If the man Jane Tanner saw was the abductor, how long did he have ?

[AnneGuedes]

In FULL VIEW of all the surrounding apartments & street?

No full view, it was dark and the surrounding apartments weren't not occupied. Only Mrs Fenn, if by chance she had looked during a few minutes.

[faithlilly]

Have you looked at the photos of those apartments? FULL view from the street, in a rather busy holiday resort at dinner time, FULL view from the surrounding apartments where people in those apartments were most likely having dinners ON those balconies & NOBODY noticed a dead child in the flowerbed? Utterly insane proposition.

http://www.mccannfiles.com/id129.html


There is a photo of the area of the flowerbed about a third of the way down the page I have posted the link to. I'm sure you'll agree it was a very concealed spot.

[Mrs. B]

No, the 5A "garden" was in full view of the street & being a 1st floor apartment it was also in full view of all the apartments on higher floors of the ENTIRE surrounding area. Not concealed at all.

[AnneGuedes]

We've already gone through this. Gerry McCann is not superman, he can't be in two places at the same time. Apart from that, nobody has come up with a single good argument, let alone proof, that any of the Tapas group, (some friends, some mere acquaintances of the McCanns) were LYING in their witness statements to police. Without providing proof that they WERE lying, their witness statements are as valid as those of anyone else.

Here you go http://miscarriageofjustice.co/index.php?topic=1234.0

Superman has a ubiquity gift ?
Who says the Tapas group lied ? Even Magalhaes e Menezes spoke of un-truths !
I'm pretty sure none of them would have stated Mr McCann was sitting at the table if he wasn't. Imagine he had left because, for instance, he suddenly remembered he had forgotten his sunglasses near the pool, they certainly would have told it.

[AnneGuedes]

No, the 5A "garden" was in full view of the street & being a 1st floor apartment it was also in full view of all the apartments on higher floors of the ENTIRE surrounding area. Not concealed at all.

I've been there, have you ?

[Mrs. B]

Superman has a ubiquity gift ?
Who says the Tapas group lied ? Even Magalhaes e Menezes spoke of un-truths !
I'm pretty sure none of them would have stated Mr McCann was sitting at the table if he wasn't. Imagine he had left because, for instance, he suddenly remembered he had forgotten his sunglasses near the pool, they certainly would have told it.

Some here clearly ARE implying that all of the witnesses at the McCann table are to be distrusted as they are not "independent" i.e. they are implying that they are dishonest and that their witness statements therefore are to be discounted. It's simply not acceptable to do so, legally & even morally, without providing firm proof that they are indeed lying.

[Mrs. B]

I've been there, have you ?

I've been in the area once or twice years ago, yes, why do you need to know? The pictures show enough, don't you think?

[Carana]

So when do you think the window was opened ? Before Gerry entered the apartment in case the abductor needed an escape route or after, when there was a perfectly accessible, and less conspicuous, door to use ?

Window and shutters?

The window may have been open (or partially open) at that stage without the shutters lifted (too much noise to alert someone coming up the steps and not enough time to get out anyway).

What disturbs me is that the window / shutter issue could have been a red herring for anyone who could have been traced to a key. Not necessarily a staff member, but someone associated with one; or quite simply someone who could have stolen various keys, made copies and put them back where they were supposed to be before the person who had legitimate access noticed.

What disturbs me further is that the investigation seemed more interested in where the photographic paper came from (a legitimate line of inquiry, but which could have been easily resolved much earlier) than duplicate key issues.

[Lace]

It's been said a million times but obviously it's worth saying again. There are no independent witnesses that put Gerry at the tapas table at the time of the Smith sighting.

Except that according to Dianne Webster's statement,  Kate came running to the table and said 'she's gone GERRY'  now why would she say that if Gerry was not there?

[Mrs. B]

No full view, it was dark and the surrounding apartments weren't not occupied. Only Mrs Fenn, if by chance she had looked during a few minutes.

Simply not true - you really can't go on accusing ALL witnesses of lying, you know.

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/347692/Maddie-McCann-may-have-been-watched-from-balcony-witness-tells-Yard

[Lace]

Gerry could have taken the clothes he had worn that night home with him.

Contamination from a an item that had been in contact with the body.

A fall from the small balcony into the garden, where the body was discovered.

The area behind the back of the sofa was alerted to by both Eddie and Keela.

So,  Gerry disposes of the clothes he was wearing, but doesn't dispose of Kate's?   Doesn't dispose of Cuddle Cat?
Doesn't dispose of the tee shirt that came in contact with the body?

[ferryman]

The area behind the back of the sofa was alerted to by both Eddie and Keela.

What did Keela react to?

[Mrs. B]

Window and shutters?

The window may have been open (or partially open) at that stage without the shutters lifted (too much noise to alert someone coming up the steps and not enough time to get out anyway).

What disturbs me is that the window / shutter issue could have been a red herring for anyone who could have been traced to a key. Not necessarily a staff member, but someone associated with one; or quite simply someone who could have stolen various keys, made copies and put them back where they were supposed to be before the person who had legitimate access noticed.

What disturbs me further is that the investigation seemed more interested in where the photographic paper came from (a legitimate line of inquiry, but which could have been easily resolved much earlier) than duplicate key issues.

You know, the lack of investigation into the key issue has disturbed me from the very start. Not to mention that cleaning staff appears to be able to enter the apartments even when keys were IN the locks on the inside.

We noticed that the cleaning personnel entered the apartment after one knock and did not give us time to respond. This was a bit bothersome and for this reason we would lock the door, and would leave the key in the inside lock.

After this precaution, the next day, the same thing happened and the cleaning woman entered even though the door was locked with the key in the lock.

We never found out how it was possible for a cleaning woman to enter after we had tried to prevent it.

http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/CARLO-D_AMBROSIO.htm

[ferryman]

It was suggested that Mrs Fenn's intruder might have let himself in with a key ...

[AnneGuedes]

I've been in the area once or twice years ago, yes, why do you need to know? The pictures show enough, don't you think?

No, I don't think they do.
Only someone passing the gate would see a child on a flowerbed in the darkness of the patio, if the child had light colour clothes on.