Author Topic: Did Jeremy Bamber exhibit psychopathic tendencies?  (Read 26632 times)

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Offline Caroline

Re: Did Jeremy Bamber exhibit psychopathic tendencies?
« Reply #120 on: April 30, 2020, 11:57:04 AM »
How can they be my 'projections' when Afaik noone in my adoptive family (or birth family) has ever suffered any mental illness or been involved in any criminality.

Surely any right thinking person would preclude a woman with June's history of mental illness from adopting?

So should people with mental illness be stopped from having biological children? There is no question that June had issues, but many parents do. I wonder if things may have been different if neither Sheila or Jeremy found out they were adopted?

Offline Nicholas

Re: Did Jeremy Bamber exhibit psychopathic tendencies?
« Reply #121 on: April 30, 2020, 12:03:24 PM »
There are several possibilities. Firstly, mental health may not have been part of the Adoption Society's screening process. Secondly, June's psychiatrist at the time may have been approached and his response may have been encouraging. Thirdly June's mental health problems may not have been mentioned.

 8((()*/
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: Did Jeremy Bamber exhibit psychopathic tendencies?
« Reply #122 on: April 30, 2020, 12:04:16 PM »
Those close to SC eg CC and Freddie describe a toxic relationship. 

What time frame are you referring to ?
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: Did Jeremy Bamber exhibit psychopathic tendencies?
« Reply #123 on: April 30, 2020, 12:08:31 PM »
The psych eval referred to by RW was an off the cuff comment from a psychiatrist who was apparently in defence counsel Chambers shortly before trial.  Firstly we only have the authors words and interpretation.  Secondly it may well have come from the psychiatrist instructed by the defence Dr Bradley.

 *%87
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: Did Jeremy Bamber exhibit psychopathic tendencies?
« Reply #124 on: April 30, 2020, 12:10:10 PM »
Who classified JB as a psychopath?  When?  Where?  How?

Pre trial - when he was on remand - in prison

Case papers, meeting with Bamber - various sources

It’ll all be in his prison assessment file
« Last Edit: April 30, 2020, 12:15:19 PM by Nicholas »
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: Did Jeremy Bamber exhibit psychopathic tendencies?
« Reply #125 on: April 30, 2020, 12:17:08 PM »
I'm not so sure he isn't just feigning it to stay in hospital.  Harry Ogden was junior counsel for the prosecution at PS' trial and recounts cross examining him, asking how, if he was hearing voices commanding him to kill, those voices only spoke to him on Friday and Saturdays when Sonja was at work.   *%87

And 4 psychiatrist brought into this  *&^^&
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline APRIL

Re: Did Jeremy Bamber exhibit psychopathic tendencies?
« Reply #126 on: April 30, 2020, 12:19:52 PM »
The psych eval referred to by RW was an off the cuff comment from a psychiatrist who was apparently in defence counsel Chambers shortly before trial.  Firstly we only have the authors words and interpretation.  Secondly it may well have come from the psychiatrist instructed by the defence Dr Bradley.


Not certain what you mean, here. Are you dismissing, out of hand, because it's not 'evidence', anything said by psychiatrists who dare to suggest that Jeremy is a psychopath? Surely not?

Offline Nicholas

Re: Did Jeremy Bamber exhibit psychopathic tendencies?
« Reply #127 on: April 30, 2020, 12:25:02 PM »

Prisoners have been known to feign mental illness so as to get a more comfortable environment
And feign ‘normalcy’
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Did Jeremy Bamber exhibit psychopathic tendencies?
« Reply #128 on: April 30, 2020, 12:26:25 PM »
So should people with mental illness be stopped from having biological children? There is no question that June had issues, but many parents do. I wonder if things may have been different if neither Sheila or Jeremy found out they were adopted?

Anyone who is over 16 can procreate and bring children into the world.  If children are at risk of abuse in all its form SS will intervene and have the power to remove birth children from their biological parents.

Adoption is different.  Adoptive parents have to apply to adopt and meet certain criteria.  A court has to rubber stamp the adoption otder.  Once the adoption is made legal adoptive parents and adopted children are in the eyes of the law treated exactly the same as birth parents/children and SS have the same powers to intervene if it is thought the children are at risk of abuse in all its forms.

