Wandering Off Topic

[Wonderfulspam]

There would have been several bins between the Apartment and beyond the spot where Smithman was seen so it is a mystery why it would have been necessary to move the body a further few hundred metres down from the wasteland.  Actually it?s not a mystery at all. It had to be a bin to explain why no body was ever found and it had to be moved twice to explain why the rest of the Tapas group found no body when they dashed to the Apartment after the alarm was raised.  Unfortunately there is not a smidge of evidence for bin or wasteland disposal.  It?s all guesswork, and not very logical guesswork at that.

Yep, just ignore everything else VS. The questionable open window, the major discrepancy in the timeline you can't explain, the sighting of coincidental trousers & long sleeves man & child. Forget all the evidence, pick at the theory. The thing about theories is they need to account for as much of the known evidence as possible. My theory can account for quite a lot of the details. Your theory excludes inconvenient details & accounts for nothing at all really.

[Wonderfulspam]

The strangely moving door on Gerry's unusually long 9pm check. The strangely moving door on Kate's check. The exclusion of the blowing curtains slamming door claims from Kate's initial statement. Why Mr McCann gave a ridiculously long time for Kate's check. Why the Gerrylike man had button trousers, why the child had long sleeves, why she was noticeably disabled. I can account for things like that. I've not seen too many abduction theories accounting for all these details.

[Wonderfulspam]

Coincidental Gerrylike trousers man with his visibly disabled Madeleine twin, struggling down the road off into the night never to be seen again, at around the same time Brueckner was dragging Maddie out of the window & into his Winnebago. An unfortunate sequence of coincidence obviously.

[Joe Blogs]

There are 5 people searching in the immediate aftermath of Kate raising the alarm.

Fiona, Matt, David, Russell, Gerry.

Dianne stays at the table.

Kate sat in apartment 5a.

Jane Tanner in her apartment.

Rachel goes to her apartment.

5 are searching from 10pm approx to 10:10 but if you read the rogs, none of them place Gerry as being with them. He disappears like his daughter & around this same time period the Smiths encounter a Gerrylike coincidental trousers man, uncomfortably carrying a very disabled Maddie twin, dressed in the wrong pyjamas.

What time did the police receive the call to say that Maddie was missing, Spam? and who made it?

[Wonderfulspam]

What time did the police receive the call to say that Maddie was missing, Spam? and who made it?

The GNR logged the call at 10:41. I can't remember, I think Gerry finally appeared at reception with John Hill & the call was made. 40 mins after the McCanns knew she was abducted there was finally effort by a McCann to tell the police about it. Gerry must have had other things to do while Kate was punching walls, wailing about the f..king b........s that took Madeleine & bizzarely thinking about Maddie being cold dressed in her short sleeves & wishing she had dressed her in her long sleeve pyjamas, conveniently. While the sighting of the long sleeved, stiff Maddie was going on. I mean. It's not difficult to work out what's going on there really.

[Wonderfulspam]

If I was Gerrylike man I'd want to get the body far away from the apartment & the immediate search area to reduce the chance if it being discovered by others. So he moves her out of the apartment on the unusually long check. Then moves her again when everyone else is distracted searching the immediate area of the apartment. He headed towards the beach. Maybe he went there first or maybe to a different bin. It's all guess work from there really but the Smith sighting with all its details explains itself really. It's very difficult to counter for supporters or include in an abduction thesis other than to dismiss it entirely & get out the imaginary getaway car.

[Joe Blogs]

The GNR logged the call at 10:41. I can't remember, I think Gerry finally appeared at reception with John Hill & the call was made. 40 mins after the McCanns knew she was abducted there was finally effort by a McCann to tell the police about it. Gerry must have had other things to do while Kate was punching walls, wailing about the f..king b........s that took Madeleine & bizzarely thinking about Maddie being cold dressed in her short sleeves & wishing she had dressed her in her long sleeve pyjamas, conveniently. While the sighting of the long sleeved, stiff Maddie was going on. I mean. It's not difficult to work out what's going on there really.

Right, so potentially enough time for Gerry to walk to the beach area and back again before the police were called then, Spam?
And none of the Tapas seven recall seeing Gerry from roughly 10-10.40 then, is that right?

