become less for them to practice psychopathy, I'm inclined to think once a psychopath, always a psychopath.

You can't grow out of it and the fact that he still deny's responsibility and craves attention is testament to it.

[Holly Goodhead]

Dr Ferguson never gave an opinion on Jeremy Bamber except to say Sheila had no problem with him.

The mention of a defence psychiatrist by CAL was taken fron Blood Relations by Roger Wilkes. Perhaps this man's name is in that book? I don't have it. Rather scarily, he is reported to have seen Jeremy's 'very real belief that he didn't commit the crimes' as the main sign of his psychopathy.

No there's no name in RW's book.  It's just as you've posted. Those who believe JB guilty are desparate for a psychopathy diagnosis hidden away in a dusty file somewhere. It's the equivalent of the CT wanting to make something out of sloppy paperwork. 

It could be worse though, Stefan Kiszko was diagnosed by a forensic psychologist in prison as suffering from "delusions of innocence".

[Holly Goodhead]

Too many people who had direct contact with Jeremy Bamber have made the same claim that he had psychopathic tendencies. He has never accepted this and now he has probably grown out of it in middle age and will never accept it just as he doesn't have the savvy to put his hands up to the killings which would stand him in good stead in the future. His continual denial isn't fooling anyone but then he knows that if he admits to murdering his adoptive nephews in cold blood he would present as a target in prison so woukd end up in isolation.

I assume these people are competent and qualified to make a psychopathy diagnosis?

[mrswah]

Are you suggesting that Nevill was in full knowledge of June's mental instability and disregarded how it would effect children in her care? Might it have simply been that after years of living with the unhappiness caused by her 'disappointments' he believed that babies would be the answer to her well being?

I can believe that.

[Holly Goodhead]

Holly will be saying next that it was all June's fault that the two adopted children grew up 'damaged'.

CC certainly thought so.  He made numerous references to this in his book and even went as far as saying he could have murdered June.

In a letter he drafted to NB he said:

I will not allow her to fcuk up the minds of my children in the way I suspect she has your daughter.

[Holly Goodhead]

I can believe that.

But NB saw it all go horribly wrong with SC and still they went ahead and adopted JB.

SC should have been removed from their care when June became severely depressed in 1959 due to her decision to adopt SC in 1957.  The authorities should have moved in taken SC and prevented the Bambers from adopting further children. 

[mrswah]

Anyway back to the OP, CC was taking the twins to see SC but it seems they were in effect supervised visits with CC present.

According to CC he was told by Dr F SC was likely to suffer with her illness at increasing intervals and Dr F inferred a poor outlook. The twins were only just 6 yoa so needed taking care of for at least the next 12 years.  The Bamber's were not getting younger.

CC certainly realised SC was no longer able to care for the twins and that wasn't going to change.  He had no intention in letting SC becoming main carer again.

We know from CC's mother wit stat June expressed her concerns that through SC's illness the twins might be fostered.  Maybe June was simply sounding out CC's mother

I don't see why anyone doubts the Bamber's were initiating conversations about the twins future?

IMO, it's because Jeremy said they were, and some people believe that, because Jeremy lied about some things, he lied about everything!

[Holly Goodhead]

IMO, it's because Jeremy said they were, and some people believe that, because Jeremy lied about some things, he lied about everything!

I'm not sure he has lied?  I could go through all the witnesses statements etc and highlight anomalies and inconsistencies.

[mrswah]

It sounds entirely possible to me.  June was obviously damaged.

Colin implies, in his book, that growing up with Nevill and June may not have been very beneficial to  either Jeremy or Sheila .

[mrswah]

But NB saw it all go horribly wrong with SC and still they went ahead and adopted JB.

SC should have been removed from their care when June became severely depressed in 1959 due to her decision to adopt SC in 1957.  The authorities should have moved in taken SC and prevented the Bambers from adopting further children.

I suppose he hoped June would recover, and that there would be no recurrence of her illness. I don't know how much of a part Nevill actually took in the upbringing of his children.

[Holly Goodhead]

Colin implies, in his book, that growing up with Nevill and June may not have been very beneficial to  either Jeremy or Sheila .

The outcomes prove him right. 

[Eleanor]

Some sensible conclusions.  Sadly not implemented.