You seem to be saying you think it best if families created by adoption live in denial? 
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Nicholas

Re: Did Jeremy Bamber exhibit psychopathic tendencies?
« Reply #129 on: April 30, 2020, 12:27:13 PM »

I haven’t got CAL’s book to hand, but three men who lived at WHF in the 1800s and early 1900s all killed themselves.

One took arsenic, I believe

One drowned himself in a big water butt

And one shot himself dead by tying string to his toe and the trigger of a rifle, then clenching his foot to fire it. That one lived on the farm but not in the house. The other two lived in the house.

I’m not sure, but I think they were related to June in some way...it’s at the very beginning of the book

What did Bamber know of the history of WHF - what did his parents tell him?
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Nicholas

Re: Did Jeremy Bamber exhibit psychopathic tendencies?
« Reply #130 on: April 30, 2020, 12:28:52 PM »
Or cop a plea on diminished responsibility.

Huntley tried it, pretending to be catatonic and literally dribbling but seemed to make a remarkable recovery when he thought no one was watching.

Anyway, I'm not convinced that psych evals can't be fooled by a more clever and cunning person. Mrs W makes an excellent point about PS having a familiar example to mimic.

Psychopaths are renowned for mirroring others
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Caroline

Re: Did Jeremy Bamber exhibit psychopathic tendencies?
« Reply #131 on: April 30, 2020, 12:30:20 PM »
Psychopaths are renowned for mirroring others

That's really all they have to go on.

Offline Holly Goodhead

Re: Did Jeremy Bamber exhibit psychopathic tendencies?
« Reply #132 on: April 30, 2020, 12:31:09 PM »
JB was never involved in ‘any criminality’ !

I thought he admitted to breaking into OCP and was found guilty in a court of law of mass murder by a majority verdict of 10/2 in 1986 and remains in prison to this day?

I believe he also grew cannabis for own use and distributed it for profit although the authorities didn't seem to want to pursue this unlike OCP.
Just my opinion of course but Jeremy Bamber is innocent and a couple from UK, unknown to T9, abducted Madeleine McCann - motive unknown.  Was J J murdered as a result of identifying as a goth?

Offline Nicholas

Re: Did Jeremy Bamber exhibit psychopathic tendencies?
« Reply #133 on: April 30, 2020, 12:31:48 PM »
That's really all they have to go on.

“A psychopath will mirror your identity at the beginning, middle and end of a relationship, only in different ways at each stage. Initially, in order to win you over, he will pretend to be like you and to like everything about you. Robert Hare and Paul Babiak describe in Snakes in Suits how during the “assessment phase” of the relationship a psychopath will convey to his target four main messages: 1) I like you; 2) I share your interests; 3) I’m like you, and 4) I’m the perfect partner or soul mate for you.
This process constitutes the mirroring phase of the psychopathic bond. Granted, most romantic relationships entail some aspects of mirroring. After all, that’s how couples discover their points in common. But with a psychopath the reflection tends to be instant and total. It’s a simulated bonding that’s way too fast, too soon and too good to be true. This happens before any real emotional connection can take place. It occurs before the partners have gotten to know each other well, over time and in different circumstances. Instant bonding is usually a symptom of shallowness of emotions rather than of miraculous compatibility. It means that the psychopath will detach from you and latch on to another target as easily as he initially attached to you. Yet through their conversational glibness and innate charm, as well as through their extraordinary capacity to identify and reflect your deepest desires, psychopaths can initially make you feel like they’re your dream come true. They present themselves as the only partners who could possibly fulfill whatever’s been missing from your life.
During the course of the relationship, however, the psychopath reveals more and more his true colors. He becomes increasingly critical and controlling. What’s more, he also incites you to go along with his wrongdoings. That way you mirror his ugly personality and become his accomplice. His message switches from being “I’m just like you” (as moral, smart, kind, beautiful, ideal as you are) as it was during the luring phase to being “you’re just like me” (as deceitful, malicious, dishonest as you begin to see that he is). Keep in mind that, most likely, you’re not.  Even if you’ve engaged in some wrongdoings, unless you thrive on pathological lying, promiscuity as a means of domination of others, playing mind games, harming others and power games you’re not likely to be a psychopath, like him.
When you’ve finally had enough and leave the psychopath–or when he leaves you–he will see you as a devalued, distorted mirror image of himself and of your former, idealized, self as well. Every quality he initially saw in you–from beauty to brains–will be turned into its opposite. If he saw you as smart, you’re now stupid in his eyes. If he was attracted to your beauty, he now sees you as ugly. If he admired your hard work, he now views your efforts as a mindless submission to the system. As I’ve explained in the previous post about the process of idealize, devalue and discard, this negative mirroring at the end is a natural and inevitable unfolding of the psychopathic relationship.
Just as the idealized mirror image at the beginning of the psychopathic bond had little to do with your qualities–they were false compliments intended to lure you–so the de-idealized mirror image at the end has nothing to do with you either. These distorted mirroring effects have everything to do with the character deficiencies of the psychopath himself, who suffers from an incurable evil. Which, incidentally, is a good way to describe the middle mirroring phase as well: when he says you, or all human beings, are like him, remember that’s not true either.  A psychopath is different from–and far worse than–just about any human being you will ever know.
Claudia Moscovici, psychopathyawareness
https://psychopathyawareness.wordpress.com/2011/01/20/the-psychopaths-mirroring-effects/
Who wants to take on this great massive lie?” Writer Martin Preib on the tsunami of innocence fraud sweeping our nation