[Vertigo Swirl]

Right, so potentially enough time for Gerry to walk to the beach area and back again before the police were called then, Spam?
And none of the Tapas seven recall seeing Gerry from roughly 10-10.40 then, is that right?

No, if Spam is right then Gerry would have to have vanished about 9.45pm, meaning he was only a the table for about half an hour after his check before the alarm was raised.  We then have to factor in Matt?s check during that 30 minutes slot.  So it would seem that rather than doing half hourly checks we need to accept that the Tapas group were actually doing checks every 15 minutes though none of them claimed this to be the case on that particular night as I recall.

[Wonderfulspam]

Right, so potentially enough time for Gerry to walk to the beach area and back again before the police were called then, Spam?
And none of the Tapas seven recall seeing Gerry from roughly 10-10.40 then, is that right?

No one from the police ever specifically questioned in any great detail the movements of Mr McCann immediately after the alarm was raised & during the first searches. But as I explained, I can account for the T9's movements immediately after the alarm, but after their first quick run about, not Gerry, he seems to disappear. Matt, Fiona, Russell, David, one of them I think Matt or David has said they should split up & search anyway. It's late I can't be arsed to look in the files again right now but there's a bit about it somewhere .

[Wonderfulspam]

No, if Spam is right then Gerry would have to have vanished about 9.45pm, meaning he was only a the table for about half an hour after his check before the alarm was raised.  We then have to factor in Matt?s check during that 30 minutes slot.  So it would seem that rather than doing half hourly checks we need to accept that the Tapas group were actually doing checks every 15 minutes though none of them claimed this to be the case on that particular night as I recall.

Why would Gerry have to vanish at 9:45? I have the alarm raised about 9:55ish as per Matt & Russell personally. Then they faff around outside the apartment for a bit, then Gerry is missing like his daughter. What time do you have the alarm raised VS?

[Wonderfulspam]

Gerry said it was 10:13 & he wouldn't lie about anything so I guess you have to go with that time VS? Yes/no/Maybe? Can you show your working for how you got the correct time the alarm was raised?

[Joe Blogs]

No, if Spam is right then Gerry would have to have vanished about 9.45pm, meaning he was only a the table for about half an hour after his check before the alarm was raised.  We then have to factor in Matt?s check during that 30 minutes slot.  So it would seem that rather than doing half hourly checks we need to accept that the Tapas group were actually doing checks every 15 minutes though none of them claimed this to be the case on that particular night as I recall.

Why 9.45 if it only took a good 5 minutes to walk from the apartment to the Smith location, Vertigo?
The Matt check is interesting, I used to think, why would Gerry let him check on Maddie and the kids if he'd already moved Maddie to the scrub land? but then it wouldn't really matter if Matt raised the alarm at 9.30 anyway would it? once Gerry moved the body out of the apartment everything was in place, so it didn't matter who raised the alarm or indeed when, Matt, Kate, made no difference, did it?

[Wonderfulspam]

Alarm raised 9:55ish, Smith sighting 10:03 for me. Of course could be 9:54/9:56 whatever but 8 mins to quickly cause a scene & then get from the apartment, recover Maddie then carry her past the Smiths seems enough time for me. Gerry seems to think Kate needed 10 whole minutes to search a tiny apartment though.

[Wonderfulspam]

VS seems to want to scrutinise my theory while never adding the slightest bit of any meat on the bone to hers.

[Joe Blogs]

Why 9.45 if it only took a good 5 minutes to walk from the apartment to the Smith location, Vertigo?
The Matt check is interesting, I used to think, why would Gerry let him check on Maddie and the kids if he'd already moved Maddie to the scrub land? but then it wouldn't really matter if Matt raised the alarm at 9.30 anyway would it? once Gerry moved the body out of the apartment everything was in place, so it didn't matter who raised the alarm or indeed when, Matt, Kate, made no difference, did it?

The Dr Payne sighting of Maddie at around 6.30 is more problematic, if Maddie was indeed alive at that time, that only leaves a good two hours for Maddie to lose her life and the McCanns to come to terms with this and make up an elaborate plan to dispose of the body, certainly no time to do a recce of the local vicinity to look for communal bin sites.
And you would have thought that the neighbours would have heard the McCanns desperate screams and shouting when Maddie met her end? remember the lady upstairs heard Maddig crying the night before!
There's just so much about this case that doesn't really add up for me!