Offline Caroline

Re: Did Jeremy Bamber exhibit psychopathic tendencies?
« Reply #134 on: April 30, 2020, 12:32:42 PM »
“A psychopath will mirror your identity at the beginning, middle and end of a relationship, only in different ways at each stage. Initially, in order to win you over, he will pretend to be like you and to like everything about you. Robert Hare and Paul Babiak describe in Snakes in Suits how during the “assessment phase” of the relationship a psychopath will convey to his target four main messages: 1) I like you; 2) I share your interests; 3) I’m like you, and 4) I’m the perfect partner or soul mate for you.
This process constitutes the mirroring phase of the psychopathic bond. Granted, most romantic relationships entail some aspects of mirroring. After all, that’s how couples discover their points in common. But with a psychopath the reflection tends to be instant and total. It’s a simulated bonding that’s way too fast, too soon and too good to be true. This happens before any real emotional connection can take place. It occurs before the partners have gotten to know each other well, over time and in different circumstances. Instant bonding is usually a symptom of shallowness of emotions rather than of miraculous compatibility. It means that the psychopath will detach from you and latch on to another target as easily as he initially attached to you. Yet through their conversational glibness and innate charm, as well as through their extraordinary capacity to identify and reflect your deepest desires, psychopaths can initially make you feel like they’re your dream come true. They present themselves as the only partners who could possibly fulfill whatever’s been missing from your life.
During the course of the relationship, however, the psychopath reveals more and more his true colors. He becomes increasingly critical and controlling. What’s more, he also incites you to go along with his wrongdoings. That way you mirror his ugly personality and become his accomplice. His message switches from being “I’m just like you” (as moral, smart, kind, beautiful, ideal as you are) as it was during the luring phase to being “you’re just like me” (as deceitful, malicious, dishonest as you begin to see that he is). Keep in mind that, most likely, you’re not.  Even if you’ve engaged in some wrongdoings, unless you thrive on pathological lying, promiscuity as a means of domination of others, playing mind games, harming others and power games you’re not likely to be a psychopath, like him.
When you’ve finally had enough and leave the psychopath–or when he leaves you–he will see you as a devalued, distorted mirror image of himself and of your former, idealized, self as well. Every quality he initially saw in you–from beauty to brains–will be turned into its opposite. If he saw you as smart, you’re now stupid in his eyes. If he was attracted to your beauty, he now sees you as ugly. If he admired your hard work, he now views your efforts as a mindless submission to the system. As I’ve explained in the previous post about the process of idealize, devalue and discard, this negative mirroring at the end is a natural and inevitable unfolding of the psychopathic relationship.
Just as the idealized mirror image at the beginning of the psychopathic bond had little to do with your qualities–they were false compliments intended to lure you–so the de-idealized mirror image at the end has nothing to do with you either. These distorted mirroring effects have everything to do with the character deficiencies of the psychopath himself, who suffers from an incurable evil. Which, incidentally, is a good way to describe the middle mirroring phase as well: when he says you, or all human beings, are like him, remember that’s not true either.  A psychopath is different from–and far worse than–just about any human being you will ever know.
Claudia Moscovici, psychopathyawareness

Will read this later but I've known a few.